Ichabod Wrote:I'd play a simpler, no-PMs game.
Me too. I think some light roleplay would be nice too, to help remind everybody that it's a game.
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Werewolf 2 Lurker Thread: Spoilers!
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I also think that making the game more and more complicated is a poor road to travel. You could do a game where there are no power/secret roles at all, simply villagers and werewolves. No PMs or private messages. That could be very interesting to see, although possibly too luck based.
No personal interest though, too many things eating up my time already. Sullla Wrote:I also think that making the game more and more complicated is a poor road to travel. You could do a game where there are no power/secret roles at all, simply villagers and werewolves. No PMs or private messages. That could be very interesting to see, although possibly too luck based. Yup, that's what I thought. And we should add a maximum number of posts per day and maximum number of words per post, since I don't want to spend half my day reading the thread 
I think it's fair to say the general tone of this game has been "angry".
 I might be interested in a WW-light game.
So here is my werewolf background.
I've played werewolf games at parties and at my old wargaming club quite a lot, but that has quite a different atmosphere to forum based play. I've been playing werewolf games on forums since 2006, almost entirely on the Giant in the Playground forums. The games have mostly been collected up in the werewolf central thread. I'm probably in about 1/4 of the several hundred games in that archive. So, with that in mind then, I've seen a lot of these same arguments about PMs and roles raging back and forward. And there isn't a right answer which makes the game more fun. We've run a few games under the no PM, no/minimal special rules format. We've also got the classic series which are games basically like the one I ran for the first werewolf here, except the fool isn't a hidden role. We've also got several other long running institutions. The mafia or titans series are basically werewolf with two or more wolf groups. The smash bros and SEU series give absolutely everyone a special role, and includes neutrals. Much more complex, but also very fun games. We've also had games which really are not about the game thread so much as about the back room dealing. In games like Ravnica and Paranoia everyone was a "wolf". But they were all in different groups with different objectives, and allying was necessary to win. These games really do move most of the action out of the game thread, but they can also be a lot of fun. Now an issue that comes up a lot in discussions of PMs is the idea of powerlessness. That it makes regular villagers bored, because they won't be able to influence the vote unless they get drafted into the secret club of villagers. That clever arguments in thread are worth a lot less because the real discussion goes on behind the scenes. Now that is true. It's not a complete shut down of a players ability to influence the game, but it does detract from it. To that I would say the solution of eliminating PM's and/or special roles does work. But it can also end up being boring for regular villagers. Complexity can also work though. Making up new roles and new ways to play with those roles can be a lot of fun. If everyone can do something cool, then they will be able to influence the game even if they aren't a part of the network. Games with a choose your own role theme are good. Minigame style alternate victory routes for villagers can be good... I've seen a thousand ways of giving regular villagers extra stuff to do. Complexity isn't bad. I don't think PMs make things unbalanced. They could make stuff boring, but I don't think ultimate simplicity is necessarily the best way of dealing with that. Now: Secret roles. Perhaps I set a bad precedent by including one. I generally don't really like secret role games, unless all roles are secret and all players have a role. The way secret roles have played out in this game has been a huge reason for the quagmire that the thread has occasionally been. If they'd been layed out originally, things would probably have run a more conventional path. Sullla Wrote:I also think that making the game more and more complicated is a poor road to travel. You could do a game where there are no power/secret roles at all, simply villagers and werewolves. No PMs or private messages. That could be very interesting to see, although possibly too luck based. You have to give people something to talk about on day 1, though. Otherwise everyone will just vote randomly, and it's like a free kill for the wolves. Having power roles is a good way to give people something to talk about. I also liked the mayor role, for the same reason.
Never thought I'd say this but I'm glad to be dead
 From skimmimg this thread you can tell WW2 had stopped being fun for some of us. Nice to see Lewwyn's post implicating Roland - about time someone called him and Serdoa on their pretty much 100% bad voting. |
