Just logged in to check real quick. During his turn Borsche (turn played by agent427) retook Whattaburger from Gavagai. These two are just swapping cities back and forth. Still to come is seeing if Gavagai takes anything this turn, but since it took a city last turn I doubt he has enough healed troops in position to take another city again (unless it's to just take back Whattaburger again). I'm betting that city has changed hands at least 4 times already. LOL
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[PB25-SPOILERS] The Lunacy of the Reign of HAK Continues
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June 26th, 2015, 11:59
(This post was last modified: June 26th, 2015, 12:11 by MindyMcCready.)
Wow, lots of data there.
Some things that I'm thinking. 1. MC is not going to attack us. He's just in too volatile of a situation with Retep. 2. MC has enough units to defend, but not enough units to attack with so,...he's headed north. He's either on his way to hit Elkad or GJ's island. With those cities having just switched hands and no culture, this is the perfect time to hit them. 3. GJ's GNP is enormous,...he's eating MC's tech lead up very quickly now. MC needs to strike soon. See that little uptick in MC's power,...that's him deciding to hit GJ. Bet that we'll see more power from him in the next few turns. 4. GJ's unit power is not quite as strong as it seems. It's boosted a little bit by Statue of Zeus (4K) as well as a high number of Ikhandas (3K) each. LET THE BATTLE OF BATTLE ISLAND BEGIN! Coming soon,...I think,...I hope. I will be surprised if we don't see this happen. What this means to us. -We can stop building that Trieme and get me more swords. -We can worry a little less about our island city, for now. However, if MC is successful against GJ,...well we'll be the next mole in his whack-a-mole game. It'll be very dangerous for us if he takes our island city. I'm not looking forward to that. GJ will not roll over, of course. -GJ, upon losing Burning Spears, will probably not do a total freak out despite his past volatility. He'll simply be too focussed on keeping his new acquisitions safe from MC (and Elkad). Not saying that he won't try to take our island city,...just that he probably won't go on a total pillaging spree. Our short supply lines means that he'll take losses that he can't afford to do. We may have to whip a few Triemes out if I'm wrong but,...so what. Better than a failed attack on Burning Spears. As for us,...we're too light on swords to hit GJ quite yet. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that Burning Spear is the next logical target for us so he's going to be on 100% military. He may even bring those island troops back over to us. So we'll have to move as quickly as possible. We can assume that he'll whip out another 2-3 LBs in the time we take to move on him and bring down his walls. If we can get enough swords put together those LBs won't make a material difference in the outcome. But the working assumption is 1 WE, 2 cats, 1 axe, up to 7 LBs. Given the number of units that GJ has we'll have to break down Burning Spear's defenses. Once wall defenses are stripped he won't be able to protect that city: CR1 Swords vs (100HP, 1 splash, 2 splash) CR1 Sword vs CG1 LB: 43.2%/61.6%/67.3% CR1 Sword vs CG1 Archer: 63.8%/80.6%/85.7% The LBs should defend first against the Cats. That will give us a chance to pit swords against WE, Cat, collateralled archer. So we'll lose a few cats but after that he can't really defend. Other things: I see 5 cats in the stack but 11 cats total. I'm feeling pretty sure of my assessment of MC going for GJ so I'm suggesting that we mov the rest (or most) of our cats so that we can break down the walls more quickly as well as collateral the heck out of the archers. We should also move in the WE's since GJ could attack out with LBs and WEs are our best stack defender there. As an aside,...I debated not hitting Burning Spears due to the strong garrison and instead hitting Borsche sooner. The reasons why I concluded against that: -We'll be the top mole as soon as that happens which then exposes us to 3 dangerous fronts (MC, GJ and Gavagai). That's just not wise to do. So as painful as GJ is going to make it, I still think that it's our best course of action. MOAR SWORDS! My suggestion: Sleepy --> Sword Overworked --> Sword after cat. I think that we have too many cats which is an absurd statement in MP. :LOL: Is whipping that city to produce overflow an option? Dancing --> Sword,...it looks like that cat just started? Anxious -- Whip that sword that's nearing completion and overflow into another sword. Anxious can regrow on corn if we're successful. Adventurous - I saw your explanation regarding the archer,...but that was one of our forest chop cities? I don't know the micro from 10,000 feet so if we need it we need it. But,...please make sure that we really need it. Then hit that city as soon as possible. We have the option of getting started a little early if the swords are onroute but a couple of turns behind. 2 cats is not enough to attack out against 14+ units.
One more thing,...our GNP.
MC will be certain that our GPT is not 68. That's not a credible 100% gold number for us so he's going to know that it's not legit and that something else is happening. I really intended that we would be showing say 90 gpt - 110 gpt. Something that could possibly be our GPT. That was my intention, suppress it somewhat but still be believable. We've got too many EPs for him to believe that we're stupid enough to have not built any Rathuses. :LOL: And,...am I right to observe that our GPT is almost 200?  Those Rathuses,...
(June 25th, 2015, 13:35)HitAnyKey Wrote: Glad you had a chance to read some of the GJ-grudge....I've read and seen some of his as well, previously. Hence why I have kept being so leary about going after that city until we have a STRONG defense of both city defenses and Trireme defenses around our core. I didn't read this too carefully before. My initial impression of GJ starting this game was that he was reasonable. I got that impression from an obviously too small read of his threads. I read up on his hostility and discovered my mistake. But he's got new some new grudge posting in PB18 that shows how little he lets go of it. Now as to GJ's reponse, I think that you're making a mistake here that I am also very prone to make. The mistake is thinking about what GJ *could* do to you/us rather than what he *would* do. For example, MC *could* break through our choke. It gives me fits to think about that and I (often) post something shrill to that effect. However, if he did that,...what's next? A move on our capital across the flatlands with a fairly high power somewhere out there + high pop for whipping + a revenge focussed player that will try to bring him down. So he should decide against doing that. Same for GJ. GJ could go ballistic and send his 2-move galleys or Triemes to harass us. But, he'll have to move past our cities that can whip out Triemes and near-instantly block him or 2:1 him. And then, if he doesn't keep that navy up we can go do the same back. So he'll probably not take that course of action since it's a strict lose-lose. He's much more likely to take our island city since that's easier and isn't a strict lose-lose. An example is PB18 spoiler: So I guess I'm saying that you may be overestimating what GJ is likely to do in retaliation despite his grudge-bearing ways. I could be wrong on this,...but imagine yourself trying to take stab at someone across the water with higher power than you and 18 cities and a much better ability to concentrate units. That would be a non-starter.
June 26th, 2015, 15:35
(This post was last modified: June 26th, 2015, 15:36 by MindyMcCready.)
Tentative Borsche Invasion plan.
T-1: -8 defensive units + 2 HAs board 5 galleys in Arbys -10 cats are 3N1E of Arbys -10 additional units in Anxious T=0: DOW -5 galleys move to N2W of Arbys -8+2 defensive units land 2S2E of Popeyes -10 cats board the 5 galleys -10 additional units 2N1E of Sonic T+1: -2HA have remote possibility of capturing a MP-only garrion city. -Otherwise, 8+2 defensive units move to 1S1E of Popeyes -5 galleys move 2E of Popeyes -10 cats unload to 1S1E of Popeyes. -10 additional units board the galleys. T+2: -Bombard and/or capture -5 galleys can move into city and troops can immediately march forward if prudent. -After that the galleys can head north for a diversion since Borsche won't know if they picked up units near "Burnt Spears". -alternatively 1 galley could pick up a settler for the ice crabs. T+3: Assuming McDonalds is still there? march towards it. Keep on going to Five Guys if prudent while we try to galley Chik fil A. Other -Plant on the ivory -Plant 4S of Five Guys -Plant 5S1W of Wendy's. These cities will be extremely useful naval bases to use against Gavagai or to just keep Gavagai honest. If Borsche is still alive but on the way out Gavagai will be at a very high disadvantage as our anti-horse units move 3-steps on the non-culture areas. If Borsche's culture is removed, this could be very fast, dynamic war despite the lack of 2-movers. Our galleys will probably be pushed into service to get some combat engineers as soon as the main invasion force is in place.
Going to quickly start things off with a single item post with an interesting development....
 There was an initial diplo window of exactly the same thing without any text. I guess he wanted to make sure I understood that this was a real offer. I exited diplo so that we can discuss and think about it. I still think we should attack and raze the city, since as we've discussed...we really don't like that location for a city. And I also really don't want him (or anyone for that matter) to have that island city so close to to our capital. I'd dislike losing Bedazzled (since its one of our good sources of ICTRs), but if it's going to go...I'd much rather it be razed. I wonder if we pull out units out of Bedazzled, that he'll get the hint to pull out his units so we raze each others cities. Only difficulty comes in trying to figure out a way to signal that we're planning to raze the city and for him to do the same to Bedazzled if he so desires.
And how here's stuff for the turn itself. First off, I met Donovan...
And then here are the demos, graphs, and build queues. I realized Bedazzled could 2-pop whip a Trireme in a turn or two. So that could be my source of a Trireme for those waters. That city isn't much good for anything else, and may as well keep whipping it while I have it.  Also decided Belligerent could also whip out one of my Galleys, and Sad could also start building one. It'll grow onto a Mine next turn, so that production time will decrease. Still not fully decided on whipping the Galley out of Belligerent though. When that city grows in 2 turns, I may have it build the Settler for the ice corner of that island. I was very tempted to start a Forge in Sleepy. It needs the additional happy to keep growing, and I'd like to start getting some of my cities with Forges. But I started the Sword instead. Will probably start the Forge after this Sword finishes. If Commodore does decide to start invading GJ's new island acquisitions, I'm very tempted to consider kicking off that Golden Age. I've been trying to whip my cities very minimally, so that they are large enough to get as much benefit from the GA. But all this talk of whipping cities to pump out military....I don't want to do that and then end up kicking off the GA before they've regrown enough. And I do think it's kind of silly to hold onto this great person for so many turns. We got him a LONG time ago. We're also starting to get close to having our next GP, which I'm crossing my fingers will be a Great Merchant from Happy with a Great Scientist to then come out of Hungry after that (getting it to come out quicker while we are in a GA). Also the GA will simply get us to Engineering that much faster, and then we can move on to bigger and better things all around. But I don't want to do anything until I see what Commodore does with his army. Once he is at war with someone else (other than me), I'm really thinking that it'll be time for that GA.
This post is for the lurkers. I would assume GJ maybe posted about this trade offer in his own thread too, so maybe he also asked you. Do lurkers think this is a trade that our game rules would deem valid? I believe so, but should probably hear from at least one lurker even before we think about offering it back to him.
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