CoM II : Halfling race overhaul

[ksasaki]

Agree with Seravy's thought, I am one of those "minmax" kind of players who once has found the optimal plan will continue to do it again and again.  "Treasure finding" ability would indeed be too powerful.  I already focus my picks almost exclusively on an early rush / treasure hunting build because I feel that's the only way to play on Lunatic.  If you try to peacefully develop alongside the AI they will far outpace you in research and power.

[Cruel100]

I like the idea of including bluish gnomes as a new race. "Smurfs".

[massone]

Knowing treasure rewards is far too overpowered, for spells or unit abilities. Aside from the fact that the player will be able to rush the books/retorts much faster...it also means the player can deliberately target the Very Rare rewards before the turn count for them is up, which converts them into random books and retorts.

On the topic of aggressive goblins, that should be an entirely separate third new race. The central issue this thread is trying to solve is that Halflings have both the research bonus and a bunch of other traits. There are a necessary niches to fill for both the Lucky high figure race, and the research race which are both relatively unique in the game.

In general, I think that all races should have lots of unique points, players need a reason to play them, and preferably ways of playing the same race with multiple realms, and not being totally locked in to one style.

Regarding the number of units I proposed in Faeries, I think that the research race has the MOST reason to have many units available and especially very unique units, out of any other race, both from a lore perspective and game balance view. They're the most curious/open-minded/rapidly advancing race, so why shouldn't they have a lot? A "peaceful" research race is not necessarily supposed to win by Spell of Mastery. They are supposed to win by having a tech LEAD over everyone else as time passes, whether that means their magic becomes better, their units become better, or straight SoM.

If you look at the current "late-game" races, the one that is closest to the idea of "turtle until ready to steamroll everybody else" now is High Men, because of their early resistance weakness and decent late-game units and economy. But they've been given the role of the religious Life race and Paladins were nerfed from base game, so they don't actually have the strongest late-game units, and most of their unit variety is in mid-game. Elven Lords are a lot stronger than Paladins even after Holy Bonus now. They're also not really a turtle race because their early game isn't bad at all, with bowmen and cavalry, and thanks to cheaper builds, it's faster to rush for Fighter's Guilds that unlock the Pikemen and Crusaders.

I believe that there is a need for a race that properly fills the role of turtling and difficult play until a big payoff, but the payoff should not just be spell of mastery. More importantly, peaceful doesn't mean peaceful throughout the entire game. The turtle is supposed to overtake the careless rabbit at some point. It doesn't go off on a different path. SoM isn't even relevant until the very end of the game, so the main appeal of the research race should be gaining access to more powerful spells sooner. And because the race turtles, it won't conquer to access to other races' military units, so it should have plenty of its own even anyways.

The key thing is that despite having many units, this race needs to be somehow difficult and complex to play. Their units shouldn't just be stronger, or different-flavour-copies of other races' advanced units, but instead require complex strategies to use well, as befitting the research theme.

[PakSteve]

I have a pretty good idea for the new halfling unit then. What we really need is not reducing enemy movement (that helps tho) but to be able to cast our good Sorcery or Chaos combat spells, then escape (which reduced movement helps with, but only a little).
Probably should be a fighter's guild unit that also requires one other building.
Cost should be about double the normal bowmen. Lower figure count guarantees if you can build up a decent army that isn't relying on combat spells to win then you'll still use slingers instead of this.

Adventurer does relate with the being curious theme and explain why they would have the extra hp (as an adventurer they are supposed to be tougher).
Guaranted fleeing as a mechanic also fits a tactical gameplay. As for building requeriments I would like to suggest Ship Wright's Guild to promote the adventure themed unit but that would limit the unit availability so it would require some serious thought. I think it has to be a 80 or lower production cost building (to follow the Human Knights example, of a racial unit with the same cost as habeldiers and thus requiring a "simple building").

Adventurers should have 4 figures for flavor (like the LoTR heroes) and reflecting that it's rare to find halflings willing to leave home. I like the idea of this unit being more suitable for exploring and infiltrating nodes and lairs, while most of their comrades stay home.

Perhaps instead of guaranteed flee, they have a "hide" skill. In combat only, allows the Adventurer to switch on invisibility, but cannot move or attack in this mode. This would give them a chance to wait out a battle and improve survivability, without adding stats. It might be fun to play "cat and mouse" with the AI during tactical combat.

Due to the way the AI performs a random search when facing invisible units, this would be more effective against one or a few units rather than a larger number of units. Also more effective against slow moving rather than fast units. Fits the theme of outwitting a boss unit by using trickery and stealth.This would be weaker than the Nightblades' ability since it would not hide the unit on the overland map, and does not allow movement to avoid detection.

A few other suggestions: Adding Leadership skill would also reflect their folk hero status. Some help with mobility like Forestry would also help them outmaneuver stronger enemies on the overland map.

[htester]

Hello, ParkSteve. Welcome to forum!

-Leadership is exclusive for heroes.
-"this would be more effective against one or a few units": this usually happens on easier lairs but for them you don't really need a Fighter's Guild unit. Adventurer's will almost always face situations when they are outnumbered (so probably they will be discovered)
-Try to type your message outside the quote's box or it looks like I wrote the whole thing xD

[PakSteve]

Hello, ParkSteve. Welcome to forum!

-Leadership is exclusive for heroes.
-"this would be more effective against one or a few units": this usually happens on easier lairs but for them you don't really need a Fighter's Guild unit. Adventurer's will almost always face situations when they are outnumbered (so probably  they will be discovered)
-Try to type your message outside the quote's box or it looks like I wrote the whole thing xD

Thanks for the advice htester. Will do!

[PakSteve]

Hello, ParkSteve. Welcome to forum!

-Leadership is exclusive for heroes.
-"this would be more effective against one or a few units": this usually happens on easier lairs but for them you don't really need a Fighter's Guild unit. Adventurer's will almost always face situations when they are outnumbered (so probably  they will be discovered)
-Try to type your message outside the quote's box or it looks like I wrote the whole thing xD

Would a hide skill be more balanced (or less exploitable) than an automatic flee? I am guessing it depends on how it is set up. I can see a scenario where you have inflicted some casualties on the enemy, but don't have the firepower to finish them off, and so go into hiding to try to wait them out and fight another day. The risk of losing the unit would still be there, which means you would have to be judicious about repeating this trick turn after turn for a slow attrition strategy.  Maybe this would help preserve the high value unit after losing some swordsmen or slingers in a tough fight.

[PakSteve]

Gnomes
Honestly the only race that currently have a technological unit (or in another words a research themed unit if that makes sense) would be dwarfs - steam cannons and golems. Gnomes would be somehow similar to that I think (not on traits but on units).

Goblins
The only lore I remember that portraits goblins as being a smart and technological race is warcraft. Usually their civ is more tribal like trolls.

My suggestion:
After some brainstorming I had the following thoughts:
1. What race could be research based without being similar to dwarfs?
2. If they aren' t going to have similar units as dwarfs or some tech based unit (considering steam cannons, golems and even apprentices), what racial unit could this race have?

1. Besides traits, another main reason to consider picking a race is the racial unit which really embodies the style of playing of the race (Barbarians build collosseums, humans cathedrals and so on, buildings that you only pririotize if you are playing with them). Besides  Amplifying Towers and gold/food (granary, aninimist guild and farmer's market) buildings, virtually all other advanced buildings (by advanced I mean a building with more production cost than markets- 80) unlock a racial unit of some kind. It would make sense if Sage's Guild did the same. I could take into account Alchemist's Guild, Miner's Guild and Oracle but they don t really promote a reasearch focused style of playing (although they could inspire the design of other races).

2. Using my "building-racial unit" theory, Sage's guild as an inspiration and  "Race 2 : ... no barracks". I suggest a race with a intemerdiateunit between priests and magicians: druids. Druids could use the power of nature to summon a creature similar in stats to hell hounds and war bears and also benefit from the Sage's guild theme without being tied with a "tech" based unit. Not only they could provide relevant ranged damage without being screwed with magical imunity but also a melle unit that could do somethings without barracks and war collegues. Also they would make an awesome pair with
the new halflings: the best buffed guys (I mean they have LUCKY for GOD'S SAKE) and a fantastical based race. If summoning a creature is too much of and advantage they have another hability intead: shape changing. Shape changing would allow them to be similar to javelliners: good ranged damage (equal to priests) and when the enemy gets close they would change shapeand engage on melle.

I know that druids are more of class than a race so basically anyone could be a druid. I suggest one more human based race (not because I like it - I would prefer Satyrs or something like that) but because we could mix human sprites (barbarians, nomads, high men) without the need to create more pixel art.

Here are some ideas for technical themed units to round out the races:

Alchemists Guild:
As an alternate to the Druid, how about an Alchemist? It would be more in line with the technologist theme of the goblins and gnomes. (BTW I would be stoked to play both of these races!).  They specialize in throwing potions with spell like effects- a weapon-destroying acid (shatter), a sticky polymer (web), Greek fire (fire bolt or fireball) etc. with the spells selected to balance out the race's capabilities. 

Mechanicians Guild + Sages Guild: 
An alternative form of artillery, such as a a Lightning Gun or Arcane Cannon (magic rather than physical attack). Removes the wall crushing capability thus making more defensive in nature. Can re-use the steam cannon sprite.

Mechanicians Guild + University: 
War Wagon - Vehicle that has double speed on roads, slow mobility elsewhere. First strike, cause fear, maybe a ranged attack. No idea where to get a sprite for this.
Clockwork Crawler - Multi-legged mechanical walkers. Reuse the Giant Spider sprite, colored grey. Can hold the high armor/high hitpoints role that would otherwise be out of character for the gnomes/goblins units. Possibly give it fire breath or cause fear for color.

Miner's Guild + University:
Gnome Sappers, Goblin Saboteur, or Subterranean Drill: Has Destroy Walls and Merge capabilities, but not spectacular combat stats. While this would be a nod to a conquest style of play, it would take up one one of your stack slots just to breach the wall, and so would be a trade-off.  If catapult/cannon was swapped with a magic ranged weapon (as per above) this would be a later game build as well. Sappers/Saboteurs may be easier to implement by using other halfling sprites. 


Sages Guild + Alchemists Guild: 
Grenadier or Bombardier, who has a limited number of fireballs/firebolts to throw. Can fulfill the defender role like wizards with a technical theme.

[htester]

Would a hide skill be more balanced (or less exploitable) than an automatic flee? I am guessing it depends on how it is set up. I can see a scenario where you have inflicted some casualties on the enemy, but don't have the firepower to finish them off, and so go into hiding to try to wait them out and fight another day. The risk of losing the unit would still be there, which means you would have to be judicious about repeating this trick turn after turn for a slow attrition strategy.  Maybe this would help preserve the high value unit after losing some swordsmen or slingers in a tough fight.

The automatic flee is supposed to be used like that: build 2-4 adventurer's at least -> Attack 1-2 times -> Kill a unit or two -> Retreat. As adventurers are supposed to clear lair, nodes etc they almost never have the power to finish the enemy in one go. Against wizards is not that awesome as they would die to low save spells like confusion and blacksleep and even web prevents them from retreating. Invisibility is a rare tier mechanic so is not that trivial to grant it to a Halberdier tier unit.

[roarmalf]

On the subject of technology themed units for Gnomes:

I like the idea of a flying bomber unit, I don't know if that's doable/easy enough to be worth it from a programming standpoint, but a Ornithopter style bomber that can only attack adjacent units with their ranged attack (or suffers max range penalty beyond 1 square) could be interesting tactically.