[PB64] Amicalola Gets To Heaven with Tarkeel and Ljubljana

[Amicalola]

T236
Ginger offers 400 gold, most of his treasury and a little over half of what we gifted him. I interpret this as a consolation prize, because he's chosen to attack Commodore instead of Naufragar; he took their border city this turn. Grumble grumble. At least it's something. But this turn, Superdeath attacks him after converting to Serfdom - I wasn't expecting that!  I'm not sure if it's a real war or not, our scouts are long dead. Meanwhile, we found Armourland amidst the ruins of the southeast.  



On a personal note - state election was today, results currently being counted now!

[Amicalola]

T237
Commodore accepts our white peace offer and SD 'gives' Cherry back for 20gpt. 


I whipped four banks, since we're about to start losing a lot of money.  

Superdeath razed two of Ginger's cities, so that war is looking pretty real.

[Amicalola]

T238
Um, yes daddy.  


That actually finished the tech too, wow. Our first consequential event of the game, but boy was it a doozy! 

I've also been planning something for a few turns that came to fruition:


I don't think Yue Chi actually contributes much to Nauf's empire, but it's something, and there's probably a morale hit there too. Also 100 gold, or a turn of income.* We also won the hammer trade 180:255 through some (finally) good luck, winning three 60% fights in a row!

*Dont, uh, don't look at our income being 105gpt the turn after I whipped four banks. Our expenditures are 460.

[Amicalola]

Naufragar offered peace. We did not accept, because he presumably wants it to go finish the job against Ginger. 



Last turn I offered Superdeath 80gpt for Software Newman and declaring war on Naufragar, cancelling their OB money... he accepted!  That looks really expensive, and it is, but I view it like this: Superdeath has 16 cities (well, 17 when I offered, but whatever), and Naufragar has 14. So if we assume something like +2 commerce for international routes, that's 32 commerce lost for Naufragar and 28 lost for Superdeath; if we assume +1 commerce then it's still 16 for Nauf and 14 for SD. The reality is probably somewhere in between. Then when you add multipliers in, and remember it's for 18 turns (a number I remember from somewhere?), that starts to add up. Plus we get the city back, and this is a much better city than Cherry, plus Naufragar will presumably be pretty ticked off. I think it was worth it. 

Naufragar threatened Cherry with 19 knights, so we had to move units in response. I also had a question for Charriu/lurkers: if I put units on this tile, do they get 50% defensive bonus, or 25%? In other words, do forts work if they're in enemy territory? 




Demographics: 


We reclaimed our MFG 1st! Now to do something about our GNP approaching last...

[Charriu]

Forts in enemy territory only work for the enemy.

[Tarkeel]

Last turn I offered Superdeath 80gpt for Software Newman and declaring war on Naufragar, cancelling their OB money... he accepted!  That looks really expensive, and it is, but I view it like this: Superdeath has 16 cities (well, 17 when I offered, but whatever), and Naufragar has 14. So if we assume something like +2 commerce for international routes, that's 32 commerce lost for Naufragar and 28 lost for Superdeath; if we assume +1 commerce then it's still 16 for Nauf and 14 for SD. The reality is probably somewhere in between. Then when you add multipliers in, and remember it's for 18 turns (a number I remember from somewhere?), that starts to add up. Plus we get the city back, and this is a much better city than Cherry, plus Naufragar will presumably be pretty ticked off. I think it was worth it. 

Almost. Foreign trade routes get a peace bonus of 3% for every turn you've been at peace, for a max of 150% after 50t. Assuming a base tradevalue of 1.0 (Size and distance less than 11) and 25% capital connection bonus, you need 75% peace bonus to get a 2c traderoute which takes 25t to accrue. For cities with harbor (+50%) you only need a 25% peace bonus, which is 9t, but those cities will also go to 3c when peace bonus hits 125% after 42t.

All of this goes out of the window when cities are larger than 10 and more than 10 tiles (as civ counts it) distant.

[Amicalola]

Great, thanks to both of you for the info. Charriu, do enemy units get city raider bonus when attacking a fort even if the defensive unit is not benefiting from the fort?

Tarkeel, I think that bodes well for us. Their cities should be far enough apart to have far-away bonus, so hopefully we cut off even more commerce.

[Charriu]

I tested that. So if you occupy a fort in enemy territory, the fort is ignored for all defensive purposes as well as promotions, both City Garrison and City Raider.

I did another curious test. What if you fight in another neutral players territory. Wenn you fight in/against a city bonuses and promotions apply. But fighting in a fort in this scenario does not apply the bonuses. This call for a curious civ player.

[Amicalola]

T241
Here is the Everything Empire, after the Second Great Resettling. In the picture, you can see me trying (and failing) to remember how to use Flying Camera. 


We are still mostly building units for now. It's hard not to, with Naufragar and Naufragar jr. Commodore existing. But we will probably transition these to wealth soon if possible. 

Random events have not been the only swinging factor in this game - two players have popped new metals so far. 




I can only complain so much about this, given that we're working plenty of windmills. But still, grumble grumble grumble.  

I'm still not really sure how we outscale Fin/Org Naufragar in the late game, nor how we can militarily defeat Commodore + Naufragar in the short/medium-term. I wonder in retrospect if I should have just started whipping like mad once Commodore signed peace and tried to overpower Naufragar, but against 22 cannons + whatever he whips I don't know if that was likely to succeed either. We also didn't know we'd finish Military Science this quickly. I've hit a bit of an ennui patch here. I also can't quite believe that this game and (my) PB66 are still ongoing simultaneously.

I'll have to ask Naufragar if he considered building the AP, and why he chose not to, after the game. I'm pretty sure this would have ended a long time ago if he had done so (and for that, Naufragar, I'll never forgive you  ).

[Mjmd]

I mean with how much everyone has been at war, finding hammers for wonders is hard!