[spoilers] - pindicator is excited for the next Realms Beyond league mechanics

[pindicator]

010

Gotta remember to turn off the interface before taking screenshots for a stitch, otherwise it just looks weird




Note the cows by my scout are forested.  That's not natural.  Do I have to chop those forests before I can pasture?  I haven't had to run across this one in a long while.

This has to be one of the most difficult and unusual starts I've had in a multiplayer game here on RB. The nearest food by land is 7 tiles away. We're at the end of a peninsula with a 1- tile isthmus and then from there we're guided north by a mountain range. There appears to be no food on our peninsula outside the capital. But beyond the isthmus and mountains there appears to be many resources and good food locations. Wine and gems for luxuries.

So far I've been praying for seafood to show in the north and allow me to set up a traditional second city that shares the a bonus food with the capital and then let's me grab seafood ... but how much would that city really help even if it does end up existing? Assuming a coastal fish it may end up being a spot I can improve quickly. But since i did not go for CRE any second ring food will take time to get to. And then I will be back in the same problem: a long distance to the next city.  What i mean is that this start says I have to get east in order to properly expand; if I can grab a seafood plant north of the capital will that really speed up my going east and getting the good city locations?  Or will it just bog me down in having to build work boats and tech Fishing and popping a border anyway before I can get to building more settlers and finally getting to those eastern spots?

Now the situation gets a lot easier if my scout manages to uncover some other food south of the pig and I'm able to grab a city with multiple first ring food. But if that does not end up happening then I think I have to settle southeast of the clams and pop borders to get the pigs and wheat. A 3 resource city will be good, even if the clams are not ideal. (Only 4 food-hammers; I could get the same from mining a hill!)

And this leads me to try for religion timed with the city plant. Yes, i risk wasting about 12 turns of research and delaying Bronze Working until the mid 40s. But it would also speed up the 2nd city considerably by popping borders and allowing the pig, clam, and wheat and giving 12fh at size 3. But the city gives little production until after workshops get online, and having a 4f tile that needs 30h and another tech before you can work it isn't the best.  And it adds yet another tech in a long line that I need to research when I started this game in a bit of a tech debt due to not picking a civ with good starting techs for my resources.

So next I just resigned to settling NE of the pig, getting the production going with teching straight to BW, having it come in a couple turns after the city is settled, but then revolting immediately and whipping out a monument and another settler. Next settler then goes for the real prize: the Fish, Sheep, Wheat spot to the north.  It's not too bad of a start actually; I can get a city up to the Fish/Wheat/Sheep by the mid 40s.

But can I improve on it?  Maybe I want to build 2 workers first and road out towards the east.  That would delay the first city by 2 or 3 turns - enough that BW comes in first and I can then adjust my first plant to where copper shows up, if that turns out to be good.  But then after improving the pigs I'm not quite sure what those 2 workers do.  And if copper shows up somewhere near the capital do I instead put a city to share the cows and grab the resource?  I'm not sure if this is the right idea yet, but it has some good options to it.

Anyway, I'm pretty sure I'm not going early religion even though I was really leaning that way a few turns ago.  Now I'm leaning towards first ring Pig but whether it's north along the coast or inland depends on if there's more food.  And I still need to sort out whether I want 2 workers or 1 before that settler.

[pindicator]

Seems I'm not the only one with an unusual start. Or rather, unusual by RB standards. OH grew to size 2 on turn 11. That only makes sense if he starts off working a plains forest hill, has a 2h plant, and also has a first ring fish.

Started my pasture this turn

[RefSteel]

Note the cows by my scout are forested.  That's not natural.  Do I have to chop those forests before I can pasture?  I haven't had to run across this one in a long while.

Yes, pasturing a forest cow requires BW and involves chopping the forest (just like mining a forest hill). The tile isn't natural on a normal mapscript, but I think it actually is "normal" for the mapscript Krill posted and gave TBS for this game. (Krill links to the script in the first post of the tech thread.)

[pindicator]

Well ...

I'll let lurkers decide if I need to share with everyone 

Meant to click the tech thread but fat fingered it on my phone and it opened the lurker thread. I read "dunno about everyone else but pindi's peninsula looks rather horrible" and realize I'm in the wrong spot and back out.

FWIW, I don't care if I've got the worst start in the game. This is an interesting challenge and I swear my plan on how to conquer it changes daily. I'm still hoping for food by the pig but we'll know that next turn. I'm really liking a 2 worker before settler opening right now because it lets me road to the east and only effectively delays working an improved pig in city 2 by one turn. Also, copper might change my mind about where I settle. The downside is the cost: a city that far out is going to cost 2gpt easy. Which has me thinking about settling clam first ring again - back where I started!! - but this time without religion and just popping borders slowly. 

I'm not sure if finding seafood in the fog to the north is going to effect my plans. If it's second ring seafood, especially if it's ocean, then I might still see it as filler. If it's coastal then I'll probably go there just because i can have a work boat almost straight away. Coastal fish would be a winner, I think, especially if it lets me share food with the capital. I don't know, I really need to see it. 

And wanting that flexibility makes me think I should just go 1 worker before the settler. Unfortunately I have to make the decision before I scout the area with my warrior. 

Let's get gems by the pig next turn, that will make this all moot



EDIT:  This is such a nice change to hyper-competitive pind who would complain about copper being too far away!

[pindicator]

013

Not what I was hoping for...

[The Black Sword]

I think you're fine not sharing that with everyone else, not like you gained any advantage.

And don't believe everything you read.

[pindicator]

015

Pigs are done. Moved the worker east and next turn we start on the cow.

Scout found a fish down south by the wheat. I think the priority is to check out where the nearest neighbor is now. Specifically, I want to see if there is a neighbor closer to those gems than I am. So the scout will circle around south to get the next layer of tiles uncovered and to see if there is anyone just out of sight, and then head north to check out around the gems and then wines. Not the most efficient scouting but I think that's the right priority for now. Later scouting we can get with work boats, since I suspect there will be lots of avenues to scout by the sea this game.

[pindicator]

Ok, I think I finally have my plan for 2nd and 3rd city set. It was one of the better food and production results, tops in commerce, and allows me to be flexible in case I find a lot of food north of the capital with the initial warrior. Downside is a delayed BW and 2nd city, but a 3rd city will come right after so we'll still be able to claim any copper that pops up

[pindicator]

017

Work boat next. That's the plan.




More specifically, I was debating between clam and pig for city #2 and I finally relented on clam. Pig is better in the short run, but is a far worse city once borders pop. Clam can get production on food-hammer units or by whip until we get workshops; or it can run all 4 specialists from a madrassa on size 7. Pig also costs more: with no commerce and far enough away to cost 2gpt, the pig will really stymie my early tech rate. While the clam can be hooked up as soon as the city is founded. In addition, if my warrior does happen to find good seafood to the north then the plan is flexible enough that I can have a work boat ready and not suddenly have a pair of workers with nothing to do.

So in more detail: we are working Pigs and the plains forest hill for 2 turns until the cow pasture is done, and then work the cow & pig to complete the work boat and grow all in 4 turns. Settler then is done in 8. In those turns after pasturing the cow the worker is then going to pave the way (with the warrior providing coverage). Specifically:

20: W to forest
21 & 22: road forest
23: NE, road, cancel
24: E, road, cancel
25 & 26: E and build a road
27: SE to isthmus forest
28 & 29: road
30: NE to isthmus forest
31 & 32: road
33 & 34: N & road

Meanwhile settler finishes eot 28. settler moves:

29: NE-NE-E
30: E-SE-NE
31: N
32: NE, found on clams

Follow up with a second worker out of the capital which will finish up the road between cities 1 & 2, giving us trade routes.

Downside is BW doesn't finish until end of t35. Could possibly squeeze that down to end of t34. But the next settler will be out t40, so I think that's the way to go.


And I also found stone.

[pindicator]

018

This is kind of shown in the last pic, but I want to emphasize it




Stone.

Tons of Forests.

Pyramids?