[SPOILER] - Suboptimal finds trees, still seeks forest

[CFCJesterFool]

First off, I can sub whenever so no worries there.

I have to disagree on all-in though. Mashed needs to build settlers (once Magnus is re-established) non stop for the most part. After Fondant finishes ancient walls, the encampment is the priority. Pindicator can't beat you and you don't need more pitati archers right now. Hasselback is a good candidate for building another horseman after the builder finishes. Alhambram, on the other hand needs to be prepared for. This means you need to keep up in city count, secure a Great General whatever it takes and have your units earn promotions grinding down Pindicator.

From my time playing the turns this is my perception...

The attack on Res Publica has been successful in pulling troops away from WoN. The goal here should be to kill units, gain experience and not lose our own troops if possible. We don't have to conquer the city just siege it and farm experience on the pitati archers. Positioned correctly (holy site and tile 1 SW of holy site), the pitati archers can take a shot from city walls and retreat safely due to the terrain and them having three movement. We need to have a horseman on the wine tile and the plains tile opposite the wine tile to put the city under siege. Be patient.

The path to WoN is almost clear. The battering ram is on the way. Pindicator probably doesn't suspect we have a swordsman yet. WoN will face two pitati archers, a swordsman and Maris Piper when we move in. The horseman will be right behind. I don't see how we fail to take (and raze would be my inclination - that is why we have the Ancestral Hall) WoN. We use the roads that are already in place to threaten CoP pretty much immediately. That is why it is critical we don't take unnecessary damage at Res Publica. Our combined forces from both theatres will overwhelm Pindicator.

[suboptimal]

I saw your post after I had played the turn. Res Publica we're currently in line with - as you'll see below the city is under siege and I've started to attack it (one horse, two archers) though we have a bit of company from the SW. Units are on the way to WoN. Having said that...

Turn 77

Back in the saddle. I see immediately on the save selection menu that we’re in the Medieval Era, at least on the tech and/or civic trees. Open the save and take a look around to get familiar with what’s going on and look at areas not featured in Jester’s reports. The main notification is that Alhambram has built Stonehenge and founded Weedy Movement (see PBEM 2 for background on that one).




I also look on the diplo screen. Alhambram currently has DoF’s with all three unmet civilizations:




His pact with Pindicator, however, is over. Down at Khmer a Khmer horseman and a barbarian warrior have made an appearance:




That complicates things slightly….that horseman complicates things a little bit. If I attack the city with the yellow-lined horseman then the horse and warrior can combine forces and kill it. I can, however, hold position for the time being. I fortify in place, shift the archers one position to the south and move the green horseman to the wines. This puts the city under siege and reveals a second barbarian warrior en route. The green horseman attacks the city for 33 points of damage and 6XP. Both archers attack the city. The southern one has a promotion pending and I’ll use that to heal barbarian damage in a turn or two. The archers add on another 38 points of damage to the garrison. I may or may not be able to take the city next turn with these units.

Over at Fondant the eastern archer shoots the Khmer warrior for 46 points of damage. I could kill the warrior with Maris Piper but instead I jog SW to see what, if anything, is garrisoning Wealth of Nations. The answer is a warrior. I move back to the NE for the time being. Swordsman moves for the volcanic pass and horseman follows. I’ll get the two units stacked up in the NE so that the horseman can move into the jungle and attack from there. I think neither unit will get there in time and that I’ll need the battering ram in position to get anything done. Speaking of which, that unit moves to the tile NW of Fondant. Builder mines the hill that was chopped last turn. The archers in the south of the valley advance as there’s nothing in the way right now.

Next turn Recorded History completes and gets us a governor promotion. We also have one coming from the Ancestral Hall in two turns. I think that I’ll pick up a third governor (Liang) after the attack at Res Publica – if we take the city we’ll need her there so we can leave Magnus and Pingala in place. The promotion from Ancestral Hall is going into Magnus.

In terms of builds, here’s where we’re at:

Mashed: Ancestral Hall finished in two, settler has one turn left, Magnus establishes in 4 turns. We need to put two turns of production into something else. Builder or archer?

Fondant: Walls complete next turn. We can build an archer or chariot in 5 turns or a horseman in 6 turns. Given the location I think the horseman build is the way to go. It'll be quicker than having Hasselback complete the builder and then build a horseman. Unless, of course, we want to delay the builder.

Hasselback: Builder completes in four turns. After that it’s likely a chariot or an archer (or a second ram, maybe?).

Dauphinoise: 5 turns until the Encampment completes.

Civics I’m going to go Games & Recreation → Military Training. Techs are Engineering → Machinery and Engineering may boost-complete next turn or be finished normally the turn after next.

[CFCJesterFool]

I hope you promoted Maris Piper. You should have moved (like you did to check the garrison) and then moved back and promoted. You don't want to save promotions unless absolutely necessary. Saving promotions negates the double experience gained from attacking (Kabul suzerain bonus.) Maris Piper needs to get to tier 4 (Expert Marksman i.e. 2 attacks). Promote to Emplacement (+10 CS when defending vs city attacks.)

You need to kill units before taking Res Publica. Crusade is no joke. Hate to see the units at Res Publica get wiped out due to a tactical mistake. Crusade is worthless without military units to counter attack with. Get the city to zero health and maintain the siege. If you worry about city walls going up then raze the city. Also, I think your original idea about promoting Pingala to +1 science per population will help more (against Alhambram) than a futile attempt at keeping Res Publica by appointing a governor. The best way would be to just capture both R P and CoP the same turn but that might be difficult. Also, if the barb warrior attacks R P and captures it the city will be razed so that is another consideration as well.

Mashed: either is fine but I would consider the shortest build time since finishing the build will delay settlers. I think we're down ~5 cities from Archduke (check empire score to see what I mean.)

Fondant: Rather the encampment but horseman if not.

Hasselback: finish the builder. Improving the tile yields will speed up any builds following. Still think using the last charge for a forest chop at Dauphinoise to finish the encampment/(barracks)/granary is the way to go. If you feel like more military, focus on pitati archers or horseman. Chariots are worthless until later (when we are nearing the time to upgrade into knights.)

[suboptimal]

Nope, forgot to promote Maris Piper, will take care of that this turn. At Hasselback I like horseman...it's not the fastest build time but it gets the horse to the front faster. Turn report in a bit, needed to let a windows update complete before playing the turn.

[suboptimal]

Turn 78

Open the save, Recorded History is complete. We have a full-on hoe-down at Res Publica:




Neither of the horses have been attacked yet. I’ll get back here in a bit. You’ll see that there’s another volcanic eruption notification. Hamp’atu is at it again, and this one is a doozy:




Yeah, we need to get a settler up there. That’s a 22 tundra tile. A settler 1W of the sheep gets river and good food tiles. I think our settler has a new destination as it would put the iron second ring and expand quickly. Do we send the settler under construction or send the one after that up there? I think we might go there first to get the iron. Lurker thoughts?

With the available policy change I take a look at our situation. We’re currently second in the Great General race (16 points to Alhambram’s 36, Cornflakes’ 6 and everyone else’s zero). I’m going to leave Strategos slotted. It is time, however, to take Urban Planning out and put Natural Philosophy in for +5. If the lurkers don’t like this, let me know (and why) and I’ll consider undoing that next turn. Military policies stay the same. Pingala gets the Researcher promotion. The screens don’t update correctly but we’re now at 32.7 per turn. Engineering will complete after this turn and Machinery is down to 6 turns. I start Games & Recreation, that completes next turn.

Dauphinoise has grown in population and the new citizen is working the diamond mine. It’s at 6/7 housing and 32 turns to growth, so I move the citizen on the nubian pyramid tile over to the unmined diamond. I’m doing this to enhance our income as we’ll want to be earning as much as possible for eventual crossbow upgrades. The extra also takes a turn off the Encampment, so that will now complete in three turns instead of four. At Mashed the Ancestral Hall completes next turn. I’ll put two turns into a builder, finish the settler and then finish the builder. The builder can put in another diamond mine at Dauphinoise and then do a chop-and-mine into a settler on the PFH east of the Campus. The timing works that we should be able to slot Colonization just prior to the chop to get 100% into the settler. With the mundane stuff done it’s time to shoot things. To Fondant:




City starts on a horseman build and the builder moves for the bananas. It’s joined by the battering ram on the Campus. Pindicator’s warrior has promoted and taken Tortoise. That’s OK, more XP for the archer over that way. Maris Piper checks the city (still a warrior garrison), moves back northeast and takes the Emplacement promotion (+10CS defending against city attacks). The horseman moves to the open tile 2NE of WoN’s city center. I leave the swordsman where it is for the time being. As for the archers, well, I rename them Yukon Gold (western) and Red Pontiac (eastern), then move both of them southeast into the jungle, Red Pontiac first. I’ll start the city assault on Wealth of Nations next turn with the four units in attendance. Potshot Pindicator’s warrior for 28 damage and 8XP; that archer will earn a promotion on its next attack. The current position:




Next turn I’ll attack the city with two archers and the horseman, and bring the swordsman down to the horse’s current posiiton. Yukon Gold will move southeast. The turn after next I’ll shift the archers counterclockwise and attack the city with Maris Piper, the horse (from the jungle) and the swordsman.

Returning to Res Publica I’m going to use the barbarian warriors to my advantage. The western one places the city under siege even if the archer moves northeast. Both archers shift northeast and shoot the horseman, killing it. That means I don’t promote either archer for the time being but the biggest threat to my units is now dead. The southern horseman has a problem, though. It’s currently CS 38 on defense (well, 41 if I get the defense bonus on Pindicator’s turn) and at 55 damage. If it stays there I might lose the unit to the barbarian warrior (of all things). Therefore I need to move it...somewhere. I decide to move southwest to the plains forest southwest of my current location. That gets me two things – out of the way of getting the unit killed and a likely promotion next turn as I expect the barbarian warrior to attack. Of course, that leaves the northern horseman exposed to attack, even in its fortified position. It would take a CS 20 ranged, CS 20 melee and CS 18 melee. The numbers say that if it only has a +3 fortification bonus it’ll take about 45-50 damage total. Sixty will kill it. If the walls go up, though, the horse will die. I decide to retreat the horseman to the pasture across the river so that it will live to see next turn. Not ideal as it takes the city out of siege for the time being, but better than losing the unit. The end of turn position:




Out at Australia I decide to start bringing the archer west towards Conquest of Paradise. It might not make it back in time to do anything useful but it will defog the entire area east of the Khmer capital.

[CFCJesterFool]

1W of the sheep tile (on plains hill) is a great spot (can eventually place a +5 campus third ring). Re-direct the settler, iron is that important. I think it is time to make a final dotmap for up north and place down the city center markers (numbered for settling order.)

It might be a good idea to have the idle un-promoted warrior at Fondant head back to Mashed for barb defense/settler escort duty.

[suboptimal]

I'll look at the prior dotmaps and then crank out a new one tomorrow.

Regarding a settler escort I might be able to 2-turn a warrior out of Mashed. With the lack of iron I should be able to build a warrior and the city has 21 per turn when building units, IIRC.

[Banzailizard]

I think Natural Science was the right call. You need to close that science gap, your production is fine. Put another way 5 science is far more useful than 5 production at this stage. Honestly you might be able to keep WON at this stage. Pin does not seem like he has enough units to handle both flanks.

[suboptimal]

Keeping Wealth of Nations is not a matter of military power. It's a matter of loyalty. What might help is that Fondant is now 4 pop instead of just 1 pop, so that might counter CoP's loyalty influence a little bit. Might have to check the loyalty strength on settlervision in the EoT save to see what my chances might be.

[suboptimal]

Dotmap Time! Option One:

This is similar to the preferred dotmap from the last time we looked up here. The settlement order is noted.

City #1: +5 Campus, +2 Commercial Hub, ignore the Harbor marker as I wasn't thinking when I put that dot on the map. Would buy the iron on settling and the 3rd ring Campus location later on. It would culturally grab the wines first. Builder would mine the iron, pasture the sheep and chop the tundra forest into something (monument to speed cultural growth?)
City #2: +4 Campus, +2 Comm Hub. Builder would farm wheat, chop & mine a forest into something (Campus? Monument?)
City #3: +2 Campus. Builder chops the forest for the Campus into something, chops the Aqueduct forest into something else, mines the grassland hill to the NE. It should be noted that by shifting both districts adjacent to the volcano the Campus becomes +3 (+4 with the Aqueduct) and the GFH's can be chop-and-mined.
City #4: +2 Comm Hub, Encampment, +4 Campus. Frontier city, lots of choppables for district completion. Would need to buy the 3rd ring Campus location.

Option 2

City #1, #2 same as above.
City #3: Shifted NE 1 from Option 1. Campus is +3 (+4 with Aqueduct). Has more food in the first ring (two 3 marshes) and sheep is available for pasturing.
City #4: This location opened up by shifting City #3. +3 Campus (+4 with Harbor). Campus could shift 1E to be +4 (+5 with Harbor)
City #5: Settling into the unknown. Other than the +4 Campus in the third ring I don't know what else I'd put up here. Could also plant on the rice to go coastal and then build an Aqueduct on the floodplain (or city marker) but that puts the a bunch of high yield/choppable tiles in the second ring.

These options also do not include any settlers sent into (former) Khmer lands, be it resettling WoN, another river valley location or elsewhere in that direction.

Also checked loyalty at WoN -- it'll probably still be a challenge to keep the city in the face of loyalty pressure.