Gaspar Wrote:Well, I never said I was sure, I said your post pointed very strongly. But no, I wouldn't bother even if I was sure. I've assailed the village with logic and reason all day and still we have our pointless vote pointed at Roland. I personally don't care about the fact that its Roland, his vote for himself stunt is completely counterproductive, and he basically has half-checked out of the game already. I care that its going to waste yet another lynch and we don't have time for that.
I probably won't be around when the results get posted. Hope you're all happy.
Get enough votes off me and onto scooter, or someone else I can believe is a 'Wolf, and I'll switch my vote off myself. At this point, no one's listening to you any more than they are listening to me, so where I put my vote means absolutely nothing.
I'll check in periodically to see if anyone ends up seeing the light and switching off me, but at this point even if Serdoa votes for scooter I'm still down 7 to 4. If I switch from myself to scooter, it's still only 6 to 5 - not even a tie. What are the odds someone here is going to switch, especially when half of them are starting to appear on our suspect list? Irgy's the only one I can see switching (Mr. Nice Guy and haphazard1 will stick together), and I doubt he'll change, even if he makes it back in time to do so. Lewwyn's dead set on me, scooter's not about to hang himself, and Rowain wants me dead as much as the rest.
The writing was on the wall before I ever cast my vote, Gaspar. Lewwyn's post is far too convincing for most to ignore, and those that know I'm a Villager are just going to get drowned up by those who want to kill a Villager. Besides, as he said: anything I say can be spun both ways, so technically I was dead before Kyan. It's all moot at this point. I'm still dead, and they're still wrong, but no one's going to believe it until Fire & Ice proves it. By then, it will be too late, and everyone will have talked themselves into it so well that there'll be no repercussions. After all, if Lewwyn, my trusted friend and Mason, thought I was a 'Wolf - and made such a convincing argument - who wouldn't also think so?
I understand your frustration Gaspar, and I know this looks like nothing more than petulance, but I assure you I've thought this through. Nothing I did between Lewwyn's post and now was ever going to change anything. It was a sealed deal before I ever said a word. As always, thank you for the support.
So, I am back from work and have read this thread and there is not enough time left to provide a great answer. I am not sold on Roland being a wolf but I am also not sure about him being a villager. The thing is, the evidence about him is partly the same as about scooter and me - bad votes. I know that it happens and that it doesn't need to mean that someone is truly a wolf. And really, should it not mean the contrary? Because a wolf clearly should know who is innocent and who is not and therefore should be able to make less suspicious votes.
But then thats not all there is to Roland. He also lied several times, something I don't like, even that it is part of the game. Much more then asking if it makes him wolfish because he lied I ask myself if it makes him wolfish because of WHAT he lied about. And then it gets harder to make a case against him in my opinion.
Finally, my decision came from a completely different direction: I have some power in deciding today between scooter and Roland. If I decide for scooter, it can get close, even with being so late in the day already. So do I want to get scooter lynched rather then Roland? I am not sure if even one of them is a wolf so how to decide on that? Given that I believe both are villagers, I vote for the one I feel is better off getting out of this game, the one I feel is burnt out and the one I feel less sure about as well: Roland.
Lynch:
Roland (8) : Roland, Irgy, Mr. Nice Guy, scooter, Lewwyn, Rowain; haphazard1, Serdoa
scooter (3): Gaspar, Sareln; Dantski
Sequence of Actions:
Roland votes Roland
Gaspar votes scooter
Irgy votes Roland
Mr. Nice Guy votes Roland
scooter votes Roland
Sareln votes scooter
Lewwyn votes Roland
Rowain votes Roland
haphazard1 votes Roland
Dantski votes scooter
You guys are an incredibly frustrating lot to deal with. At a bare minimum, Zakalwe-TT no longer sets the RB-WW standard for blindness, since at least he looked past his bias long enough to switch off.
The game is over, folks. There is no trusted network. At least half of the remaining players check in once a day, vote with the bandwagon and are done with it. There's no reason to actually post anything, as you're all so apathetic and checked out, there's very rarely even any vote-switching. The game ended when Kyan died, as he was the last villager who was actually able to convince anyone of anything who also had the ability to be objective. I guarantee you in the lurker thread they're all wondering what particular vintage of Chronic you've all been smoking that makes you think Roland of all flipping people was the best chance you had of nailing a wolf.
Yeah, I know this isn't helpful, but I don't actually care. Its unbelievably frustrating to have something so obvious sit in front of your face, argue your ass off, and have nobody see it. It was the same thing with the Sareln/uberfish lynch, if Kyan hadn't jumped on board, we would have had the same situation. I guess it shouldn't be surprising, we could barely get our act together when we had a seer and owl, coming up with every conceivable reason not to lynch scried wolves. We're sure as hell not getting anything together without said scries.
I just don't understand why you'd sign up for this if you don't actually want to play.
I've got some dirt on my shoulder, can you brush it off for me?
Gaspar, I understand your frustation. But then, why should anybody discuss? scooter did state it correctly, all who did want to discuss are still the high suspect targets. Be it Roland (whom I voted off as stated simply because he wanted to get out), scooter or myself. Nobody does take a second look at those who did not talk at all. And if scooter or myself state that, then we are accused of being a wolf trying to lynch an innocent. So, who exactly should discuss and why? Especially now when after this night we will have 33% wolves within the remaining villagers.
Apart from that, as everyone made so nice lists about the remaining villagers, I'll do that now as well. Of course none of those really have evidence as you can pretty much scrap voting records for all days just because of how this game evolved. That said:
Lewwyn: Stated he is the second Mason. Of course Kyan stated that as well. From all we know and from what happened today it could be another lie in the lie and in reality scooter is the second Mason. Probably revealed this night, so lets wait for that.
Gaspar: Was often suspected to be a wolf but never ended in a really close situation. Wanted to play "his" game. I am still not convinced he is a villager but that only means that I have no reason to believe one way or the other as of now.
scooter: Getting "saved" on Day 6 by a lynch on Roland. I trust his opinion most in the village, simply because he is much like me re-questioning everything we are told instead of simply believing. His voting records are bad though, but so are mine.
haphazard1, Irgy, Mr. Nice Guy: I have no clue. You guys are talking not even one more bit then absolutely necessary. I understand - as written above - why some might refrain from discussions but that is our only chance to win. Simply voting and then disappearing doesn't help at all. Especially for the next days, you guys have to come forward and help us determine together who is most likely a wolf.
Dantski: Scried villager. Not that much interested at all or so it seems. Probably would have been long lynched already if not for the scry. What to say other then the village probably could use a more vocal villager better.
Sareln: We don't talk about him because he voted for himself on Day 1 and was saved on Day 4. That makes him in the eyes of most a villager. That might very well be, but we don't really know for sure. If he is a wolf then he will probably win them the game as there is no way anyone ever will vote for him.
Rowain: Not that vocal the last days - but then, who was except for those that needed to defend themselves? I was nearly putting him up with Irgy, Mr. Nice Guy and haphzard1 but I somehow have the feeling that he is talking more then those guys. At least in situation where it really is necessary to talk. Again one of those who do not believe everything told.
Possible wolves:
- Mr. Nice Guy
- Gaspar
- Rowain / scooter
Though obviously that might change, especially for those not talking at all. As for why Mr. Nice Guy is no. 1: Nothing helpful I can remember, voting record is ... interesting and either he is a WW or Gaspar. That is something I am sure about. And I simply suspect him more then Gaspar.
Serdoa Wrote:But then, why should anybody discuss? scooter did state it correctly, all who did want to discuss are still the high suspect targets.
Agreed and additional whom should we discuss?
Lewwyn He is 2nd Mason so no need to discuss here. Dantski, Irgy, Sareln They post so little that there is not much to discuss about them. The only interesting note: Sareln has been twice near the chop when a WW was lynched so I think he is most likely a villager. Gaspar I have already talked so much about Gaspar that I'm tired of it. He was near the chop on Day 2 and I must confess I would rather have Meiz now instead of him but that is all past. scooter He would be a good point. There has been alot of posts concerning him but otoh he is one of the few that really speak up. haphazard1 He doen't post that much but i find his posts always contain good points and alot of reason. for me the least likely wolf after Lewwyn. Mr Nice Guy A good point he has been off the radar for most of the time but what speaks in his favor (in my eyes) is that he wanted to lynch Gaspar and brought good reasons for it too. Serdoa A tough case. On one hand I'm inclined to think him villager otoh as Lewwyn once did describe his and scooters postings: Opportunistic, ambivalent, deflective, slippery and defiant
But meanwhile Lewwyn has changed his mind at least a bit concerning scooter.
