[PB78] Underdogs and undercats: The Mrrshan warlords visit the world of Civ IV

[Donovan Zoi]

Cities all look good to me.

How is the diplomatic situation coming along? How committed are we to a Magic war at this point, and what do we think is going to happen after if Magic does get dogpiled and overrun by a coalition?

Based on the diplo I’ve received since about T140, some big things should have been going down about now.  Yet things are still calm on all fronts with minimal stack movement except to consolidate more forces.

Gavagai’s stack is 60+ strong but still positioned to hit either Dreylin or Magic





Superdeath’s stacks stand at 40+ and are no far not threatening our borders.  Also,  I’ve scouted his eastern coast with Iran and there are no ships set to embark whatsoever.







I didn’t get a pic of Dreylin’s forces, but most of his are loosely consolidated around Gav's northern border.  He didn’t accept my T165 aggression against Gav, which is fine since I offered it under the assumption the latter would be advancing on Iran by now.  Yet, he still came back to me with T161 and Magic, which is the current turn.  

And here’s a view of our possible path to Iranian territory, and only about 25 units staged in Morrig to help with any dogpile.  But there’s no way that I’m gonna be the one to start any wars.





Demos




I’ve been on a building kick recently, exploiting the good fortune of troop absence near our borders, but the lack of clarity now has me looking to wedge in some units to support the Castles and Walls we’ve been building.

You can really see where we are trailing the pack militarily, and it’s forced me to reevaluate queue to hopefully get us back up to parity.

Here was our ending queue as of T159





And now T160





I’ll double whip many of these cities with units in order to help get good hammers into a waiting Wall or Castle the next turn.  Once the Castle defense (and trade and EP) project is over, I’ll be prioritizing Stables to pair up with Guilds discovery in about 4 turns.  We’ll get Civil Service on T162 with quite a bit of overflow built into Guilds.

So to answer your question, anything goes right now so bolstering our defenses and maximizing our promo potential are the orders of the day.  I'll likely join in an attack on Magic if someone else starts it, but otherwise no.

[williams482]

This powder keg sure is taking it's time. I'm guessing the other players are following the same basic logic: no border is or can be secure, the first mover opens themselves up to immediate backstabbing, and the first to make real gains on anyone is a target for even more of the same.

How can we break this stalemate? The obvious but likely impractical solution is to build a strong alliance with someone and mutually conquer in the other direction, but nobody should trust anyone under these conditions. The alternative is what, build up an army strong enough to conquer the weakest opponent while retaining substantial border defenses, and hoping that the diplomatic dice fall favorably from there?

AGG/CHA is a very strong trait pairing at this stage, at least, as we should be able to outfight anyone hammer for hammer, and have a modest econ edge as well.

[Donovan Zoi]

Turn 161

Well, things are finally on the move as planned, with Gavagai’s and SD’s troops both inching toward Iran this turn.

The Big Picture




Here’s a map of Iran from a few turns back:
–SD will be advancing through Jimmy’s BBQ to hit Artemisium  en route to the big prize, Marathon
–I’m interested in Issus, Guagamela, New Tehran and Granicus and possibly two of the islands.
–I’m sure Gav shares my interest in the 4 land cities above, as otherwise he only gets two tiny OG Persia cities and Mycale.
–Dreylin has least advantageous inroads to the spoils, as his only shots look to be the Persepolis bottleneck or boating barb city Little Lightlamp. I’ll likely let him take New Tabriz if he wants it, but will need to look at that region again.

Gavagai




The Indian mega-stack lumbered 3 tiles due NW to accommodate it’s 1 movers, but apparently did not attack Persepolis at the end of T161 as expected.  He may be holding off an extra turn to go through Madras, so he can gain more ground towards the same cities I am targeting.

Plus, he may be waiting to engage since he likely sees my troops just outside of Magic’s borders with 2 promotable stacks.


Our Claim

For our part in T161, I was left to decide whether to advance on Iran now or lay back a turn myself.  I decided to move forward, knowing that ‘Rilla3 XBows and Wood3 Pikes would get me a shot at Gaugamela just before Gavagai.




The eastern stack has more troops and is equipped with many counter-units for Mounted in case Gav tries to fight us for Gaugamela.  I also have concerns about entering Magic’s borders and leaving us open in Morrig and Reticuli if Gav opens up a path to us by taking New Cunaxa.  I’m also thinking this is a reason he didn’t declare last turn (unless I’m wrong on that), to force me to commit our troops away from the mainland




Our smaller western stack will include 4 Rilla3 XBows and 3 Horchers.  Last I checked, the cities of Issus and New Tehran were poorly defended.  And it looks like  there are enough hills to allow us to 2-move up the coast and grab these two prizes, the latter with the Great Library FWIW.




Also, see the forest?  If we’re able to clear culture by taking Issus, it’s a great site for a canal city that, with the addition of two forts, gives us access to island cities Horseback Ridin and Megalon.  I’m considering building out the Galley I started in Whynil and sending up with 1-2 Galleys from Mentar.  We’ll fill these with CR3 Maces since I think the math is better and the promos more useful in the long run than C2+Amphibious


Superdeath

No screenshots but his 27-unit mounted stack is heading east toward battle while he WE stack remains at home base.  You can bet he wants Marathon and I don’t think we’ll contest him in any way.  My long term plan is to somehow force him to expire his Colossus and GL by focusing on naval tech soon.  The GL expires at Paper and the Colossus degrades to a mere giant bauble when he discovers Astro.


Dreylin




Inca has the smallest stack NE of Persepolis, but likely has more to the east.  I’m still interested to see what his play is.




Demos




We are first in Gold and Land and 2nd in Food.  And I’m not ignoring our severe lack of troops right now, but am looking to see how quickly we can get Guilds and start 2-whipping some Knights. I’ll post a separate update on post-Guilds tech options soon.


Powergraph




Another visual to showcase our predicament.  I definitely intend to move cautiously on any conquest until we get our numbers up.



Two New Settlers




The forest chop in Reticuli worked as planned, getting us 101h for a Settler.  We also have another Settler coming out of Mentar.  These new sites will use shared food to ramp up quickly.  I’ll make sure to get you a pic of the region once they are both active.

[xist10]

Somebody moves, it's getting exciting.

You really need more troops, 0,7 towards all others ?
okay, tech is important too, so not that easy to balance.

Be careful not to overexpand. I think, Issus and Gaugemala could be enough. - And be careful not to got hit by the catapults on neutral ground. - in general don't get hit.

[williams482]

Dreylin's lack of obvious commitment and limited Iranian targets makes me worried he might decide to play spoiler on one of the civs attacking Iran. How secure do you feel our Federation border is?

[Donovan Zoi]

Hey guys, sorry for the lack of reporting recently.  Some crazy things have happened over the last two turns that have made most of your questions obsolete!  But I think we'll fare better in this new scenario.

I'll tell you all about it soon.  But first, I'm gonna play the turn though I'd prefer to wait until after SD plays.  He added time for himself (presumably) while leaving me in suspense after a move of his Knight stack from Marathon to just outside ambush zone of... Herculis?      A bit of a mind-bender and this map is only gonna get smaller as the game goes on.

[xist10]

Did SD and Gavagai come to blows ?
Did MS wiped Gavagais army ?

Or did the dogpiled you ?

I thought you played sequential ?
Anyway, timer games are not so popular. I do use them too, so I'm a hypocrite, but I want to say it.

[williams482]

Any updates? Sounds like things are happening out there.

[thrawn]

Looks like the carnage has began. From the city exchanges on pbspy Gav and MS attacked Dreylin, after which DZ and SD attacked Gav. Gav and Dreylin will probably be reduced to rubble after this and we may remain intact though I have no idea of the details and how favourable a position it would be.

[thrawn]

DZ, can you give us an update on your latest acquisitions? You seem to have navigated this stage perfectly with Gav on the way to elimination, Dreylin damaged but not too badly, and SD remaining in the top position.

From here it could be just one more step to victory if SD attacks Magic and Dreylin joins us.