[SPOILERS - PBEM17] novice and spaceman - Suryavarman of India

[mackoti]

If i was you guys, i would research enginering and use engener for hurry the building.Its more eficient this way.Its a waste to bulb using a great engineer.

[novice]

If i was you guys, i would research enginering and use engener for hurry the building.Its more eficient this way.Its a waste to bulb using a great engineer.

Glad to see you're still reading, and you may well be right again.

I'm trying to get us to tech as fast as possible but you're right that it might be prioritizing beakers over hammers a bit too much.

One other thing about slowbuilding it though is that Rego might not compete because he should know we have a great engineer. Then again, once he sees us have engineering but no Notre Dame he'll put two and two together. So yeah... Maybe just research engineering after all. In which case, Compass->Optics->Engineering if Rego has it by then, otherwise Astro first?

[spacemanmf]

Heh, yeah let's do that then!

[novice]

Reply from Shoot:

Seeing as Bursa has a harbor whereas my capital obviously does not, I am almost positive that Bursa will give you a greater gold value than will my capital (Bursa will also be at size 19 in 1t time if you were interested in waiting a turn for a greater gold return). Considering that my capital (and any other city of mine for that matter as all others are smaller than Bursa and without a harbor) will give you less gold, I see no reason for your GM to continue further into my lands unless you were seeking to scout my land -- an action that I must point out holds only hostile connotations at this point in the game. I have appreciated the recent warming of relations between our two civs and would hate to see all of that go to waste.

Shoot

I think he's wrong about Istanbul giving less gold, but the math is kind of fuzzy.

We could offer to trade maps or something to appease him. Really this is the sort of thing where a short chat would be helpful, pity we're never online simultaneously.

[spacemanmf]

Swapping maps won't tell us our troop locations like we would glean from our merchant wandering through. Maybe we should just take the money and (not) run.

[novice]

Swapping maps won't tell us our troop locations like we would glean from our merchant wandering through. Maybe we should just take the money and (not) run.

Yeah, we can sell it as doing Shoot a favour, and we'll probably not make more than 133 gold at most by sending it to Istanbul, so that might not be worth antagonizing Shoot. Although he certainly deserves to be antagonized, it might not be the smart thing to do.

OTOH the scouting information would be nice.

[novice]

I did the maths, and typed it up as a draft to Shoot:

Hi Shoot, the reason for continuing further into your lands would not be scouting, but the fact that Istanbul would give us more gold than Bursa from a trade mission. I've dug up the relevant formulas, and here's how it's calculated:

Trade mission yield = 500 gold + 200 gold * trade route yield for target city from our capital. Then multiply by 0.67 to adjust for quick speed.

The trade route yield for Capital in Bursa is:
base profit * multipliers = 1.0 * (100% + 111% (from 37 turns of peace) + 25% (from connection to capital) + 50% (from harbour) + 100% (from intercontinental) + 45% (from Bursa being size 19)) = 1.0 * 431% = 4

The base profit is 1.0 because Capital is size 15 but is only 10 tiles away from Bursa.

So a trade mission in Bursa yields 1300 * 0.67 = 871 gold (verified by our GM this turn).

For Istanbul, the trade route yield is:
base profit * multipliers = 1.5 * (100% + 111% (from 37 turns of peace) + 25% (from connection to capital) + 100% (from intercontinental) + 50% (from Istanbul being size 20)) = 1.5 * 386% = 5

The base profit is 1.5 because Capital is size 15 and is more than 15 tiles away from Istanbul.

A trade mission in Istanbul yields 1500 * 0.67 = 1005 gold.

Interestingly, if you have a size 13 city with a harbour more than 15 tiles away from Capital, that would yield 1700 * 0.67 = 1139 gold.

Sincerely,
nospace

I'm not sure what the conclusion in our email should be though?

[spacemanmf]

Or we don't have to give him the formulae (just 'cos it's hard to follow).

We can just say something like:

We have done the maths and have calculated that:

Bursa gives 871 gold (verified by our GM this turn).

Istanbul gives 1005 gold.

A size 13 city with a harbour more than 15 tiles away from Capital (if one exists) would yield 1139 gold.

We can run the trade route in Bursa, or we can try for a greater yield and split the difference with you.

[novice]

Or we don't have to give him the formulae (just 'cos it's hard to follow).

We can just say something like:

Okay, I sent what you suggested.

[novice]

Chat with Shoot the Moon. We'll do the Trade Mission in Istanbul, he'll get 67 gold.

20:50*Shoot: You guys wanted to chat? (I presume about the GM)
20:51*me: yes well we sent you an email
*Shoot: yeah, I saw it
20:52*I actually tried to look up the exact formula yesterday, but could only find a general explanation of it...just for my future reference may I ask what exactly the formula is?
*me: it's quite complicated
**I can email it to you, just a sec
20:54*ok, sent
*Shoot: thanks
20:55*me: here's a link as well http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=410559
*Shoot: I had gotten most of that, but didn't know how the distance was calculatted
*me: actually I'm assuming it counts 1 distance for x or y, and 1.5 for diagonals
20:56*that's how it usually does it
*Shoot: yeah I had found a similar thing on civfanatics, but just didn't know if it was going to do it like it counts maintenance where it relates to the maximum direction on both axes
**but I guess if you can see how much it is in Bursa you can confirm how the distance is caluclatted
20:57*me: well at least we can tell that the base profit for Bursa is 1.0
**so it's "too close" to get benefit from Capital's large size
**for the earlier GM it didn't matter because Capital was below size 11 anyway
20:58*Shoot: my head hurts, but I'll trust your math if it matches up with what Bursa should be
*me: heh, thanks
**Spaceman said I should leave out the calculations from the email
**wisely so, I suppose
20:59*Shoot: oh, and I don't have a fitting city on my east coast by the way...Bursa is my only city with a harbor currently and obviously as I'm not in slavery currently my other coastal cities don't really have the ability to get them out any time soon
*me: right
*Shoot: anyway, considering the difference in gold I'd be open to letting you head off to my capital
*me: we figured you were the best shot anyway, having had compass the longest
*Shoot: yeah
21:00*me: ok, that's good to hear
*Shoot: I've just had other buildings that were better to whip out first (markets and grocers for instance) and only really did harbors where I needed the health (which has only been bursa so far)
**anyway, let me open up the save to give you directions on my road network to get to my capital
*me: yeah often they have no effect on the trade route yields
21:01*Shoot: and even if they did, I only have two trade routes in the city anyway
21:02*me: are you playing the save, btw?
*Shoot: no already played
**just forgot to email it on last night
*me: oh ok
**I was wondering if our merchant was causing you to hold the save
21:03*Shoot: yeah, was silly and responded to diplo emails before sending it on and then got caught in chat with a couple people...so all told I just got distracted by diplo before sending on
**I realized it this morning, but couldn't get back to my civ comp until now
21:04*me: it's a pain for us to catch you on chat
**we're never online at the same time it seems
*Shoot: yeah, our time zones don't really match up
21:06*anyway, to stay on my road network you'll want to send your GM SE-SE-SE-E and then SE-SE
21:07*me: ok, cool
21:08*we'll do that and give you a commission of 67 gold
21:10*Shoot: awesome, thanks

[SIZE="3"]Our merchant is supposed to go SE-SE-SE-E and then SE-SE.[/SIZE]