[SPOILERS] Dip4 Turkish Delight: scooter dies first

[regoarrarr]

Gaspar I disagree

T/A can work well too as long as Turkey sticks to the sea and Austria to the land. Plus that way when you stab him just build a bunch of armies when you get builds and he doesn't

TR is good too - there's a reason they call it the Juggernaut of course.

T/I works too if you can find an Italy dumb enough to fall for it

[Gaspar]

When I said we don't have a lot of options, I meant in terms of this game where MJW is super crazy and Rowain is clearly plotting against us. Certainly other ways for T to succeed than being R's bitch, its just the most straightforward.

[scooter]

Sent this to Rowain (Austria):

Rowain,

Wasn't able to catch you yesterday, but I wanted to drop in today. Getting anywhere with the neighbors? Hope you've been able to successfully decrypt MJW.

So obviously we had our share of fun last game and you probably really don't want me to win 2 in a row, but I think we'd be silly to not at least consider that working together could be the right choice. It would eliminate your need to rely on the erratic MJW, and from what I know, TT is every bit as willing to stab as the two of us are, so I don't see a whole lot of difference in our other options on who to work with. I don't think us lining ourselves up as enemies from day 1 is super healthy either, because all that does is let Russia hold all the cards, and I think that's a little too dangerous.

So I guess what I'm trying to say here is I'm pretty open to actually giving things a shot. I realize you may just need to play it safe in S1901 regardless, but I think it's short-sighted to rule out an AT alliance of some sort. I think we can agree not to pretend we were both looking elsewhere, given that we didn't communicate with each other at all yesterday and word on the street suggests we were not both silent to everyone else . Anyway, would like to hear your thought sometime.

Thanks,
scooter - Turkey

I really am on board with pushing things with Twinkletoes, but I was completely silent all day to Rowain yesterday, and I think that was a mistake. The message is actually genuine in that I don't think an AT here is totally impossible just because "fun times with Rowain" was a persistent theme last game, but at this moment I'd prefer to just throw in with TT and hope for the best.


I'm going to reply to TT here pretty soon and confirm our interest in the deal. I think I'm going to request that his fleet is disbanded no later than the end of 1904, and he can decide which turn between now and then is the most ideal time for him to do it. I think that's a fair request in the interest of not keeping it vague. If all goes according to plan, that fleet will not really be useful by then. I could ask 1903 instead which may be a little wiser, but I'm afraid of asking too much and making him more likely to want to just stab and be done with it.

[scooter]

Sent to TT:

Twinkletoes,

Thanks again for the chat yesterday. I talked it over with Gaspar, and I'm on board with this for sure if you are. I would like to make one clarification about the fleet disbandment plan. I'd just like to ask that it's disbanded at a time of your choosing no later than end of 1904. I would like to think it'll no longer be needed by then. If this is all okay with you, I'm signed up for this if you are.

Thanks,
scooter - Turkey

[Gaspar]

Yeah, I hope it didn't come off that I was unwilling to work with Rowain - I absolutely am. I just don't think its going to happen, for all the reasons previously stated.

[scooter]

Took a stab at replying to MJW (Italy):

MJW,

Two centers sounds very reasonable to me. Rowain so far has been very fixated on me for whatever reason, so I think you have a pretty golden opportunity to really nail him and pick up some easy centers if you play your cards just right. Are you planning to move into Trieste this spring?

Thanks,
scooter - Turkey

I feel like I don't have a clue how to reply to him. I feel messages need to remain short, because nobody jumps at shadows that don't even exist quite like MJW.

[scooter]

Oh, Mattimeo (G) did send me this yesterday:

Haven't heard anything from MJW so far, sorry.

Only person I haven't heard from yet is Cyneheard (F).

I think I'm going to start putting the initial of the country in parenthesis. Hopefully that helps maintain the clarity on who is who without having to type the whole thing out every time.

[scooter]

Got a reply to Rowain (A)

I wasn't easy to catch yesterday so no problem. Decrypting MJW has made some progress at least so far to agree that we are sitting in the middle so fighting each other right from the start is not the best move. With other words business as usual between Italy and Austria.
On other news there is little information especially Germany is really quiet which is always a dubious sign by Mattimeo.

I agree on your assessment about Russia but as you know sitting in Austria gives one little chances to be active. I'm more in the position to try to not be the first dead and then look who offers what and with what sincerity. A cooperation between Russia and Italy would put us both between hammer and Anvil so that is a thing I try to avoid to happen.

TLDR: What do you have in mind? I doubt we have much deals in spring and only few possibilities in fall 01

-Rowain

I decided to reply right away:

Well if it makes you feel any better, I got like 6 whole words out of Mattimeo, so you may not be alone on that one.

I don't have a ton in mind just yet, because I agree that our S01 moves aren't really impacted by our communication together. I'm just trying to keep our options open and re-evaluate after the next couple phases. I'm trying not to commit to anything too quickly.. Italy sailing east early would badly throw a wrench in things, and I have not the slightest clue what he intends to do, which may well be true for everyone. He basically told me he's going to attack either you or I, and he's making offers to me on your land already. I'm guessing he's doing the same with you about me? I'm more than a little suspicious of him just because I don't know how to read him.

Thanks,
scooter - Turkey

So the one thing I don't want is Rowain to be able to trust MJW. I figure if I can play up the sketchiness of MJW's diplo so far, I can help prevent that from happening. Rowain is sharp and may see right through that a bit, but it's worth a shot.

[scooter]

I owe you guys an update I guess. So things with TT (Ru) first:

Twinkletoes,

Thanks again for the chat yesterday. I talked it over with Gaspar, and I'm on board with this for sure if you are. I would like to make one clarification about the fleet disbandment plan. I'd just like to ask that it's disbanded at a time of your choosing no later than end of 1904. I would like to think it'll no longer be needed by then. If this is all okay with you, I'm signed up for this if you are.

Thanks,
scooter - Turkey

scooter,

Excellent! I am okay with your suggestion and am happy to consider this agreement signed.

TT

Sounds great, thanks!

And then I got a follow-up late afternoon:

Hey,

What vibe are you getting from Italy thus far? I am not getting much traction on him at all when it comes to talking about Austria.

Do MJW & Gaspar have some bad blood between them?

TT

Quick phone reply. Gaspar if you have a comment on that feel free to reply all.

Anyway, yeah I'm not getting too far, but that's fine for now. I think if this continues, when you "stab" me in the spring I'll probably threaten to give all my centers to you if he doesn't help me. That should be fun. Or at least that's the idea I have in my head. I don't feel bad screwing with MJW since he's basically stiffing me in diplo right now.

I've always felt like MJW is overly interested in me, similar to but on a lesser scale to the way he's overly interested in Sullla. But I don't believe it would impact his choices in the game - at least not overtly. We've had battles in forum threads, but so have I with almost anyone.

In sum, no I don't think that's a factor.

Gaspar

I'm a little nervous about this, but I'm unsure what to say to TT. Rowain and MJW have been awfully quiet to me, but MJW's thread is updated almost constantly, so I don't have any doubt they've been talking a lot. But I'm afraid of anything that might give TT cold feet. I think MJW will be more likely to talk when he sees TT seemingly "stab" me after this turn, but if he doesn't, I fear TT may actually do it.


---

I also sent this reply to MJW (I):

Rowain's fixation just comes from the fact that I won the last Diplomacy game that he had a shot at winning, so he seemingly wants a little bit of revenge.

Anyway, word is you are definitely planning on helping Rowain with a Lepanto opening. Curious what Rowain is offering you? If you want two Austrian centers, you've got it, and that's going to be a lot easier for you to get than my centers.

Thanks,
scooter - Turkey

[Gaspar]

Yeah, I mean the fact that TT is tipping us off to MJW/Rowain's tightness is certainly a good sign, even if we could obviously see it ourselves. Still a RT vs AI is more uncomfortable for us than R. I guess Mattimeo (G) is the wild card. If he goes in against Russia, well... I don't see us ever negotiating anything more than a stalemate. If he sides with us, then we should eventually be able to grind them down.

I've got a bad feeling about this game.