Dear MOM community,
Since we share our devotion to this great, but somewhat archaic game and since we are knee deep into multiple parallel attempts to upgrade this ancient artifact, it dawned on me that it would help both developers and enthusiasts alike to share a little more about our own interests, at least on what other games we like and why.
My attempt here is to start a thread where everyone posts only once, and lists his/her top 5 favorite games in ranked order along with identifying information to avoid ambiguities, such as platform, publisher, developer, publication year, URL. Please think hard about all the electronic games you ever played in your life. Post the 5 games which you like most and you consider yourself deeply knowledgeable about, even very different games from MOM. Post on games that you have known for at least 6 months, so no new flair ups, which may not be stable opinions. Include MOM on your list if qualifies.
I am particularly interested in your evaluation on
A) AI
B) Balance
C) Cheats, bugs, exploits
F) Features of the game which are most valuable or most unique
M) Multiplayer assessment
P) Problems with the game and ideas on how to improve it
R) Re-playability
X) Extra info I must state
This could help us developers in identifying nice features in existing games and consider reproducing them later in MOM. Also, it could help the rest of the community in passing time while anxiously waiting for the few developers to improve this great game.
Here is my ranked list for a start:
1. Battle for Wesnoth: Windows, MAC, Linux, AmigaOS4, and more v1.8.6; David White; 2003-current; http://www.wesnoth.org .
A) AI is moderately poor and generally predictable, but not unbearable.
B) Game is moderately well balanced.
C) Minor exploits and bugs, which are constantly being reported and fixed. No cheating in the game, but can be done in remote multiplayer games.
F) Open source turn based strategy game. Code is being developed by a group of enthusiasts over a long period of time and is still under development today. Anyone can mess around with an already existing, well tested code. Players can contribute with suggestions, which are sometimes being considered and acted upon by developers. Runs on multiple platforms. Excellent single player. Game has relatively simple rules with a great degree of freedom on how to play.
M) Excellent multiplayer options with wide variety of maps, configurations, and settings. Some ways to cheat in competitive multiplayer games.
P) This game currently needs better AI and a reliable, trustworthy competitive multiplayer option, where cheating is very hard. In the current competitive game a few self proclaimed champions (cheaters and rule benders) wreak havoc and scare away scores of honest, but skillful players with their multiple accounts holding on to multiple ranks and careful selection of opponents and making numerous false reports in order to inch up their ranks. Solution is complex, but possible and became increasingly urgent, since now there are funded, prized tournaments.
R) Highly re-playable on multiplayer. Moderately re-playable on single player. There are thousands of maps, scenarios and campaigns. Some are very good.
X) Best turn based strategy game I know for multiplayer.
2. Age of Empires 2 The Conquerors v1.0c: Windows, MAC; Microsoft; Ensemble Studios; 2000; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_Empi...Conquerors.
A) AI is extremely poor and highly predictable.
B) Game is well balanced and no overpowering unit, skill, or nation. Buildings can be placed anywhere which gives major advantage to attacker and is a problem for defensive strategy. Single player games are hard to configure to make interesting.
C) Many cheats are downloadable and can be added to the game, but I do not know any cheats in the game itself, except a checkbox: "Allow cheat". No bugs, no exploits to speak of.
F) 200 population limit allows command of a large army. Each unit takes 1 population. Excellent hot key system. Long, interesting multiplayer games, where every second could be actively played by each player. Wide range of options on what map and what objective to play.
M) Excellent multiplayer option with high variety of choices.
P) It is repetitive to micromanage villagers, which takes away time from other actions, becomes boring, and is an arduous exercise for the wrists and fingers. This game needs better AI, less micromanagement, and a penalty system for constructing buildings too far from base, and increased time to erect buildings.
R) Highly re-playable on an excellent multiplayer system. Not re-playable on single player due to poor AI.
X) The best real time strategy game I know.
3. Master of Magic: Lots of room for improvement, but I skip my assessment on this one. We have this forum already setup and is best not to be discussed in this thread.
4. Impossible Mission: Commodore 64; Epyx; Dennis Caswell; 1984; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impossible_Mission.
A) AI is fairly simple, but in this game it fits the purpose brilliantly. Enemy robots change program from game to game and you have to treat them differently. They are also sometimes able to hide their capabilities until it is too late for you to find out the painful way by either dying or wasting precious time.
B) Game balance is very, very good.
C) No known cheats, exploits, or bugs. Surely you can download and add some, if desired.
F) The game can fit well under 64KB memory and has speech, skill, logical problem solving, and random map generation. Graphics and sound were outstanding for its time. There is a logical problem solving part at the end of the game, which is brilliantly invented and coded. It is simple enough to solve, but does not become trivial even after 500 games being played. The player must pay attention and wastes solving the puzzle, which lowers the final score. Puzzle, room order, robot programs all change from game to game.
M) No multiplayer option.
P) Some rooms are way too easy and become repetitive for an experienced player. Other rooms are unsolvable without use of specially earned “passwords”, which you may not have available at the time you first enter the room. This game is close to be perfect in my view. The only ways to improve it are to program more rooms to play, edit some old rooms which are too easy; and make it internet playable with a universal cheat proof server that saves high scores and allow players to edit rooms, which could be selected by developers for addition.
R) Highly re-playable. High score list makes game addictive and playing a game without death takes a lot of practice, patience, skill, and luck. It took me about a year to win my first game and another year to earn a clean, death free victory. That also did not satisfy me until I earned a truly spectacular score. I admit though that I only had a C64 at that time.
X) The best platform game I ever played. A true masterpiece. This is the game that is closest to perfection as far as design and programming goes, which is remarkable for such an early game. It took full advantage of the available level of technology.
5. Heroes of Might and Magic 3 the Shadow of Death. Windows; 3DO; New World Computing; 2000; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heroes_of_M...w_of_Death.
A) AI is extremely poor, effectively renders single player boring.
B) Game balance problems: some nations and units are overpowered; some spells are ridiculously overpowered and are game winners. Other units and nations are underpowered.
C) Some freezing bugs, and connection issues due to current internet protocols, proxys, and firewalls. Some exploits, such as attacking enemy then running away and using overpowered spells.
F) The game is quite diverse, deep and provides long term entertainment. Takes a long time to learn how to master this game against humans. Pretty good random map generation algorithm. Large number of fan edited maps. Fan organized tournaments.
M) Excellent multiplayer option with random map generator.
P) Overpowered units, nations, and spells must be rebalanced. Random map generator algorithm could be improved. In multiplayer, only the active player can act. The other players should be allowed to do at least something while waiting. Minor changes to rules would be good, such as not allowing buy back of lost heroes, not allowing to move “just hired” heroes, and the battle surrendering and run away rules are very problematic for multiplayer games.
R) Highly re-playable on the excellent multiplayer option.
X) Very good social and competitive multiplayer game for those who like turn based strategy games. More immersive than the Battle for Wesnoth.
PS. Please keep my format on the numbering and stay objective, so I will not need data mining software to find the relevant information in your post. Post your own opinion based on your own vast experience.
Please DO NOT COMMENT on other peoples’ posts, since that would bias this data collection process and could lead to unnecessary debates. Once we have a lot of data then we can decide if we want to discuss further, but I want to keep this thread clean.
Since we share our devotion to this great, but somewhat archaic game and since we are knee deep into multiple parallel attempts to upgrade this ancient artifact, it dawned on me that it would help both developers and enthusiasts alike to share a little more about our own interests, at least on what other games we like and why.
My attempt here is to start a thread where everyone posts only once, and lists his/her top 5 favorite games in ranked order along with identifying information to avoid ambiguities, such as platform, publisher, developer, publication year, URL. Please think hard about all the electronic games you ever played in your life. Post the 5 games which you like most and you consider yourself deeply knowledgeable about, even very different games from MOM. Post on games that you have known for at least 6 months, so no new flair ups, which may not be stable opinions. Include MOM on your list if qualifies.
I am particularly interested in your evaluation on
A) AI
B) Balance
C) Cheats, bugs, exploits
F) Features of the game which are most valuable or most unique
M) Multiplayer assessment
P) Problems with the game and ideas on how to improve it
R) Re-playability
X) Extra info I must state
This could help us developers in identifying nice features in existing games and consider reproducing them later in MOM. Also, it could help the rest of the community in passing time while anxiously waiting for the few developers to improve this great game.
Here is my ranked list for a start:
1. Battle for Wesnoth: Windows, MAC, Linux, AmigaOS4, and more v1.8.6; David White; 2003-current; http://www.wesnoth.org .
A) AI is moderately poor and generally predictable, but not unbearable.
B) Game is moderately well balanced.
C) Minor exploits and bugs, which are constantly being reported and fixed. No cheating in the game, but can be done in remote multiplayer games.
F) Open source turn based strategy game. Code is being developed by a group of enthusiasts over a long period of time and is still under development today. Anyone can mess around with an already existing, well tested code. Players can contribute with suggestions, which are sometimes being considered and acted upon by developers. Runs on multiple platforms. Excellent single player. Game has relatively simple rules with a great degree of freedom on how to play.
M) Excellent multiplayer options with wide variety of maps, configurations, and settings. Some ways to cheat in competitive multiplayer games.
P) This game currently needs better AI and a reliable, trustworthy competitive multiplayer option, where cheating is very hard. In the current competitive game a few self proclaimed champions (cheaters and rule benders) wreak havoc and scare away scores of honest, but skillful players with their multiple accounts holding on to multiple ranks and careful selection of opponents and making numerous false reports in order to inch up their ranks. Solution is complex, but possible and became increasingly urgent, since now there are funded, prized tournaments.
R) Highly re-playable on multiplayer. Moderately re-playable on single player. There are thousands of maps, scenarios and campaigns. Some are very good.
X) Best turn based strategy game I know for multiplayer.
2. Age of Empires 2 The Conquerors v1.0c: Windows, MAC; Microsoft; Ensemble Studios; 2000; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_Empi...Conquerors.
A) AI is extremely poor and highly predictable.
B) Game is well balanced and no overpowering unit, skill, or nation. Buildings can be placed anywhere which gives major advantage to attacker and is a problem for defensive strategy. Single player games are hard to configure to make interesting.
C) Many cheats are downloadable and can be added to the game, but I do not know any cheats in the game itself, except a checkbox: "Allow cheat". No bugs, no exploits to speak of.
F) 200 population limit allows command of a large army. Each unit takes 1 population. Excellent hot key system. Long, interesting multiplayer games, where every second could be actively played by each player. Wide range of options on what map and what objective to play.
M) Excellent multiplayer option with high variety of choices.
P) It is repetitive to micromanage villagers, which takes away time from other actions, becomes boring, and is an arduous exercise for the wrists and fingers. This game needs better AI, less micromanagement, and a penalty system for constructing buildings too far from base, and increased time to erect buildings.
R) Highly re-playable on an excellent multiplayer system. Not re-playable on single player due to poor AI.
X) The best real time strategy game I know.
3. Master of Magic: Lots of room for improvement, but I skip my assessment on this one. We have this forum already setup and is best not to be discussed in this thread.
4. Impossible Mission: Commodore 64; Epyx; Dennis Caswell; 1984; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impossible_Mission.
A) AI is fairly simple, but in this game it fits the purpose brilliantly. Enemy robots change program from game to game and you have to treat them differently. They are also sometimes able to hide their capabilities until it is too late for you to find out the painful way by either dying or wasting precious time.
B) Game balance is very, very good.
C) No known cheats, exploits, or bugs. Surely you can download and add some, if desired.
F) The game can fit well under 64KB memory and has speech, skill, logical problem solving, and random map generation. Graphics and sound were outstanding for its time. There is a logical problem solving part at the end of the game, which is brilliantly invented and coded. It is simple enough to solve, but does not become trivial even after 500 games being played. The player must pay attention and wastes solving the puzzle, which lowers the final score. Puzzle, room order, robot programs all change from game to game.
M) No multiplayer option.
P) Some rooms are way too easy and become repetitive for an experienced player. Other rooms are unsolvable without use of specially earned “passwords”, which you may not have available at the time you first enter the room. This game is close to be perfect in my view. The only ways to improve it are to program more rooms to play, edit some old rooms which are too easy; and make it internet playable with a universal cheat proof server that saves high scores and allow players to edit rooms, which could be selected by developers for addition.
R) Highly re-playable. High score list makes game addictive and playing a game without death takes a lot of practice, patience, skill, and luck. It took me about a year to win my first game and another year to earn a clean, death free victory. That also did not satisfy me until I earned a truly spectacular score. I admit though that I only had a C64 at that time.
X) The best platform game I ever played. A true masterpiece. This is the game that is closest to perfection as far as design and programming goes, which is remarkable for such an early game. It took full advantage of the available level of technology.
5. Heroes of Might and Magic 3 the Shadow of Death. Windows; 3DO; New World Computing; 2000; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heroes_of_M...w_of_Death.
A) AI is extremely poor, effectively renders single player boring.
B) Game balance problems: some nations and units are overpowered; some spells are ridiculously overpowered and are game winners. Other units and nations are underpowered.
C) Some freezing bugs, and connection issues due to current internet protocols, proxys, and firewalls. Some exploits, such as attacking enemy then running away and using overpowered spells.
F) The game is quite diverse, deep and provides long term entertainment. Takes a long time to learn how to master this game against humans. Pretty good random map generation algorithm. Large number of fan edited maps. Fan organized tournaments.
M) Excellent multiplayer option with random map generator.
P) Overpowered units, nations, and spells must be rebalanced. Random map generator algorithm could be improved. In multiplayer, only the active player can act. The other players should be allowed to do at least something while waiting. Minor changes to rules would be good, such as not allowing buy back of lost heroes, not allowing to move “just hired” heroes, and the battle surrendering and run away rules are very problematic for multiplayer games.
R) Highly re-playable on the excellent multiplayer option.
X) Very good social and competitive multiplayer game for those who like turn based strategy games. More immersive than the Battle for Wesnoth.
PS. Please keep my format on the numbering and stay objective, so I will not need data mining software to find the relevant information in your post. Post your own opinion based on your own vast experience.
Please DO NOT COMMENT on other peoples’ posts, since that would bias this data collection process and could lead to unnecessary debates. Once we have a lot of data then we can decide if we want to discuss further, but I want to keep this thread clean.
