[SPOILERS] Serdoas thread

[Serdoa]

Ok, lets run it by the numbers first:

GNP:

1. Maya 18 (8 Palace, 1 Center, 1 Free, 4 Esp, 4 Culture)
2. HRE 18 (8 Palace, 1 Center, 1 Free, 4 Esp, 4 Culture)
3. ??? 16 (8 Palace, 1 Center, 1 Free, 4 Esp, 2 Culture)
4. India 16 (8 Palace, 1 Center, 1 Free, 4 Esp, 2 Culture)
5. ??? 16 (8 Palace, 1 Center, 1 Free, 4 Esp, 2 Culture)

1 in front of me

MfG:

1. ??? 4 (2 Center, 2 Tile)
2. India 4 (2 Center, 2 Tile)
3. ??? 4 (2 Center, 2 Tile)
4. ??? 4 (2 Center, 2 Tile)
5. ??? 4 (2 Center, 2 Tile)

1 in front of me

Food:

1. ??? 4 (2 Center, 2 Tile)
2. India 4 (2 Center, 2 Tile)
3. ??? 4 (2 Center, 2 Tile)
4. ??? 4 (2 Center, 2 Tile)
5. ??? 4 (2 Center, 2 Tile)

1 in front of me

Soldiers:

1. Ottoman 6000 (2000 Warrior, 4000 Wheel)
2. Maya 4000 (2000 Warrior, 2000 Mining)
3. India 4000 (2000 Warrior, 2000 Mining)
4. ??? 2000 (HRE?)
5. ??? 2000 (Inca?)

1 in front of me - Maya

Land Area:

1. Maya 14000
2. ??? 6000
3. India 6000
4. ??? 6000
5. ??? 6000

1 in front of me - NOT MAYA

Population:

1. ??? 1000
2. India 1000
3. ??? 1000
4. ??? 1000
5. ??? 1000

1 in front of me

Approval Rate:

1. Ottoman 85% (6/7*100)
2. ??? 83% (5/6*100)
3. India 83% (5/6*100)
4. ??? 83% (5/6*100)
5. ??? 83% (5/6*100)

1 in front of me

Life Expectancy:

1. India 90 (9/10*100)
2. ??? (9/10*100)
3. ??? (9/10*100)
4. ??? (9/10*100)
5. HRE 87 (7/8*100)

none in front of me

Exports - Imports:

1. ??? 0
2. India 0
3. ??? 0
4. ??? 0
5. ??? 0

1 in front of me

Doh, now I am really confused.

First: Population, Food, MfG and Exports-Imports do not help right now.

In GNP either Ottoman or Inca go before me when it's a draw.
Soldiers Maya goes before me.
Land Area either Inca or Ottomans go before me but only one of those.
Approval Rate either Inca, HRE or Maya go before me but only one of those.
Life Expectancy I go before all others (!)

So as Maya goes before me in Soldiers but not Life Expectancy this means there is some randomness. And we can be sure that Maya has 90 Life Expectancy too, because otherwise we would have 90,90,88,87 = 88.75 on average. And 89 Life Expectancy is not possible right now.

So I guess I close this case for now, it might be that someone is able to tell who is who but I am surely not the one. Though if somebody finds out how it works, let me know please.

[Serdoa]

Ok, and another interesting thing (well, at least for me):

I am currently trying to get a better idea on the map. So, according to turn 0 victory screen my 6 land tiles equal 0.40% of the land area. That means that 15 tiles equal 1% or 1500 equal 100%.

So we have 1500 tiles of land area. This post from Sullla indicates that STANDARD size donut maps have 1500 land tiles, though we are on small. So I have to find out now which maps are bigger then that, have the options for temperate climate and high sea level and start with 1500 land tiles normally - because I would now assume that the map was not altered heavily in terms of tiles (or maybe but then on a 1 for 1 basis, taking only as much out as given elsewhere back). I mean no map maker would put in exactly enough more tiles to get to 1500 from whatever number before... or would he? If he knows that the map starts with whatever he could certainly do it on purpose - but then, all that effort for one or two players who would know which map is played a little bit earlier? Hard to believe.

Well, anyway, first I have to find that information about the map scripts... and that might very well be an impossible task for me as some of the other questions already have shown.

[Serdoa]

Ok, after searching for some hours I found one resource about mapscripts. But only about the ones with vanilla civ4, written by Sirian. So, therefore I looked at the XML files, finding out that the info is not stored there. Therefore I started looking at the python-files for the different maps. And at least I can find the grid sizes there. Now I only need to work through them to see which maps are not big enough on small to have 1500 tiles (for now I do not matter about if that includes the water tiles - if it cannot be big enough for 1500 tiles with water, it sure can't be without).

So, no time to do that today, probably starting tomorrow evening on it. Though I also have to provide you lurkers with some pictures, put a table up to track the demographics data and maybe refine my micro-plan. Basically extending it to turn 30 and try to get the greater goal done: Pottery (there is a site which I think screams for it, though I have to scout it a little bit more but I need it to keep up with the planned expansion anyway), The Wheel, Fishing, Hunting techwise, 3 settlers, 6 workers, 4 axeman, 2 spearman... ok, I guess I will have to reduce those numbers a LITTLE bit - well and I will have to scout first maybe to find out where I could settle.

edit: One last thing I should not forget: 1500 land tiles do mean 300/player. In PB2 they had 166/player. That means much land per player, no matter what the map-script. And also we have barbarians on. Many tiles for barbs to spawn on I assume, though I still found not exactly out how the work - but I guess it is enough to know that there will be barbs and many of them. Only thing to keep in mind: We might have islands or even continents to expand into and be not so much seperated at the start.

[Serdoa]

Ok, shortly before work, Turn3 Victory Conditions



So, we own now 14 Land Tiles, giving 0.94% of total land area. Thats then 1489 total land tiles. So, if I am able to calculate correctly my 6 land tiles before gave 0.402955003 (and then my calculator does not have any more place available). That means we are really NOT sitting at exactly 1500 land tiles, therefore at least I do not have to go on searching for a map with exactly that amount of land tiles. And from my view on the maps yesterday, I think there should not be THAT many which can provide those many tiles at all.

And now I go to work.

[Serdoa]

I guess I did something wrong with the demos. I thought soldier points would be rounded to the next 1000, so either it would state 3000 or 4000. Well apperantely that is not the case and therefore it should state 3500 as average on turn 3. Now, it does state 4000 as average, times 4 gives 16000. We have highest with 6, lowest with 2, that leaves 8000 to be distributed amongst the other 2 players. Each 4000? Or one with 6000, one with 2000? No clue right now.

What I do know is that I either got the soldier and tech points wrong (but I was told that the guide on civfanatics is up-to-date) or that something got screwd up somewhere. Now, that could either be wrong starting techs or wrong starting unit. And I have no idea how to find out which of the two.

So, life did not get easier with that

On the other hand, I was told today that Demos do have a clear order if there is a tie. And I could later also find out that regoarrr also posted about that in one game. So, lets look at that and ignore Soldierpoints for now.

I am only ranked first in Life Expectancy. Only one does have a lower one then all others, being HRE. I already calculated that we do have to have 90, 90, 90, 87 as life expectancy because

90, 90, 89, 87 is not possible, because 89 seems for me not achievable right now - 7/8 gives 87.5 ~ 87, 8/9 gives 88.8 ~ 88 and 9/10 gives 90.0.

90, 90, 88, 87 gives 88,75 rounded down to 88. And as the average is 89 that can't be.

So, I go before all others - only HRE might go in front of me (what would make sense as the should have a higher player number then I, playing after me).

Seems I will go again over the numbers today in the evening.

[Serdoa]

Ok guys, you know what? You could have TOLD me, that somebody is researching a tech where he get extra beakers for

Well, you could not because it would be spoiler info. But wrapping my head several days around that only to find out that I was not thinking enough kind of hurts.

[Square Leg]

Much more amusing to watch you bash around in here over it!

[Serdoa]

I guess so I can see the lurkers in their thread, all going :neenernee towards my stumbling on the demo screen.

[Square Leg]

How long to you plan to track the demog's for? Just the initial turns or are you planning on doing a lot of C&D work?

[Serdoa]

I am really not sure Square Leg. That probably will depend if I do more mistakes like the ones I've done already or not.

To be a little bit more clear: Before I saw your post I had started thinking about which stats I want to track. Score seems a given, Power also. Pop I am not so sure about. I guess it gets complicated with several cities per civ. And if I did nothing wrong regarding the land-tiles available, every civ should soon have many.

Techs I will also try to track as we all will probably not so soon go for Alphabet in a NTT. But GNP itself?

I probably will go on for some turns from now, try to find the best way to track all that stuff so that it is actually helpful and as soon as I see that something is not helpful at all, I will stop.