[SPOILERS] Serdoa goes to war II

[Serdoa]

Scooter attacked with 6 Keshiks. I can get 2 Archers, 1 Spear in the city, probably losing it but according to combat calculator I should take at least 2-3 Keshiks with me. If I am really lucky, I take 4 with me and he can't take the city. Also I'll have a WE, 2 Spears, 1 Chariot and 1 Archer nearby next turn.

On Commodores front, I tried to attack his city south of the one I took, but I'll have to retreat my WE and Axe as he got a X-Bow in the city (has a spear there already) and another spear is on the way. Additionally a X-Bow is in front of the city I took and another one is on its way. His capital is secured by another Spear + his northeastern city has another X-Bow + Spear. I myself have 4 Archers, 1 GG-WE in the city and will join those with the retreating Axe, WE and Chariot probably. Should be enough to hold this city till I can get some more reinforcements into it.

Lewwyn front is starting to get hot I fear. He has rebuilt the city I razed, but 1W, making it a canal. He also has 1 Spear, 1 Axe, 2 Chariots in the city, so he might very well bring 2 galleys and ship those troops over to take my elephant city. I am researching MC right now, as I need Triremes more then I need LB. Well, not true, LBs would be much better, but I can't reach them fast enough, while I can reach MC in just 3 turns.

Finally Brian settled on my marble city. I could probably raze his city, but I won't do it. I don't want him to attack me as well. Apart from that I don't have enough troops to fight everyone, despite me being first in soldiers (at least after this turn I will be).

In domestic plans, the city scooter attacked (Sigtuna) should have gotten NE + GLib, but there are other cities nearly as good for that (Haithabu, Bjorgvin). They just miss the 4 forests. But if scooter takes the city and razes it, I would have to rebuild Granary and Library, taking enough time that another city without those forests can build it as well. If not someone else builds it that is.

Apart from that, capital is still running 6 specialists and should produce the next GP in a few turns (5 or 6). A GM is stored as I don't want to settle him (that would get us 1 food + 15 commerce / turn). Bulbing Banking would probably prove more worthwhile. Though thinking about it, that may take another 20 turns till I can do it. That would be 300 commerce, while the bulb is 600. But having that 300 would save some turns till I reach Banking as well + would pay off later on as well. Probably should settle him then. Other then that, just producing stuff in the production cities to ship it over to Commodores front. Airlifting to defend right now, otherwise to get stuff to Lewwyns front (another galley should be built in the city up there though as well I think, maybe whipping it to finish a trireme afterwards as well).



And just for information of the lurker crowd: I was made aware of the discussions about me cheating. No I didn't receive any information about the game itself, just that I was called a cheater directly and indirectly by some of the players of this game as well as from some lurkers. That's why I still haven't played the save, because I am considering dropping out.

[novice]

And just for information of the lurker crowd: I was made aware of the discussions about me cheating. No I didn't receive any information about the game itself, just that I was called a cheater directly and indirectly by some of the players of this game as well as from some lurkers. That's why I still haven't played the save, because I am considering dropping out.

Not much of a discussion - one player ranted in his thread some time ago, and almost immediately redacted it. Then recently another player complained about bad luck, which a lurker then extrapolated to a cheating accusation, which I don't think it was intended as. It's just heat of the moment stuff that comes up when players get ROFL-stomped.

I've already acted suitably incensed on your behalf in the lurker thread, no need for you to overreact as well.

[Gaspar]

Yeah, people say stupid stuff when they get frustrated in the heat of the moment - we've all done it once or twice. There weren't any serious accusations lodged and as novice said, he layeth the smacketh downeth in the lurker thread as well.

Go on and curbstomp everyone. It'll be fun.

[Serdoa]

Thanks novice and Gaspar. You see, biggest issue for me now is to play like I would normally. Example: This is the situation right now for Commodore



I could attack with my Chariot into Melville. If the Spear is damaged enough, follow it up by my WE attacking his X-Bow and my Axe finishing his Spear. If not, I simply retreat my troops. Why would I do that? Well

- the Chariot won't be of much help on defense and won't be enough to threaten any of his cities, so its loss is not really all that tragic
- Melville will sooner or later take the horses back, if I can raze it, I don't need to care about the Iron for now
- when the 2nd Spear reaches Melville, he might move all 3 units out to get me (secure it with an archer instead, at size 2 thats whippable with one turn of production); if the join up, he could have in 2 turns already 3 X-Bows and 3 Spears - if he uses those from Dosto even 4 of each) - next to Kipling

Especially the last one I really don't want to happen. Now, what is the cost for me if I attack? First 20 hammers for the chariot for a small chance to damage his spear. If I do, I'll have ~60% odds to kill his X-Bow with my WE. If I succeed I can follow it with my Axe and raze/take the city. Even if I lose, I should damage him enough to kill his X-Bow with the Axe - and the spears alone I don't mind at all.

Now, basically in numbers that means I have a 6 in 10 chance to raze his city. If I don't, I'll still have a good chance to get a hammer exchange I feel is still equal and lastly I have a rather big chance that I'll throw away my Chariot (which I don't need) and simply retreat. Normally quite honestly, I would have already attacked. I mean hey, him losing that city would make my life much easier as it would take away one avenue of attack (and one culture producer, which would make getting those tiles there much easier). And apart from that I'll get at least 3 more units into Kipling next turn, so I can gamble with those a little bit.

See, I really feel it makes sense to try the attack. But I'm also sure that if I win the attack with the chariot (or damage enough and lose it) someone will state that I would have reloaded if I had lost. And if I lose it and retreat, someone probably will state that I only did not reload because it would have been too obvious that I did not take the attack, taking my normal playstyle into account. No matter what I do, now I fear that I'll always get accused of some shit. And thats taking away quite a bit of my enjoyment (and apart from that my decision-making).

[Gaspar]

I had a conversation with someone on this board a while ago about this - I don't specifically recall who. The bottom line is you have to play for yourself. I think this is generally a good community full of interesting people who know how to have a good time together. We're also a community of proud, spiteful, arrogant jackasses. No matter what you do, there will always be people looking to tear your achievements down.

"Oh you figured that out really quickly - must be reading my thread."
"Oh you won a low odds combat - must be save scumming."
"Oh you coordinated well with another player - must be cheating and talking out of game."

And that's just the "nefarious" ones. There's also this set:

"Well, you only won because your opponents were terrible."
"Well, you only won because you lucked into the perfect civ/leader for the map."
"Well, you only won because <insert here> is broken."

Some of these will have some kernel of merit (the latter group I'm referring to only) but at the end of the day, who cares? Did you have fun playing the game? That's really the only reason we should be here. So don't worry about what the lurkers/your opponents/your personal deity think about your play. Everyone's an asshole.

This particular asshole thinks you've played brilliantly this game. And got some good fortune. But fortune favors the bold, right?

Best of luck, Serdoa.

[Serdoa]

Thanks again Gaspar. You are right about that. And therefore I did as you said and carried out what I thought is the best approach -> I attacked his spear with my chariot. Damaged it enough for his X-Bow being the defender against my elephant. Killed the X-Bow (58% odds, I actually had to think twice if I really want to take that battle even that I knew beforehand that those would be my odds), killed the spear, razed the city. Covered Elephant with a archer in case his worker can build a road and let his spear reach me. Next turn, I'll get another 3 archers and axe into Kipling, for a total of 7 archers, 2 WEs, 2 axes. Should hold some time I hope.

And now lets wait for the turn and my city of Sigtuna burned to the ground as well with all 6 of scooters Keshiks still alive.

[Serdoa]

I'll try to make an update tomorrow, maybe I'll find enough interest for it. Stupid I know, but my interest has pretty much gone to null for this game.

[SevenSpirits]

Looked through some back saves and like I posted in the tech thread you are not doing anything suspicious. Good to know, huh?

I did notice you are playing very impressively. I mean it's apparent you are doing something right from your reports but, for example, the unit logistics to get defenders into Kipling, which you didn't report on, were beautifully done.

I hope you keep reporting because you are playing a daring and exemplary game. The artist bomb to deprive one opponent of iron for cataphracts, for example, is just awesome. I'm really enjoying it.

P.S. Who told you about cheating accusations? No one has stepped forward in the lurker thread and it seems this person needs to be talked to about what is acceptable lurker behavior. (Not saying that was a bad choice actually but I believe it merited asking permission in the lurker thread.)

[Serdoa]

Thanks Seven. Good to know that at least not everyone feels like I'm cheating just because I take risks. Btw: Last turn I lost a WE when I attacked Lewwyns spear at ~30% odds. Killed his chariot with my chariot afterwards at 20%. Got my second GG that way. Surely another sign of me being a cheater... or wait, maybe I win some of those low odds battles because I take them? I mean, out of 10 battles at 30% odds, I should win 3. I think some are forgetting that.

Regarding those unit logicistics, they are actually one of the parts where my pick really shines, as it would be simply impossible with 2-move-galleys. Quite happy with the Vikings tbh. Probably would be even more happy with Aztecs (not sure if Brian still hasn't reached CoL, otherwise he should easily be able to whip himself back into this game imo).

As for the one who told me about the accusations, it was a friend of mine who is as far as I know not registered here. I doubt he'll "step forward" (he started reading here mainly because I told him all the time about the game) but right now he won't for sure, as he is travelling.

[Serdoa]

Overview-screen (Big)

As can be seen, Brian is south of me, Lewwyn northwest, scooter northeast and Commist east, southeast.

As for the actual overall situation: I don't think scooter realizes how much the city razing really set me back. The city he razed was my planned GLib-city, which had Granary and Library already in place and actually should have built the GLib in the next 4 turns. I would have it by now. Instead I need to use my capital now, meaning I work less specialists then I should. I also had to whip the city nearby the one razed to get a spear for security, delaying the Library there by at least another 4-6 turns. Additionally I need to secure that front now much more, costing me another several precious hammers. And I am reluctant to invest them into spears, as I will obsolete them soon.

So yeah, that really really hurt. What hurts much more then the razing though is that I thought already the last 10 turns before the attack that I should get a chariot there to scout and fogbust, so that no one can move on me. But I didn't get to it, forgot it every single fucking turn and had that chariot sit in another city doing nothing. Even more annoying is that I forgot that Keshiks move through every terrain with 1 movement point. I had that feeling that I don't like that corner next to my city and that something bad could come from there but I never pinned it down to "fuck, Keshiks could move quickly through there, giving me only 1 turn to react". Oh, and to top it off, I would have had 1 Archer more in the city if I hadn't stored overflow by building wealth. Initial plan was to use that overflow for an archer because I had a settler on the way and that would have been his escort. But then I realized I could shave a turn off GLib if I saved that overflow for it instead. Uh, well, didn't work out so great. Oh well, I'll have it in a few turns anyway if nobody snags it.

But the game came around to help me a little bit. First, I finally razed Lewwyns island-city. I lost a WE last turn against the spear there, but the spear was down 1.x strenght. I had a chariot which I used last turn to kill his chariot at 20% odds and which was now due a promotion. With that promotion I got 72% odds against his spear. Of course I took this battle and won, razing his city. He might be able to reach my chariot with another spear next turn (I expect it) and kill it. If so, I'll have an Axe ready to retaliate. A WE is also nearby and a settler is getting produced. If I can settle a city there it will probably get a LB or two as defense right away + some Triremes in the water to actually block him from coming at me.

Secondly



popped Gems. Thats great as I still haven't settled for them. Silver would of course have been even better as I think there is none on this map but I won't complain. It is slightly annoying as I am going down from 20 to 19 hpt in that city (bad for the Forge) but with the additional happy I might be able to work an engineer there.

In slightly worse news, Lewwyn is finally settling for Ivory



I would stop him if I could, but I can't. Commist won't (and can't imo) and scooter is - again - the big winner, as I suspect Lewwyn to come for me. Thats actually one of the most annoying things in this game, scooter is left alone from all of us. Or at least I think thats the case looking at his food graph.

Lastly, my defenses in Kipling



6 Archers, 2 WEs, 1 Axe. I can get another 2 WEs into the city next turn + another one the turn after and whip another archer (+produce one) as well if necessary. What it might be, depending on Commists movements. He has a potential attack force of I think 6 X-Bows and 2 Spears. They should not have odds (my Archers have 25% fortify + 80% culture defense + 50% city defense = +155% = 7.8 str imo. His X-Bows should at most get 6.6 str. And in a few turns, I'll have LBs in here as well + taken his Iron. Going to get Knights before I take his cities.

Victory screen



Demos

GNP is good despite having fired nearly all my specs, except for 4 in the cap. Break-even research is still around 120 bpt. MfG is still very high, I guess because I do not need to work cottages? No clue tbh. I certainly don't have more cities then scooter and I expect Lewwyn and Brian to have as many as I do.

Crop is sad. Would be at least 20 more if he hadn't razed my city though and I still need to whip pop away right now (Forges in the production cities, Courthouses everywhere soon). Still, I hope to catch him in a few turns when I settle a few more cities.

And thats it for my birthday update. Any questions?