Need Experts Help, can you help me win?

[Catwalk]

That was actually Sullla going the extra mile to be polite

I appreciate you trying to report without screenshots, but keep in mind that your audience has a limited attention span. Try to condense the report into the minimal amount of information needed for us to get an impression of your game, such as early resource allocation and tech plans as well as habitable planets in range. Trying to recreate screenshots using words only will be too much hassle for us to follow. I don't think you need Windows XP to run MoM on DOSBox, which OS do you have?

Your situation reminds me of a kid I was teaching to play pool. He was pretty good, but he insisted on learning snooker first. Snooker is a much harder game, and as a consequence he had to spend all his focus on making the balls because of the pocket sizes and the distances. Had he been focusing on pool earlier, his game would have evolved more naturally as he'd be able to focus on ball control and position play at an earlier time. As it happened, he became a very good technical player but his game understanding took a long time to catch up. It's all about the feedback you get from your actions. Right now you're getting potentially misleading feedback, especially concerning stuff like galaxy exploration and diplomacy. You "learn" to neglect exploration and run a farmer's gambit, as you can reload your way out of diplo problems. That's a highly skewed game approach, and it will bite you in the butt. For example, it surprises me that you don't consider Research + Fleet + Preparation + Small battles to be part of the early game.

Risk management is critical, and if you don't get in the mindset of learning that right away then the other mindset might settle. It's not too late to turn around!

In your report, you should focus almost entirely on just listing your actions. I skipped all the rest and went down to those. Present those as briefly as possible, and it might be possible for us to give you feedback without screenshots. And again, it's going to be difficult for us to comment specifically without screenshots or a save. Also, I assume that your ECO bar is at minimum needed unless specified otherwise. So that information can be left out.

Spending your first 2t building scout ships is a big mistake IMO. You don't need the information that quickly, and due to compound interests that's actually a very large amount of resources you're throwing away. It's also a waste of resources to scrap your existing scout ships, although it looks like you ended up not doing that. I would build a single scout ship after a few turns and then another one a few turns later, depending on the layout and your exploration schedule.

I also think that you sent too many colonists to Kronos. I've seen various guides on population optimization thrown around, it looks like you're following one of those. Keep in mind that they're not complete optimization models, IIRC they ignore transportation time and industrial levels. EDIT: Just wrapped my head around your calculation, and sending 15 colonists does indeed seem to be about right. I thought that you had somehow managed to send 33 colonists, which would have been overkill

[HegemonKhan]

in general, what are the guidelines that you experts use, of when to build a fleet? do you just build the original ships, or do you take time to research ship tech? how many ships (a.k.a. how many turns) do you build? And what type of fleet too? (obviously, this stuff can vary depending on your target and-or game), but in general and-or in ignoring your target, as in what is best in of itself, what do you experts do?

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I'm providing as complete information as possible, to simulate having the game file, so you guys can better help me. Sift (not a typo, this is a real word, as can be seen, http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sift ) through what you need to help me, you don't need to read all of it, and it only takes like maybe a minute only to scan through what you want to read about and what you don't.

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That was actually Sullla going the extra mile to be polite

Well, I *AM* a newbie, that's why I need you guys'-gals' help-input, lol. Direct empirical facts is quite straight forward, but rarely can ideology, philosophy, and macro strategy be empirically tested for, and changing these views are extremely difficult to begin with, as they're much more deep-ingrained in you, as it is often directly how you think, which is extremely hard to change. But, provide me with that direct empirical facts-data, and I'll change my ways+thinking immediately, otherwise, I'm very stubborn, heh.

Though in my defense (I'm not a total newbie... I hope, lol):

Is it more beneficial to do the "Research + Fleet + Preparation + Small battles" for a single planet of the A.I.'s, when whereas I can instead be getting maybe a few "free" (uncolonized) planets with colony ships (+Propulsion Tech researched), in what is commonly called (and often used due to superiority) the "REX" (Rapid EXpansion) and Early-Beginning phase of many different games (as in other games besides MoO, as in, all of the turn-based games, like the Civ games, for example).

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as to others' problems of "short attention span" (or in more blunt terms: the progressive stupidification of humanity), that's their problem, not mine.

Off-topic:

if interested, here's an excellent discussion-debate of whether humanity is becoming more stupidified, and also whether it is because of soundbyte media+politics and its tech:

http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/FutureofRea

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My reports will definately get more brief, as I was just giving the huge amount of starting information (as you may also be able to spot differences between the Mac version and the pc version, for example)

point taken about the Eco bar, that can definately be left out, my bad.

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I'll update soon with more (and more accurate) info of turns, but for now, in quick glance some things I've noticed (I could be off by a bit as I'm going from memory):

I am able to build my first colony ship (after maxing factories+population at Home Star Fierias) at Turn 30, when I use those first 2 Turns for building the (cheaper remade) scouting ships (my "S1" Ships) and using the 2nd planet at 3 Parsecs away. what I do is send colonists off (+XX, +3...) to the second planet until it reaches the minimum of its max pop growth (= ~ max pop / 3), and then I send colonists (+3, unless the 2nd star has a lesser max pop, I don't know where the line is, which I've noticed causes it to only grow at +2 or +1, and not +3 when using the ~ equation of max pop / 3, so can anyone explain why this is going on?) back to my Home Star.

I'll do a test myself to see when I get the colony ship built if I use those first 2 Turns to build the factories, to see how much I'm hurt by using those first 2 turns to build the scout ships as I do.

I think the earliest I've gotten my factories+pop maxed at my home star is on turn 20 (and then the +4 turns to build the colony ship). is this the best (soonest) possible, or no? (or can you build a colony ship before turn 24, by building it before you've got your factories+pop maxed? if this is possible is it better to do this, getting your first-built colony ship out sooner but having weaker prod/research with your home star, or is it better to get the better prod/research and have a bit later first-built colony ship? in general anyways, as I know this can vary depending on your game too, obviously.

The Psilons do tech fast, so the reason I like to get all non-colonized planets with scout ships, is so they may not be able to colonize the hostile planets that they got the tech for (though, now that I'm thinking about it, if they got the hostile tech, they might be making colony ships with weapons anyways, and thus rendering the scout ships as blockage-blockade useless... meh... (well, against the Silicoids I have more merit to this argument of mine, hehe)

Also... I've been doing a replay of the game... either I'm replaying it better... or they've choosen a much more poor tech selection... or done whatever worse... as they're not doing as well in this game... argh!

Also, ALWAYS, they get 4 total planets colonized... on like... before turn 20, and 6 total planets by turn 30, and there's nothing I can do to stop this (they got a great location), while I can't even get my 3rd planet yet.

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P.S.

from the "Race Rankings" thread:

If you build two colony ships without any research, you're already too late IMO. Planetology gives huge discounts on the cost of colony ships. I almost always get either IT+10 or IER before my first colony ship, I think your overall economy grows faster that way. You may get your first system a little later, but I think you'll get your third and fourth systems faster. If all I get is Controlled Barren Environment, I'll usually build the first 2 colony ships without it (unless I can only colonize crappy planets).

"If all I get is Controlled Barren Environment, I'll usually build the first 2 colony ships without it (unless I can only colonize crappy planets)."

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yah! I did-do this in my game, hehe. At least, I'm doing this right, laughs. (Jokingly-being silly) See, we agree on at least this thing, hehe.

I got some quite hurtful techs (for the early game) missing... sighs.

Also, in general, I like to get the +pop, eco res, and-or RIW techs after I got 3 colonies, as then I feel they become useful.

Do you agree or disagree with this? what is your general guidelines for what to do in the beginning game?

(and yes, I'm surprised that the early game isn't strategy-tactics "mapped" out already.... as to what's the best to do... lol. This would be really helpful, for everyone. If all the different "build orders" were tested, to see-know what gives the best results-start for the early game)

if you were playing by yourself (with no other race-faction-rival), obviously (I think, lol) it would be best to get any combo of these techs before you get your 3rd planet.

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P.S.S.

I also think that you sent too many colonists to Kronos. I've seen various guides on population optimization thrown around, it looks like you're following one of those. Keep in mind that they're not complete optimization models, IIRC they ignore transportation time and industrial levels. EDIT: Just wrapped my head around your calculation, and sending 15 colonists does indeed seem to be about right. I thought that you had somehow managed to send 33 colonists, which would have been overkill

yes, I only sent *14*, not 33, (nor 15), lol. sorry if my equation wasn't clear.

47 (current pop of home star at this time-turn) - 33 (= 100 max pop of home star / 3) = 14 colonists to send from home star to the 2nd colony

[Catwalk]

Short attention span has nothing to do with stupidity. We're hanging out here for sake of amusement, and to the extent that we volunteer to help others we expect them to show some respect for that time commitment.

Given that tech trees are randomized and nearby planets vary wildly in value, it's very difficult to make a one-size-fits-all opening. I maintain that researching either IT+10 or IER before the first colony ship (or the 2nd at the latest) is beneficial. When to get a range tech varies immensely depending on the map.

My rule of thumb early on is that factories pay off better than a colony ship. I once had some math to halfway back up this claim, feel free to consider it an unfounded statement. A colony ship becomes a good investment when you run out of population for additional factories.

It is very common to build a fleet of 20-50 fighters quite early on, depending on neighbours and map layout. It's often not very difficult to maintain a claim on uncolonized border planets, the AI won't usually send as many ships to those. And after you do colonize it, it's critical that they don't manage to orbit your planet as that will automatically trigger an opportunistic invasion.

Also, did you seriously ask for empirical data on being better off if you don't reload?

[HegemonKhan]

Short attention span has nothing to do with stupidity.

wrong. it does directly and indirectly. directly is too hard and long to try to explain, so I won't. indirectly, in that you don't take any time to learn truth-facts, to check with high sceptism. try watching the vid of the link, as it explains this more. also, in the vid, the animated lady neurologist concurs with me that you are wrong, so do you know better than her with a ph.d. in neurobiology, who teaches at whatever pretigious university she's at? "Deep Reading" = "Critical Thinking" = Objectivity/Comprehension/Analytical (Lawyers-Law, Logic, Philosophy, English Majors, etc) = literacy = intelligence, and thus the lack of this, is stupidity.

and to the extent that we volunteer to help others we expect them to show some respect for that time commitment

Are you implying that I've been rude (unrespective of your inputs)? if anyone remotely has been rude, it is you in the form of arrogance-elitism-haughtiness-snobism-etc, which are quite rude qualities towards others. just because you might be better at this game, knowing more, in no way gives you any sort of right to be demeaning and condescending in your posts to me.

So, can we go back to being on-topic, about the game, helping me beat these psilons in my game?

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I maintain that researching either IT+10 or IER before the first colony ship (or the 2nd at the latest) is beneficial.

what about the construction tech, RIW (reduced industrial waste) or whatever it is called? is this not as good as the 2 planetology techs? or you just forgot to list it with them (a simple mistake merely)?

for me, (albiet, only-almost entirely from playing the easiest difficulty, and only 2 games at impossible), +range (propulsion tech) almost always seems to be the best and-or needed 1st tech choice... sighs. I do fully understand the power-vitalness of the main techs like eco res, +pop, RIW, and some others too. so we agree here, but I find myself always having-needing-optimized into getting a +range tech first.

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It is very common to build a fleet of 20-50 fighters quite early on

could you elaborate on what "quite early on" would be? like when? the very first thing you do (before maxing factories+pop)? after you max factories+pop? after you built all the colony ships you can? after you got X tech? when?

also, this sounds like its for a full race-faction-opponent game on the smallest size galaxy, which is helpful for when I get to doing them, but what about my current game, of only 1 opponent?

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Also, did you seriously ask for empirical data on being better off if you don't reload?

what kind of question is this? as best as I can understand, it seems to be I guess in some weird way a flame bait. but really, I'm just outright confused by it.

assuming, you're asking exactly (verbatum) what it reads:

then yes, that's the point I was making, such an ideological-philosophical-macro strategy question of to reload or not, has no empirical data for it, hence my point (which is, the absurdity of it) I was making.

as to my asking for empirical data:

I was refering to everything, to in-general, as I can't debate empirical data, my point is that the more empirical data you use, the 100% more convincing (converting) your input is towards me, lol.

[novice]

RIW reduces waste-related costs by 20%. IER reduces waste-related costs by 50%.