WW11 - Civilization

[MJW (ya that one)]

I'm tired now and I'm going to bed--so see you guys before the lych. :neenernee

[novice]

A showdown between Gaspar and Rowain would work for me. I'll keep my vote on Rowain for now.

[Gaspar]

Truthfully I don't think I've been remotely scummish in this game. And the accusations I've seen from everyone but novice has mostly boiled down to "Gaspar is better than that." First off, I'm not really that good at Werewolf. I'm really good at reading human players diplo intentions in MP Civ. Sadly, they are not exactly the same thing. I'm good enough at werewolf but I'm no oracle.

Secondly, and this is the key part, so I'ma yell it: WE HAVE NO INFORMATION TO TELL US WHETHER ANYONE IS ANY GOOD OR NOT YET. We lynched a villager. We have no idea whether the other candidates were villagers or not. At night, another villager got killed. And that's the sum total of confirmed information we have. If I last a couple more days and we find out I made a bunch of bad reads and missed a lot obvious tells, then you can tell me I'm sucking this game.

I'm not going to get into a long drawn out defense when the charge is Gaspar wouldn't do that. Yes, he would. And he did. If there is a particular action someone finds curious, let me know and I'll explain my reasoning. For me, I think it really has to be scooter today. I could get behind a vote on Ichabod. There are others I wouldn't object to testing a bit, but I can't think of any others I'd want to vote for.

[zakalwe]

This may be a bit WIFOM, but I'm surprised my push against Ichabod hasn't gained more traction. You'd think a wolf or two might be tempted to back me up, if he is innocent. Is my case really that bad?

[novice]

Ichabod, I don't think my argument is flawed. It is quite simple and straightforward. I was accusing you, and you responded with saying that you don't suspect me, but that I have bad judgment. I found that wolfish.

Of course, it could be the case that you're just a villager who happens to not suspect me and think I have bad judgment, but that doesn't mean my argument is flawed, just that it's yielding a false positive.

You directed a question to me, Novice, and Gaspar about our opinions on each other. To me, that either implies that you suspected me, or that you didn't and wanted my advice. Hence it contradicts the above.

This is your case against Ichabod, right? It's not enough to convince me.

I don't think the wolves have any problems finding places to park their votes atm, with the votes so spread out.

[Rowain]

Yeah that kind of spacing is NOT gonna fly. That's making it way too easy on the wolves. I'll swap from Selrahc to Rowain.

You are quite right the votesplitting we had is a god-sent for wolves. especially for those that seek an easy lynch-target = me. (Sareln, novice)

Speaking about Rowain I don't find it plausible that I could hang with 12 minutes on the clock with no other votes on me.

There have been late-runners with little time on the clock. I thought it possible to lynch you because a) scooter talked about voting for you and your attack on Gaspar might induce him to switch to you too. That would mean 3 votes already and enough players left to push you to the top.

... he said he would post less in the future for some reason

Correct. I have done the post-a-lot too many times with too little reward.

For those zthat are interested in a village-win: Take a good look at the reasons people use to vote for me:
Example Sareln: Something doesn't sit right but I can't say it.

Providing perfect cover for wolves.
Look at the other reason: He didn't place a vote on the top3. Of coursse such an vote would not have altered the result in anyway so what is the fuss about my MJW-vote other than smokescreen for wolves to hide?

[Rowain]

A showdown between Gaspar and Rowain would work for me. I'll keep my vote on Rowain for now.

I'm absolutly sure that works for you and some other people.

[Lewwyn]

Zak, I'm pretty convinced Ichabod is innocent, so yeah, no traction here.

[zakalwe]

This is your case against Ichabod, right?

Not all of it.

My initial intuition is explained in post 633. Summarizing, and including what I've seen since then:

- His general play style is too cautious and passive. Not voting at the start of day 2 is strange; it's just a continuation of day 1, no reason to hold back.
- He went after Jkaen yesterday and Catwalk today; I disagree with both, and intuitively consider these suspicions misplaced, coming from him.
- He reacted to my accusations in a wolfish manner, trying to avoid confrontation while discrediting me.
- His stance towards me is contradictory, in that he first asks me for opinions, then relies heavily on my argument to accuse Catwalk (stating twice that it's an excellent argument), but then turns around saying I have bad judgment.

[zakalwe]

Zak, I'm pretty convinced Ichabod is innocent, so yeah, no traction here.

You're almost convinced he is innocent? And likewise for Mardoc? Any other convictions? I didn't think you would be so quick to clear people.

(Replace Ichabod with arbitrary player X above, and I'd still make the same comment.)