WW11 - Civilization

[uberfish]

Cyneheard (3) - Meiz MJW Tasunke
Ichabod (2) - Jkaen Novice
Novice (2) - Gaspar Mardoc
Catwalk (1) - Sareln
Jkaen (1) - Catwalk
Lewwyn (1) - Cyneheard
Mardoc (1) - Rowain
Rowain (1) - Scooter
Scooter (1) - Lewwyn
Zakalwe (1) - Slowcheetah

Not voting - Ichabod, Selrahc, Zakalwe

[Cyneheard]

I find it interesting that Cyneheard has not commented at all on the accusations by me and MJW. I'm not saying there are clear answers that you could give, but you've ignored them completely. Are you hoping they are simply forgotten as the time passes by, since you have only one vote on your back? Sorry, you're still one of my top suspect :neenernee.

"I'm sticking to my original RP Gaspar vote because I don't see any other clear suspects yet, but let's keep talking, and not just about MJW."

Why do you need to underline the fact that you are still voting for someone, while not adding anything new to the table?

The "Not just about MJW" was my attempt at contributing: it looked to me that MJW

Also, since I thought at the time that MJW's arguments and actions were just causing a mess and overwhelming discussion, I ignored some of what he said for that reason (although MJW's proof of his ability to lie on the roleclaimed changed that calculus a little; I'll try to pay a little more attention to what he's saying).

Why did you feel it necessary to create a big list of players who have not posted, when the game had been going on under 3 hours?

My thought process there was a bit of . It started out OK: first it was me thinking "let's point out that it's early b/c it's crazy to think that this MJW thing is a done deal and the only thing to worry about." I'd just wanted to say "N out of 17 people hadn't posted." Then, to get a count of who it was, I ended up with the list of names, and didn't think about why listing the names instead of giving a count was going to be seen the way it was. I wasn't trying to accuse the people who hadn't posted of being too silent, and I didn't think that was what was coming across? At worst it was "start testing the waters of one of them, because we don't have any reads on them yet." But I wasn't explicit about my goals/purpose, which was definitely on my end. And it was too early to go into that type of thing.

I was also completely forgetting to internalize that even though for me it was a lazy Saturday morning/afternoon, that wasn't the case for people in other parts of the globe. I'd completely missed that this was a 72 hour day as well; the comments of an "extra long" day didn't sink in as being anything more than 48 hours. It was a boneheaded move, but I'm not sure how a boneheaded move --> I'm obviously a wolf instead of boneheaded move --> I'm either a bad villager or a bad wolf?

I thought about this earlier and wondered why Cyneheard has not picked any votes besides mine and MJW's. There's definitely good enough excuses for at least one of the NAP to throw more fire to this (assuming that MJW isn't one). Maybe it's because the big bandwagons are trying to divert attention away from him? *tinfoil hat*

I'm not sure I follow?

In conclusion I think it's more than likely that the bad guys have more pressure on staying active, especially in the beginning of the game where you can basically just talk and not present any serious accusations. That's how I felt as well when playing a wolf in different forum. So far Cyneheard and Catwalk seem to have the biggest need to stay active, even when they would not have much to add

For the most part, except for Lewwyn reading weird at that point (haven't had the chance to reevaluate), I haven't had good reads on people to contribute.

I'll have to look things over again to talk about other people. Right now my apartment smells like solvent from some maintenance work, so I'm going to head out for dinner and then look at it to contribute more about who's striking me as bad/good/whatever later this evening.



Also re: Scooter (I think?) about me bringing up WW10 too much.
When MJW was being his noobish self, I mentioned WW10 because I was seeing the same "stupid villager taking over the show" that I pulled there:

Then there was the joke by Zakalwe about my post being really ironic, which I found too funny not to comment, and then Zakalwe got confused by my post, so I had to explain it AGAIN.

[zakalwe]

Diplomatic Advisor: Chief, I'm afraid we have a problem!
Shitting Bull: What is it? Is the hardwood going soft? I swear I polished that wood until my arm was cramping!
Diplomatic Advisor: Not that... the league of nations are grumbling. They don't like your leadership style.
Shitting Bull: What? But I've been so mellow and nice! I just called the commie thick, but let's be honest, he had it coming.
Diplomatic Advisor: Yeah... it's kind of the opposite, really. They want someone more critical, inquisitive, confrontational... grumpy.
Shitting Bull: Ah, I see... You mean we should send our special emissary?
Diplomatic Advisor: That would seem prudent, yes. Time for some BS.


Blind Squirrel here, checking in! I have come to save the day with my super effective patended brand of scum hunting.

So let's get right down to business and lynch Mardoc. (My predecessor calls him Priceless Marmot, but I do not speak in riddles.)

My turn to convince you? Only there's the minor issue that I don't know how. I could...present insightful targetting analysis, like the 'Mardoc's fears' analysis in WW3 .

Or I could get mad about having more time to spend with my PBEMs, if you decide to lynch a weak villager. But I'm not sure that would hurt the village, really, except in the sense of a wasted day. I thought my extensive lurking might give me hints as to what to look for, but it's not helping so far. None of my gambits are working, probably because people know better than to follow my lead

I suppose I'll just keep talking; in WW3 that eventually convinced people I was innocent (although I don't know why, exactly), and it's better to be eaten than hanged. I'm to the point of being afraid to survive to the end and experience deja vu, though.

You're afraid of surviving to the end? Why even sign up. I call BS. (Well, you called me, but there you have it.)

PS. Novice: Why did you move on from Scooter?

[Mardoc]

Finally, addressing scooters concern on my lack of posting:
I'm new to the game and relatively new to the forums, I didn't want to take the lead and didn't have much of a read on people earlier. I didn't really want to cause too much damage and lead people off on complete tangents due to an inaccurate reading of the situation. I also seem to have the 'newbie out of jail free card' so I felt relatively safe not posting very much and having my vote be for a purely RP random reason (Rowain for different religion).

Eh? The goal of the game isn't survival, it's wolf killing. You don't have to be alive at the end to win, so long as the wolves are somehow caught. In fact, usually village MVP's don't survive, but they take down enough wolves with them to be worth the sacrifice. You only want to survive in the sense that if you let people lynch you, they're not lynching a wolf instead. (all assuming you're actually a villager here).

If all you're going to do is watch, then you should just be a lurker, not a player.

Anyway, voting [strike]novice[/strike] doesn't seem to be achieving much of anything, he didn't even comment. I think I'm going to go back to indulging my suspicion on Tasunke, for voting Cyneheard before having a reason to. Only no one else would help me with that, so next best is scooter for defending Tasunke.

Also, a general call - Ichabod, Selrahc (sort of zakalwe) - we're down to less than 24 hours on the day. Vote for someone! You don't do us any good leaving the pressure off.

[MJW (ya that one)]

I need to think about your post cyneheard. If like it I'll probably switch over to tasunke.

[Mardoc]

You're afraid of surviving to the end? Why even sign up. I call BS. (Well, you called me, but there you have it.)

Simple. If I survive to the end, it's because I was, again, totally clueless. That's a feeling that hurts.

Why sign up? Because I thought I'd learned something from lurking.

[scooter]

Mardoc, you've gone from me being guilty enough to vote for me to me seeming innocent back to me being guilty several times, and all of these changes came for questionable reasons. What's the deal? Can you really not make up your mind, or are you more concerned with voting for noncontroversial targets so as to not draw too much attention to yourself? Seems like you're acting more in the interest of self-preservation and "safe" lynches than actually trying to nail werewolves.

[Gaspar]

What a nothing day. I'll as ever have to wait for zakalwe to get curious about novice to find anything out about him at which point Meiz and Rowain will get interested in the conversation. You Euro's play the same damn game everytime. :P

On that note, Ichabod feels a little WW7-ish to me.

[Tasunke]

I need to think about your post cyneheard. If like it I'll probably switch over to tasunke.

Why not switch over to Lewwyn? I'd certainly help you with that, and while I'd be willing to trust your judgement that Cyneheard is acting wolfish, I feel that Lewwyn is acting wolfish (perhaps more so).

Either way I wouldn't mind voting as you do, but Im certainly not going to help you vote for ... myself

[scooter]

By the way, here's the thing about Cyneheard. He just makes too many odd comments to be a wolf. From my perspective, wolves tend to be MUCH more careful about their posts than villagers. Most of the time when people jump on a "wolf slip" it's a villager who accidentally worded something bad rather than a wolf who didn't think well enough about his post. My hunch with Cyneheard is that if he played wolf, he'd be more careful about his posts, and he wouldn't have this much suspicion over a few minor things that came out weird.

History bears this out by the way. In MOST of the werewolf games, the guys who get into the spotlight early are almost always villagers who say something stupid. There are of course exceptions, but it's a generally true statement, because a villager's aim is to find werewolves, a werewolf's aim is to not be detected.

Please do notice in all of these sentences I've been using the word "most"... I'm making generalized statements that hold true the majority of the time, but I'm NOT saying it's true 100% of the time because a logical wolf counter is of course to try to break the "rule" if we think it's a hard and fast rule. My point is simply that I don't think Cyneheard would've said things that seemed "off" if he was a wolf focused on not getting caught rather than a villager focused on nailing wolves regardless of self-preservation. My point in all this is - no way I'm voting Cyneheard today - he seems more likely than most to be innocent.