[Spoilers] Ceterum Peter censet Carthaginem fore triumphatrix - Adrien + Miguelito

[Miguelito]

and of course...

Adrien and Miguelito: Peter (Exp/Phi) of Carthage (Fishing/mining, Cothon, Numidian Cavalry)

So we got suboptimal starting techs compared to the others, however, if we do a seafood second city (i do expect this to happen) the ability to grow on the workboat instead of a warrior may actually be worthwile. And, on this map we want sailing soon, so I don't see fishing as a complete waste. Judging by our sims, we're not really critical reg worker techs, just cottages may come in a little late.

The Cothon was the main reason for the civ pick, hopefully it we can make it shine on this map! Numidians have the potential to help us securing early overseas settlements, but they may not have too much of an impact. We'll see.

Exp is good and synergises with the Cothon (which, actually, really needs a production bonus, as I just found out it's even more expensive than a standard harbour. The most interesting part for me will be the impact of Phi on our play. I have high hopes on the early academy (and I'm serious that we should consider writing before wheel/pottery). But I also see the peril on focussing too much on the Phi play. It's very important that we get to MC and Compass in time.

[Miguelito]

I agree with your analysis, I'd like to add that I like chokonu for their ability to work as super catapults in the period where catas become too weak to be useful (after knights and longbows have appeared but before cannons)

Plus, they can collateral off of boats.

I miss bombard tanks.

Oh that's is a nice detail to know. We're playing BTS, so if we ever get a tank I'll give it bombard in your honour and if soemone tells me how to rename units you can put a name to it

[AdrienIer]

Ok new objective : play just well enough to make this game last until tanks but poorly enough to not get conceded early

[Miguelito]

btw Adrien, i missed to respond to a couple of your comments above:

- Wonders: So you don't really consider pyramids a priority? I thought it would be great to have rep if we work many specialists. I agree we should focus on compass, and also MC, before aesthetics, as well as that marble would change things in favor of TGL and MoM (but I would be quite surprised if there is marble or stone on this map - maybe as a bounty in the center?). Another wonder that could help with our current tech plan and especially if Confu works, though to be built on a later date, could be Shwedagon Paya. That way we could skip the religious techs for a long time.

- I had a look at the PBEM21 map. There the starting islands had space for about 4 cities, see e.g.

...
And here is the view of our island, complete with zoomed in views of our 3 cities:

...

[Miguelito]

Btw if we get compass reasonably fast, circumnavigation is an option to consider...

[AdrienIer]

I thought I had already mentioned the mids as a good build somewhere, but yeah of course it would be awesome. It's just that if there is no stone then it's going to be hard to compete with an Ind leader on such a huge build.

I tried the sim, and the way you did it is probably the best I can do. Here's where I am on the second settler.

[Miguelito]

I thought I had already mentioned the mids as a good build somewhere, but yeah of course it would be awesome. It's just that if there is no stone then it's going to be hard to compete with an Ind leader on such a huge build.

true, but the Ind leader hopefully is busy building Oracle + Colossus. Anyway, I have a suspicion that our little island will not have a lot of forests, so maybe we can grab mids by getting a woody spot on the central island. Pure speculation of course

I tried the sim, and the way you did it is probably the best I can do. Here's where I am on the second settler.

I hadn't managed to finish that work boat nor the wine hill mine, so your play from T19 onwards would be good to know. But I guess scouting and the second city will change everything, so I suppose we don't bother too much with that right now.

Btw your sandbox is missing a forest on the plains 2N1E of the capital.

[AdrienIer]

Now I'll have to remember what I did where should we send the scout on t1 ?

[Miguelito]

It depends a lot on the coastline that we can guess from foggazing I suppose. Anyways, I think early scouting will not be that critical in this game, as there are no huts and the island should be scouted soon enough. We should try to get a scout (maybe better an axe, considering the barbs?) to the other shore reasonably fast however.

[AdrienIer]

Yeah, but the faster we find our second city site the faster we can sim it