Heroic Shout

[Nelphine]

I'm inclined to agree that resurrection shouldn't be uncommon arcane. I could see very rare arcane but only in addition to uncommon life, as I think it's a nice theme that life focuses more on heroes via resurrection and then incarnation and then enlightenment. However, I understand any hero strategy regardless of realm often implies getting attached to a particular hero, and being able to bring them back after disaster strikes is appealing, which is why I'd put it late game for arcane. (Expensive rare arcane may also be appropriate.) Casting cost could stay as described (i like the variable cost idea) even if the late game arcane version was implemented - meaning despite wanting a higher research cost, I don't want a higher casting cost as well.

[Seravy]

Yeah but if it's late arcane then what's the point? By then the hero will be obsolete and without Heroic Heart it's guaranteed to not survive nor gain levels.

[Nelphine]

Oh, I'd do it for the players who love that one hero and have used it for a fair amount of time (whether that's your dwarf from turn 30, or your chaos warrior from turn 120), but who then lose that hero by making a bad mistake (like attacking a stack that turned out to have invisible sky drakes in it, or attacking a chaos wizard who finished researching doom bolt the turn before and unexpectedly killed your hero). Then they can get their favourite hero back.

I wouldn't replace heroic heart with this, no.

[Seravy]

Yeah but we don't have free slots then.

[Juffos]

I've always thought that Resurrection was for recovering experienced heroes. Rather than having a universal resurrection spell I'd prefer hero offers being more common to make the low experience heroes more expendable. This would allow all colors play with heroes, but high experience heroes would be Life's trait what with Heroism, Enlightenment and Incarnation.

[Nelphine]

I think that's one reason summon hero cost had been reduced a significant amount. So you can get more heroes early if you have bad offers.

[Juffos]

200 skill or so is still too much (in my opinion) for a chance at a useful hero. I could get guaranteed 4 spiders or 3 gargoyles instead of the possibility of being offered some useless hero.

I cast summon hero once in my current lunatic chaos halflings game just to get some lab space, as enabling random items overfloods it with semiuseful crap. Luckily I got the Magician, which made the spell well worth due to my lab being full of +5 and +10 spell skill items.

Which brings me to the frustration of being given trinkets from lairs, what would you think about a 75% rebate from grinding trinkets down?

[Nelphine]

Trinkets?? Like misc items? Please give them to my games! I never get enough misc items, it's always Wands and staves and swords and maces. Over and over. I hates weapons I hates them!

[Juffos]

Trinkets, like items in general when you're not playing a hero strategy.

Now that I think about it, 75% is too good. 66% might be better.

[Nelphine]

Um, ok, so all items? You still have heroes, and even if you don't have a single retort or spell for Heroes, you can still make heroes that singlehandedly win the game just from those items.

But more particular, if items were worth more, than upgrading items for Hero strategies wouldn't cost anything. You'd get too much back from the item being replaced. And any change in price, could bring back the days of people who literally used the artificer retort because you gained MORE mana from selling an item than you spent making it. Bad times.