WW 34--The Slugfest!

[Jabbz]

I think adrien has posted so little i can't get a read on him.

Jabbz I think overreacted a bit suspiciously to zak weak accusation of him pushing the noob factor, but thats about it

And if that had been the only think Zak had done, then yeah it would be overreacting. He has been all over me the entire game so far though, so I think it's a little bit more warranted.

[BRickAstley]

So Jowy, now that you've switched off of the Bob train back onto Jkaen, can you explain both why you voted him in the first place, having offered no prior reasoning as to why you'd vote him, and why you then so easily followed Jkaen right-away on his case of the day?

I felt that his Day 1 play could be a classic case of scum trying to make themselves look good by disregarding the merits of the leading wagons that would end up flipping town. I saw his strike at Bob as an opportunistic move, as it is hard as scum to pretend to hunt scum by play, but it is easy to point out a scummy role claim. I think it's important to listen to everyone, and he made a good point about Brick's post in relation to Bob's claim. I read Bob's defense and it seemed sincere to me. He could be a good liar and I'd learn my lesson, but right now I read Bob as town. Since he has claimed there is not anything we could gain by pressuring him today and we should move on and investigate other options. If at the end of the day the majority wants to lynch Bob, they can switch their votes back to him and do it.

Thanks for answering the question by partially answering the question. Yeah that makes sense as reasons why you would have been suspicious of Jkaen previously, thank you for that. And I agree that Bob's defense seems sincere, there's a reason I haven't voted him yet today.

What puzzles me is your following Jkaen on and off of Bob. Jkaen made a good point (minus my clarification, but that doesnt make it good at the time), but as you already admitted, Jkaen already made what was possibly "an opportunistic move" against Bob, and it didn't occur to you that maybe he was stretching to fond more concrete reasoning to not hang himself? And by jumping back off, you're admitting that you have still thought that Jkaen would be a good lynch, which further makes it seem silly why you would follow someone you think is a liar just based off a particular meta theory.

In short I feel like your play is too odd and wishy-washy to just dismiss as normal, it has the feel to me of scum trying to just find a good case they can latch on to, instead of genuine hunting.

[zakalwe]

Agree w/novice. On the other hand, if Bob is scum then the kind of visit he feared most was probably from an investigator (or a vig), anyway. So even if he didn't know for sure, it could simply be a calculated risk, feeling there is little to lose. If anybody had visited him, the game might be up, anyway.

So the problem with this is that yes, it makes sense to take a risk when you are feeling exposed anyway. But why would he then make a claim that invites a policy lynch? That's just taking him out of the fire and into the frying pan.

He does seem acutely aware that a policy lynch is his Achilles heel, though. Jkaen says he thinks he's lying, Novice says he agrees with Jkaen, and I say his play makes no sense as a townie. Yet he dismisses the whole wagon as a policy lynch.

It still think it smells like a fake claim that he researched on MafiaWiki. While there, he would note under the Bomb entry that Bombs are often policy lynched, and be aware of this danger.

If he's telling the truth, he wouldn't have to research his own role, so the risk of being policy lynched wouldn't be so prominent in his mind. Possibly.

[zakalwe]

I think adrien has posted so little i can't get a read on him.

Jabbz I think overreacted a bit suspiciously to zak weak accusation of him pushing the noob factor, but thats about it

And if that had been the only think Zak had done, then yeah it would be overreacting. He has been all over me the entire game so far though, so I think it's a little bit more warranted.

Well I'm off your case right now so feel free to contribute, unpestered.

[Jowy]

So Jowy, now that you've switched off of the Bob train back onto Jkaen, can you explain both why you voted him in the first place, having offered no prior reasoning as to why you'd vote him, and why you then so easily followed Jkaen right-away on his case of the day?

I felt that his Day 1 play could be a classic case of scum trying to make themselves look good by disregarding the merits of the leading wagons that would end up flipping town. I saw his strike at Bob as an opportunistic move, as it is hard as scum to pretend to hunt scum by play, but it is easy to point out a scummy role claim. I think it's important to listen to everyone, and he made a good point about Brick's post in relation to Bob's claim. I read Bob's defense and it seemed sincere to me. He could be a good liar and I'd learn my lesson, but right now I read Bob as town. Since he has claimed there is not anything we could gain by pressuring him today and we should move on and investigate other options. If at the end of the day the majority wants to lynch Bob, they can switch their votes back to him and do it.

Thanks for answering the question by partially answering the question. Yeah that makes sense as reasons why you would have been suspicious of Jkaen previously, thank you for that. And I agree that Bob's defense seems sincere, there's a reason I haven't voted him yet today.

What puzzles me is your following Jkaen on and off of Bob. Jkaen made a good point (minus my clarification, but that doesnt make it good at the time), but as you already admitted, Jkaen already made what was possibly "an opportunistic move" against Bob, and it didn't occur to you that maybe he was stretching to fond more concrete reasoning to not hang himself? And by jumping back off, you're admitting that you have still thought that Jkaen would be a good lynch, which further makes it seem silly why you would follow someone you think is a liar just based off a particular meta theory.

In short I feel like your play is too odd and wishy-washy to just dismiss as normal, it has the feel to me of scum trying to just find a good case they can latch on to, instead of genuine hunting.

I think it's good to give everyone the benefit of the doubt.

[Gazglum]

I think it's good to give everyone the benefit of the doubt.

Who is this incredibly zen person, and what have you done with Jowy?

Perhaps its just that Goreripper is in a drughaze, but it feels very quiet here today. A lot of lurking. Jabbz, you've been posting to defend your Day 1, but do you have any opinions about suspects today?

[BRickAstley]

I think it's good to give everyone the benefit of the doubt.

Who is this incredibly zen person, and what have you done with Jowy?

Yeah Jowy being zen is really freaking me out.

[novice]

Agree w/novice. On the other hand, if Bob is scum then the kind of visit he feared most was probably from an investigator (or a vig), anyway. So even if he didn't know for sure, it could simply be a calculated risk, feeling there is little to lose. If anybody had visited him, the game might be up, anyway.

So the problem with this is that yes, it makes sense to take a risk when you are feeling exposed anyway. But why would he then make a claim that invites a policy lynch?

You mean, why would he explicitly say "policy lynch me if you must"? Because obviously the claim does invite a policy lynch implicitly.

I still like a Bob lynch today. Zak said it well, his play makes no sense as town. The savvy thing to do would be to roleclaim in his first post, miller style. And Bob had a couple of days prior to the game starting to figure this out.

As scum, Bob is the kind of player who likes to make bold plays. Cooking up a claim like this is right down his alley. And by the way, if there are other players except Qgqqqqq with day actions they should consider speaking up. Bob's claim doesn't mesh well with that.

[novice]

Tally as of post 398:

4 votes: Bob (Jkaen, novice, zakalwe, AdrienIer)
2 votes: Jabbz (Lewwyn, Gazglum)
1 votes: Jkaen (Jowy)
1 votes: novice (Bobchillingworth)
1 votes: Jowy (BRickAstley)

Voting history:

Jabbz

Jabbz

Bob

Jkaen

Bob

Bob

Bob

Jkaen

Bob

novice

Jkaen

Jowy

Jabbz

[Jowy]

I think it's good to give everyone the benefit of the doubt.

Who is this incredibly zen person, and what have you done with Jowy?

Yeah Jowy being zen is really freaking me out.