Woden's and Chevalier Mal Fet's [Insert Clever Name Here] Team Thread

[Woden]

Nubia-Turn 101

When I opened the save I was expecting to see some units by the southern city with my archer gone and knights rushing my crossbows but instead I was greeted with peace notification. As previously stated, Rome/China made peace with Kongo/Khmer. I was not expecting this! 

I don't think this changes much on our part as we will continue as planned. It will make it harder now that Cornflakes' units no longer have 2 fronts to defend against but we will push ahead. It looks like now it will be a race to Kongo's capital, since I think Rome is just going to declare again in 10 turns, with most of Kongo's/Khmer's troops defending against our invasion. The question for us know is: Do we push towards Japper's capital after taking the northern Khmer city to try and prevent Rome from taking it or do we push to the Khmer capital, then rush to Kongo's? I am partial to going after Khmer's capital and making all of Cornflakes' army disappear before pushing on Kongo. It would take minimum of 2 turns to reach Kongo's capital after the fall of Khmer's, which means if we take the Khmer capital in 7 turns, we may have a chance to steal it from Rome. Rome will have a few turns to move in after the 10 turns of enforced peace are up, so we may even have 9 turns. The key will be to get at least half of the city surrounded by our units. This all assumes that we don't hit a huge walls of units to slow us down in the next few turns. 

I think with all the drama in this game, after it is over this will be the first thing I will look at to see what Rome/China was thinking. Is it just me or does this seem odd? I think there are 3 possible scenarios for this (in turn order):

1. Sullla sent peace right before I declared war, not knowing I was going to declare, and it is just a coincidence. It did take us awhile to be in position to attack. Maybe he thought we weren't going to do it since it has been awhile since he declared. It might be to bring the captured cities out of occupation and buy a little time to bring knights to the front. Maybe Cornflakes has a bunch of knights sitting around Japper's capital and it would be awhile before Sullla's knights make it to the front? Although he is a lot closer to Japper than I am to Cornflakes and my knights are just arriving, so his should be there already. With his strange offer a few turns ago, maybe he was thinking we were going to jump in to rescue Kongo. Why would we do that? Has it every worked when a player from far away dogpiles on the strongest player? Didn't in PB2. Probably somewhere but my supply lines are already stretched going after Khmer. It would be easier to sail by Germany and hit China instead of Rome. IDK, this seems a little iffy and I don't think they would do this because it would leave Khmer/Kongo open for us to declare, then again... 

2. Singaboy sent peace after we declared. This could have been planned out ahead of time. Work on Japper until we jump in, sign a quick peace , and then re-declare when Kongo's/Khmer's units are over defending against us. It is kind of what we tried, let Rome work on them and then jump in when Cornflakes is over helping out. This would be a brilliant move to try and poach Japper's lands. Let us take the brunt of their forces and get beat up and they (Rome/China) easily stroll in to capture Japper's remaining cities. They may even hope we take out Cornflakes and have his units vanish or have us get beat up fighting that they just continue pushing east and declare on us once Kong/Khmer are taken out. We will have to be careful with this. One problem here is would they risk only getting 2 cities if we were to steamroll Khmer and get to Kongo's capital before they could do anything about it. 

3. This is most likely, Japper requested peace and offered gold or maybe even another city. We can't see Japper's trading screen, so no telling if he has all the cities he had last turn. Japper could have offered and Sullla accepted before I played again. He would have thought about it similar to #2 and wanted the captured cities out of occupation to pull ahead. Still very risky, as it opens the possibility of us steamrolling Cornflakes and grabbing Japper's capital. 

I guess we will find out after the  game is over and we will see in 11 or 12 turns if it was a wise move on Sullla's part. Anyways, on to the turn. Start off with...

With the aqueduct finishing at Nu-Kandy, I switch to Military Engineering to finish next turn. Let's take a look at the war front...

No units moved up. Cornflakes is being patient here. This makes it harder, so I will have to be extra deliberate in my moves. I think he has abandoned his southern city. The city has no walls, no defender, and nothing showed up this turn to make me think he has any plans on defending it. His trader is gone, so it ended last turn and he moved it out of the city. I move my units up and did get a before picture but the stupid tooltip pop-up blocked everything. Here is an after picture... 

I hit the city with my archer and then 3 horseman strikes to do 111 damage in total. Next turn I will pillage the mines and then strike and take the city. The city will be pretty shitty while under occupation, so I figure the 50 from the mines will be better than the poor production and help speed Education up. 

Back home...
 

Builders are ready for some chopping/harvesting next turn and I should get enough faith to buy an Armory at Isis. Maybe even enough for a granary somewhere or walls at my first conquered city. Will have to see how much is left and if anything shows up at the southern city. 

Back at the front, I noticed something not smelling right...

Rome has 2 ships heading up the coast towards Nan Madol. CMF, if I were you I would stick you galley in the bay next to Nan Madol, then if Sullla has plans to take out Nan Madol, he will have to declare war on you. I plan on doing the same at Valletta. It is a good thing there is only 1 sea tile for entrance to the city. We don't need Sullla to take this opportunity to take out our city states. 

I figure since Khmer has abandoned his southern city, I could start getting my units into a better position. I move my crossbows up...

I expect him to stay in a defensive position and wait form my attack, so I think my crossbows are fairly safe. If not, I can move more up and attack with at least 4 next turn, maybe 5. First 2 knights a close and the following 2 are a turn behind. I think I can push on Cornflakes in 2 turns, which means more of his forces will be back from Kongo's land. This is going to be a blood bath. I just hope I come out on top. 

Here is the current Military Power:
England/Nubia: 591/988
Rome/China: 830/349
Kongo/Khmer: 202/694
Russia/Germany: 205/354 

Cornflakes upgraded something, increasing power by 25-ish and Sullla's went up a little bit. I was curious what my forces look like...

7 crossbows, 7 knights, 3 horseman, 1 sword, 3 archers, 1 chariot, 2 warriors, and a lonely slinger defending my eastern front. Will it be enough?

[Woden]

Nubia-Turn 102

Early turn today. Sullla must of had the day off. Anyways, open the save to...

Get a notification that I have 2 Niters, one under Amon and one right next to it in the desert tile of my Nubian pyramid. Start the turn with a little chopping. First, I chop the jungle into a Commercial Hub at Horus, finishing it and overflow into a market (due in 6). Next,the copper...

194 , not bad. Next, I harvest a marsh at Osiris, instantly growing the city with enough food for another population next turn. The chopping brings my faith up to 509.3. Time to spend some faith...

which gives me...

It would have taken 14 turns to build the Armor, so awesome. I think that brings me up to 910 from faith buys with Valletta.  

Now to the west. Here is what it looked like before I moved...

No approaching units from Cornflakes, so I move up my units to take the southern city. I thought about it last night and I decided against pillaging the mines. It would have given me only 50 and I am not racing for anything and don't know when I could get a builder down there to fix them. 

Here is my positioning before I attack...

I hit it with my crossbow and archer, then 2 horseman and...

The city is mine. I thought about buying walls to protect it against a counter attack but I don't know if I am going to have any more chopping in the short-term and I think having the option to buy walls when I capture the northern city would be better.

I reposition my northern army...

 

I can start pushing on the city next turn. Need to get this started before his troops over by Japper's capital make it back to defend and my first 2 knights are in position. Looks to be a bunch of hrosemen guarding the city with 1 knight and I did see another knight southeast of his capital before I took the southern city.  I bet he has a couple more around his capital and maybe a couple over by Japper. The would be 6. Seems a little high (5 is more likely) but I am going with 6 to be conservative. Probably doesn't have the range support that I do, so maybe 6 is a good number. Anyways, I guess we will find out shortly.

[Chevalier Mal Fet]

T101 - 102

Meant to my turn report after work today, but there was already a turn waiting  for me! So y'all get 2:

Well, actually 1. T101 was not that exciting. Salamis finished a trader and sent it to Geneva for more science, the builder stepped closer to chop the marsh and place the IZ, and my army mostly stood pat. I'm not strong enough to advance on Cornflakes - I need gold. And settlers. Gold and settlers! And caravels. Gold, settlers, and caravels. And frigates. Gold, settlers, caravels, frigates, and aqueducts for housing. 

._. I'm not very good at this game. 

Anywho, the builder reached the marsh last turn:


 

Was it worth delaying placing the IZ for this? I think so. The IZ doesn't need to be done until the turn I place the Arsenal, and my pop struggles have been great enough that 79 free food is not to be sneezed at. It shoots Navarino most of the way to size 8:




That lets me place the IZ, an 11-turn build but we're gonna chop it in 1 turn on 104. Next turn I step onto the forest, then I chop. I decided that it makes sense to chop the galley, not the quad - I can replace Ocean, and I can rebuild a galley in time for the Arsenal chop on 110. A quad would not be possible in that time. Walls need 4 more turns, or 2 with Limes in place, which I will slot in next round, in addition to Meritocracy to retake the lead in culture. 

Woden, I also think when I complete Civil Service, we ought ot ask Molotov-Ribbentrop for an alliance. I don't know when their friendship with Empire ends, but it should be relatively soon, and when it does, it'd be nice to have them on our side. They need to go war fairly soon, and what better time than when Molotov and us are fighting on the other side of the world? They could attack us, but we've been chasing the leaders the whole game, and Archduke hates Singaboy anyway. Both our teams' best shot to win is to unite and try to take down Empire together, and I like our chances in that fight since we SHOULD have more land + the VA. 

Really need to get my settlers out, though, I'm starting to think that delaying them was a mistake. But, well, 20 turns! I would have done nothing else and I would not be in position to compete for the VA right now! My problem ultimately comes down to food. I didn't do a good enough job ensuring population growth earlier, which means my underdeveloped cities take forever to build things. I'll do better my next game, I think. Lesson learned for next time. 

Scout is winding its way through Germany, although there's not much point anymore: 




And my galley is searching for the southern borders of Rome/China. 

At the front, Sullla is pressuring Nan Madol, while Japper and Cornflakes and I take potshots at each other. I view my role right now as guarding Woden's flank, and preservng my army until it can be upgraded. 




VA Check: 




Plenty of time still. 

I increasingly feel like mine is a rickety civilization held together by spit and duct tape. My desperation measures are reaching the end of their useful life as Sullla leaves me in the dust and Singaboy and Archduke rapidly catch me up. Still feeling pessimistic, obviously.

[Woden]

An Alliance with Germany/Russia would work. We will have to wait until they get the civic too. I was also think it might be a good idea to ask Rome/China for a DoF.  My reasoning is that we pushed hard in the recent turns to get ready for war and setting up the VA build. It might be nice to regroup, develop our cities a little bit, and grow stronger. That way we will be in a better position to attack further down the line when Frigates are available and maybe field cannons, calvary, and infantry. I don't see pushing on them right after taking out Kongo/Khmer being a good idea at the moment. We could use the 30 turns to expand into our new lands and develop our core, then push hard with a massive amount of ships. What do you think? If we were going to do it it would have to be soon, maybe even next turn.

Next turn I am going to start pushing ahead in the north...




The blue lines are crossbows, the red are the 2 knights at the front, and the green are the 2 followup knights. 

My northern crossbow will move to the hill next to him and fire on the horse. CMF, I am hoping you will attack with your 2 swords and then possibly kill it with the archer. I would say strike it with the 2 swords first, so you don't have  a unit next to the knight at the end of the turn. Hopefully Cornflakes moves up to attack my crossbow but doubtful. His knight is getting +6 from support and he may lose it if he moves up. 

The 2 green knights will move down the road next turn and then cut into the woods towards the northern city. 

CMF, I wouldn't worry too much about your city sizes. My biggest city is size 5. You should push out granaries ASAP and then you have a bunch of food you can harvest for fast growth or improve for housing and food. The one thing I like about Civ 6 is that unless you are in Kongo's or Khmer's position, you can really develop fast and become competitive fairly quickly.

[Chevalier Mal Fet]

An Alliance with Germany/Russia would work. We will have to wait until they get the civic too. I was also think it might be a good idea to ask Rome/China for a DoF.  My reasoning is that we pushed hard in the recent turns to get ready for war and setting up the VA build. It might be nice to regroup, develop our cities a little bit, and grow stronger. That way we will be in a better position to attack further down the line when Frigates are available and maybe field cannons, calvary, and infantry. I don't see pushing on them right after taking out Kongo/Khmer being a good idea at the moment. We could use the 30 turns to expand into our new lands and develop our core, then push hard with a massive amount of ships. What do you think? If we were going to do it it would have to be soon, maybe even next turn.

I think a DoF would be great for us - and so I don't think Rome/China would go for it. They'd be worried about us sniping Heart of Darkness (and rightly, too - if we guaranteed the Roman army had to sit out this fight, I'd lobby for bypassing Cornflake's capital, seizing Japper's to cut off Rome, and then push back to the east and scoop up the whole lot), and we put our last DoF to good use. I think 30 turns of peace would let us catch up as I fix my development problems and start properly exploiting the massive amount of land we have. Time for me to scrape together gold and upgrade my units into semi-modern respectability, time to leverage the VA into an unstoppable fleet, time to plant those new cities and get them productive... For those reasons, I very much doubt they'd go for it, but it's worth a shot, I suppose. 

Next turn I am going to start pushing ahead in the north...




The blue lines are crossbows, the red are the 2 knights at the front, and the green are the 2 followup knights. 

My northern crossbow will move to the hill next to him and fire on the horse. CMF, I am hoping you will attack with your 2 swords and then possibly kill it with the archer. I would say strike it with the 2 swords first, so you don't have  a unit next to the knight at the end of the turn. Hopefully Cornflakes moves up to attack my crossbow but doubtful. His knight is getting +6 from support and he may lose it if he moves up. 

Looks solid to me. Cornflakes has largely out of date units, like I do - his power must be mostly in knights. Be careful of your south flank as you push forward, and don't overexpose anything down there to a counterblow. It's important that we win with as light losses as possible, since Rome/China are gathering for round 2 in the west. The city-gifting discussion means to me that they're debating which cities to give to China, at which point a bunch of faith-drafted units will pop out. We need our army ready to face that, or we'll win a bunch of prizes only to lose them immediately. 

CMF, I wouldn't worry too much about your city sizes. My biggest city is size 5. You should push out granaries ASAP and then you have a bunch of food you can harvest for fast growth or improve for housing and food. The one thing I like about Civ 6 is that unless you are in Kongo's or Khmer's position, you can really develop fast and become competitive fairly quickly.

It's mostly just the extreme difficulty I have producing anything without chops, which are the one mechanic scaled to my tech rate. I feel like I've managed to trick the game by keeping up in science/culture/gold, but all my build times are horrendous outside Trafalgar, and that's my one large, developed city. I've done a very poor job at building my own internal production this game - I feel like after I got all the RNDs out, I've been stagnant. Should have pushed expansion harder, either upwards with housing or outwards with settlers. But I chased chariots instead - that's the one move I really regret so far. 

Another period of peace to let me untangle these problems, establish my naval bases on the Mediterranean, and tech up to Caravels/Frigates/Knights/Muskets, would be real nice.

[Chevalier Mal Fet]

Also, can I just say that I always feel a bit more reassured after talking to Woden? He always reminds me that there's hope.

And really, our combined numbers compared to Singaboy/Sullla aren't horrible, except for a much lower city-count. Similar science, slightly lagging culture (but hopefully meritocracy will make up for that).

Actually, that reminds me - perhaps I should slot in Caravanserais over Meritocracy? Is gold more important than culture at this rate? Or should I focus culture to reach Merchant Republic faster and more economic slots? Gold lets me upgrade my Crossbows, and save up to upgrade knights/caravels/frigates after the VA. Hmmm...

[Woden]

Since you are for it, I think I will send a DoF to both China and Rome when I play. I actually don't think we have a shot at Japper's capital because Cornflakes is playing it smart and being patient. It would be better if he rushes out and counter attacks, then I could get him in the open field and slaughter him with crossbows but so far it looks like he is going to hunker down and wait for me. This is going to slow down my advance, since I have to play it smart and patient too.

When and how much gold do you need for your project? I have about 200 I could send soon and another 200 in about 5 turns. My income should be in the positive in a few turns. Also, can you slot Professional Armies in anytime soon to upgrade some units with any extra? I ask because if you can't fit PA in and don't need all of it, I might slot PA after Guilds and upgrade my 2 archers at the southern city to help apply pressure on his capital from the south as I advance in the north. If you can fit PA in and upgrade a few crossbows, it would be better as you can go after Japper's northern city by Nan Madol. Think about it and let me know what you think. I should be able to go back to PA in 2 turns if need be.

[Chevalier Mal Fet]

I need 800 gold by Turn 110, generating 70 pt with 186 in the bank and 7 turns to go - so I'll be about 200 short, I think. If you want to upgrade the two archers, I think we can afford that. But there's no chance I'll be able to slot in PA.

[Woden]

I need 800 gold by Turn 110, generating 70 pt with 186 in the bank and 7 turns to go - so I'll be about 200 short, I think. If you want to upgrade the two archers, I think we can afford that. But there's no chance I'll be able to slot in PA.

Okay, I will look it over while I play to figure out moves and let you know what I plan. I will plan on sending you at least 200 gold on T110, maybe T109.

[Woden]

One other thing, I went back and saw my friendships end at T108 with Russia and T117 with Germany. Do you know when your friendships with Team Germany/Russia end? I seem to remember that you sighed with Germany after I did but with all the staggering of them I might be off. Is my signing with Germany the latest one or did you sign after me?

This is important because my eastern front is guarded by a lone slinger and am not sure how useful he will be if attacked, though he does have some pretty big stones... I think I will have plenty of time to build some units if Russia refuses a re-signing on T109.