[59] Miguelito and Rusten move stacks to berimbau rythms

[civac2]

Would you mind if I logged in and had a look around, Miguelito?

[Miguelito]

Sure, feel welcome

[Rusten]

[Charriu]

FWIW this mod still has the vanilla BtS "bug" (feature?) where tiles that are 2c before the GA don't get the financial bonus. A basic river cottage will yield 3 commerce, not 4, during the GA.

Quick, post it in the mod thread so Charriu fixes it and updates the mod before we're there!

(kidding)

It's on the todo list

I hope this sight warms Charriu's heart, when he sees it in a couple months' time.

Yes, it does. I noticed lumbermills are used more often and more forests survive till the later eras, but not in an excessive way. So great.

[civac2]

The FIN ga thing is not a bug imo.

[Charriu]

Also Charriu closed borders. I was mad at first, but I have to admit that I was in fact mapping out his defenses. In my continent overview from last turn I had missed that him and Lazteuq had made peace (enabling Laz's GKC strike). Is Charriu the type to send a stack to defend Mjmd? Maybe yes. And maybe it's the correct play for him as well. I have some hopes that we are faster at DirtyOldTown.

You can remove that "Maybe" there. Yes the plan was to defend Mjmd and throw you off our continent, but that relied on additional help.

I'm trying to tell myself that Charriu would be smarter to try and split Mjmd with us, but a) we didn't invite him and b) if he can drive us out he may get all of it. I'm not quite sure if he intends to keep, raze, or devolve to Mjmd. Overall a very neat diplomatic play by him and Lazteuq, both using their mutual peace toadvance substantially. I also should have taken him closing borders way more seriously.

I really had hoped that Lazteuq would join in defending Mjmd and providing the necessary naval force, but alas he never did. That certainly didn't help in repairing relations between me and Lazteuq and made sure you keep a foot on our continent. I have to say though that the peace between us was not in responds to you attacking Mjmd.

Also while remembering the earlier game I realized that Charriu betrayed the guys who sent him horses when he was rushed by Lazteuq (no idea if that was ever significant, but anyways)

I honestly had forgotten about that by that time.

[Charriu]

That means that for the while being we can't really advance in force, because Lazteuq still controls the whole coast. Now if Charriu stays true to his word and declares next turn it might be that Lazteuq throws his weight in that direction. We can look ahead with the spy and see if we can afford to send a few infantry and stuff forward. Airships are not too far away either and would be a great help (no idea if they'll come in before the first destroyers or later).

Charriu did not declare as promised. He just sent me an offer of him stopping trade with Lazteuq, and a return of fish/fish. What am I to make of that . Frustrated I returned Lazteuq's peace offer. Might have been kneejerk; he was showing very little military on our border and it might have been possible to just push ahead with infantry even alone. But with him having total control of the inner sea and surely a stack of cannons somewhere there was always the possibility of catastrophic failure, so at least that way it should play out more relaxed. Maybe we return in 10 turns with destroyers and airships added, maybe we even invade Charriu instead? After him not keeping to his word of declaring on Laz I don't really feel an obligation to honour our friendship. And that shrine surely still is the most attractive conquest target far and wide. He is doing pretty well technologically though.

Charriu, for after the game, I was quite determined to fight this through until we both would have had half of the continent each. Pretty bummed by this, but surely you'll have your reasons.

I would have loved to join the war. Unfortunately you were right that you could have pushed ahead with infantry. Lazteuq's main force was stationed directly at my border and never moved an inch. That was also the reason why I didn't join the war. It would have been pure suicide against his main army.

[superdeath]

The FIN ga thing is not a bug imo.

I disagree. Nothing about going into a GA should stop FIN from getting the extra commerce that they would get in ANY other scenario.

[RefSteel]

The FIN ga thing is not a bug imo.

I disagree. Nothing about going into a GA should stop FIN from getting the extra commerce that they would get in ANY other scenario.

Nothing is stopping FIN from getting the extra commerce they would get in any other scenario. On tiles where it would get bonus commerce outside of a GA, it still gets that bonus commerce plus the GA commerce. The feature (I agree with civac2) that we're discussing here is preventing FIN from getting special new bonus commerce from a GA on tiles for which its bonus would normally never apply. The GA commerce is a special bonus that's equal for all players, and doubling its effects for FIN alone on ocean tiles, riverside cottages, off-river hamlets, riverside windmills, riverside Sheep/Ivory/Horses, and oh dear heavens riverside Serfdom farms(!!) isn't necessary unless we think FIN in general and/or Elizabeth in particular have been overnerfed to the point where we want to buff them again by changing the trait from its BtS base even more.

[Charriu]

I totally agree with RefSteel. I looked it up again I must have misunderstood Miguelito's post. I somehow thought cottages are allowed to get an extra commerce on growing to hamlets during a GA. Obviously that is wrong because this is the way the extra commerce gets generates.

1. Apply FIN bonus to all tiles with 3c
2. Give every commerce tile an 1 extra commerce during GA.

I'm sorry for starting this. It was a misunderstanding on my part and it's off the todo list.

EDIT: Lesson: Never trust your thoughts before going to bed.