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[SPOILERS] SevenSpirits trashes three estates and a copper

#61
June 18th, 2012, 21:20
SevenSpirits Offline
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[Image: p39t24_1.jpg]

MMMmmmmmmmm. smile That is how I like my granaries.

Also note the 49 gold. I've been pillaging! That's 100% pillage profits. Most of it is from the plains village/hamlet/cottage near my own start. I've gotten only slightly below average pillage gold so far which I am quite happy with.

My warrior near Yuri took a peek at the capital and then graciously left. I could have been annoying, but I like my opponents, I don't want to hurt them.
Tides of War mod • Torusland map script • Mirrorland map script
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#62
June 19th, 2012, 03:41
timski Offline
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Are you pillaging near your own start primarily for the denial value to other players, or because the gold is worth more now than the improvement will be at some point in the future? I'm intrigued as to the extent that these maps provide interesting choices beyond the opening, or are merely providing a more consistent (predictable/balanced) substitute for huts.
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#63
June 19th, 2012, 03:53
SevenSpirits Offline
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timski Wrote:Are you pillaging near your own start primarily for the denial value to other players, or because the gold is worth more now than the improvement will be at some point in the future? I'm intrigued as to the extent that these maps provide interesting choices beyond the opening, or are merely providing a more consistent (predictable/balanced) substitute for huts.

I'm pillaging because the gold is worth more than the improvement. A plains village (that's not in my future bureaucracy capital) isn't worth working in the foreseeable future, because non-riverside plains is just so terrible. The other improvement I pillaged was the plantation, which was completely useless for any other purpose.

There are a few windmills near me which I could pillage but I think I'd rather leave. They're not crazy good, just comparable to the mines I would build there, but the 4g average yield isn't worth the four lost worker turns to replace the improvement. The copper mine is more intriguing with a 9g average pillage yield but again the worker turns are more valuable than that. So these I would only consider pillaging if I thought I couldn't keep them safe from enemies until I settled them.

I'm really liking the pre-placed improvements as both a fairer hut substitute as well as additional things you want to defend from early invaders. smile
Tides of War mod • Torusland map script • Mirrorland map script
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#64
June 29th, 2012, 21:13
SevenSpirits Offline
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Sorry, I have been slacking on updates. We played 4 turns in the last 2 days so I figure I'd better catch up.

First of all, from four turns ago, the final shot of my 2-city empire. Remember I built granaries in both cities and then grew them both to max size. Then I 3-whipped each for a settler. KC overflowed into a 1t library and immediately hired 2 scientists for an early academy. TP will overflow into a 1t worker and then begin a wonder whipping cycle, described later.

[Image: p39t33_1.jpg]

Note that I just turned tech back on after saving gold since I got writing. I have over 200. Also note I'm doing pretty terribly in score and demos. I was probably last to my third city. But gold and granaries don't show up there. smile
Tides of War mod • Torusland map script • Mirrorland map script
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#65
June 29th, 2012, 21:36 (This post was last modified: July 22nd, 2012, 13:21 by SevenSpirits.)
SevenSpirits Offline
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Mackoti asked for an update, so I took some screenshots the following turn (this one). t37. (37 is incidentally my second-favorite number.)

First, an overview. I just finished Math end of this turn. Currency is probably next, due in 6. Cities 3 and 4 are settled, and city 5 is due 5t from now.

[Image: p39t37_10.jpg]


King's Court is working on the scientist. Just 6.5 more turns of contributing almost no production... just in time to start on the Market, which will give 2smile and later one more.
[Image: p39t37_9.jpg]

Trading Post I did a repeating micro plan for. Every six turns it will produce a settler, a worker, and a chariot. It just finished the chariot, in 2t it will whip a settler, and turn after that it will complete the next worker.
[Image: p39t37_8.jpg]

Menagerie will probably just stop at size 3 for now and slow-build stuff.
[Image: p39t37_7.jpg]

Hunting Party is getting a granary with the help of my first post-Math chop, due next turn. Then it will grow onto the cow and deer and later onto some non-river cottages to grow for KC.
[Image: p39t37_6.jpg]

My warrior by Yuri had some exciting adventures. First of course he went to take a peek at Yuri's capital. Then he went back west and pillaged the plantation and cottage. Then, eyes on the prize, he went southeast to Yuri's village (that's the tile 4S of the marble). A Greek warrior was close on his heels, but since Yuri isn't creative, his stalker lacked combat 1. (Amusing note: Yuri has now built a barracks in his capital.) When I moved onto the village, Yuri attacked and lost, so I was free to pillage it down for about 40g. smile
[Image: p39t37_5.jpg]

My scout has just reached Scooter's lands. I hope I am free to move SW next turn to gain vision of his capital and horse city.
[Image: p39t37_4.jpg]

My next planned city, settler to be provided by Trading Post. 2 workers are roading towards it already.
[Image: p39t37_3.jpg]

And my next city after that. It's immediately quite strong as yes, that is a plains wheat FLOOD PLAIN tile. The settler after next will go there; I need the extra time for those workers to improve the cows and deer, and road up to it.
[Image: p39t37_2.jpg]

My current techs, in case it wasn't obvious. After currency, sailing is probably next. After that it gets more complicated. I want Code of Laws and Civil Service of course, but I also need stuff like Calendar, Masonry, and IW. Some basic known-tech-bonus C&D says 2 opponents have masonry, only scooter has IW, and other than mysticism and its ilk, no one else has anything else I don't. No wonders have fallen yet, I hope no one gets anything too crazy from the Oracle.
[Image: p39t37_1.jpg]
Tides of War mod • Torusland map script • Mirrorland map script
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#66
June 30th, 2012, 20:42
Commodore Offline
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So problem! That's a mapmaker artifact, the FP/Wheat. Um. Sorry. Not sure if it's gamebreaking or whatever.
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#67
June 30th, 2012, 21:04
Merovech Offline
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If there is an admin password, someone could go into worldbuilder and change it, right?
Merovech's Mapmaking Guidelines:
0. Player Requests: The player's requests take precedence, even if they contradict the following guidelines.

1. Balance: The map must be balanced, both in regards to land quality and availability and in regards to special civilization features. A map may be wonderfully unique and surprising, but, if it is unbalanced, the game will suffer and the player's enjoyment will not be as high as it could be.

2. Identity and Enjoyment: The map should be interesting to play at all levels, from city placement and management to the border-created interactions between civilizations, and should include varied terrain. Flavor should enhance the inherent pleasure resulting from the underlying tile arrangements. The map should not be exceedingly lush, but it is better to err on the lush side than on the poor side when placing terrain.

3. Feel (Avoiding Gimmicks): The map should not be overwhelmed or dominated by the mapmaker's flavor. Embellishment of the map through the use of special improvements, barbarian units, and abnormal terrain can enhance the identity and enjoyment of the map, but should take a backseat to the more normal aspects of the map. The game should usually not revolve around the flavor, but merely be accented by it.

4. Realism: Where possible, the terrain of the map should be realistic. Jungles on desert tiles, or even next to desert tiles, should therefore have a very specific reason for existing. Rivers should run downhill or across level ground into bodies of water. Irrigated terrain should have a higher grassland to plains ratio than dry terrain. Mountain chains should cast rain shadows. Islands, mountains, and peninsulas should follow logical plate tectonics.
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#68
June 30th, 2012, 21:30
SevenSpirits Offline
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Commodore Wrote:So problem! That's a mapmaker artifact, the FP/Wheat. Um. Sorry. Not sure if it's gamebreaking or whatever.

Bummer. Wait, didn't you mirror it? Did you do that manually? yikes I doubt 3f will be gamebreaking though. A random jungle spread was likely to screw someone more than that helps me (no idea if such a jungle spread happened).

Merovech Wrote:If there is an admin password, someone could go into worldbuilder and change it, right?

Unfortunately it's already had its main effect, namely by making me settle northward. Taking it out now, were it possible, would rather unfairly make my micro for the past dozen turns retroactively stupid.

Edit: heh, maybe this makes up for the missing incense in 29. tongue
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#69
June 30th, 2012, 21:43
Merovech Offline
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SevenSpirits Wrote:Unfortunately it's already had its main effect, namely by making me settle northward. Taking it out now, were it possible, would rather unfairly make my micro for the past dozen turns retroactively stupid.

Would some sort of compromise be possible, like making it floodplain/desert wheat? It would still be better than everyone else's, but not hugely so, or would that be too big a micro punishment?

Edit: Assuming this is even possible.
Merovech's Mapmaking Guidelines:
0. Player Requests: The player's requests take precedence, even if they contradict the following guidelines.

1. Balance: The map must be balanced, both in regards to land quality and availability and in regards to special civilization features. A map may be wonderfully unique and surprising, but, if it is unbalanced, the game will suffer and the player's enjoyment will not be as high as it could be.

2. Identity and Enjoyment: The map should be interesting to play at all levels, from city placement and management to the border-created interactions between civilizations, and should include varied terrain. Flavor should enhance the inherent pleasure resulting from the underlying tile arrangements. The map should not be exceedingly lush, but it is better to err on the lush side than on the poor side when placing terrain.

3. Feel (Avoiding Gimmicks): The map should not be overwhelmed or dominated by the mapmaker's flavor. Embellishment of the map through the use of special improvements, barbarian units, and abnormal terrain can enhance the identity and enjoyment of the map, but should take a backseat to the more normal aspects of the map. The game should usually not revolve around the flavor, but merely be accented by it.

4. Realism: Where possible, the terrain of the map should be realistic. Jungles on desert tiles, or even next to desert tiles, should therefore have a very specific reason for existing. Rivers should run downhill or across level ground into bodies of water. Irrigated terrain should have a higher grassland to plains ratio than dry terrain. Mountain chains should cast rain shadows. Islands, mountains, and peninsulas should follow logical plate tectonics.
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#70
July 1st, 2012, 01:17
Partisan Offline
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Not only you have a favourite number, you also have a second favourite number? smile

Thanks for the update. Much appreciated.

About the FP/wheat, I doubt it'd make a big difference long term. You could make a personal compromise of not improving that tile ever, short of like an oasis.
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