[SPOILERS]PBEM14 - Serdoa (Fin/Agg Mongols)

[Serdoa]

Don't read if you are a player
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And don't scroll further down.

[Serdoa]

80 views without any content? Great, lets see how many more I get with content

Ok, I guess you all eagerly wait for me to tell anything about this game, especially whats going on in that war with Lewwyn. I will post screenies and stuff, but for now, what did happen?

A History of PBEM14 from Turn 1 to Turn 40 from a Mongolian viewpoint

I started the game, I found gold nearby with my scout, I moved my settler, I settled, I got pigs, wheat and the gold online. I teched away happily ... and realized finally that I should build a settler

In the meantime I talked with scooter and exchanged some map info. He was really far away from me (like 20+ tiles) and still the first I met so I thought this would be a big map and we would all have much space to expand into - rendering my UU kinda useless what I was not to happy about. But then I met Lewwyn near me and Gaspar and Sandover - well, I met only there units I still don't know exactly where they are located. But I knowed where Lewwyn was and he was quite near - extremely near given where scooter is located and where Gaspar and Sandover probably are located.

After my settler was finished, I wanted to move him westwards as .. well, to the north are 2 tiles Tundra, to the east is ocean and to the south is Lewwyn so where else to move? No great sites were nearby (sorta) but instead two of Lewwyns warriors. That had me move the settler somewhat ... ineffecient. Anyway, he finally landed on a hill tile and I built the city. I have no resources in first ring unfortunately what is bad for a second city but getting them in first ring had meant to move up on Lewwyn or moving even farther west. Well or settling next to the cap and using its resources what I felt was unnecessary. Anyway, not my best play probably, but I was pretty busy the last weeks (and will be, but I thought I owe you all to at least take one evening to let you know whats going on) so I played rather sloppy and sleepy.

Finally my city was settled and I chopped out a monument, moved my warriors around and - pretty much I screwed around not really being focussed. Thats a picture of the land one turn before I settle my second city:



Don't read if you are playing PB4:

I can understand now better how Adlain can be in the position he is in - it is sometimes really easy to play along without even realizing that you are actually not doing anything

I did build some warriors though, because I wanted to grow my cap and knowed that I would need them anyway. I saw a city from Lewwyn pop up llike 6-7 tiles away from my city and was worried. Then another city popped up next to my 2nd city. What did that mean for me?

1. Lewwyn has at least 3 cities when I have only 2 - bad. (I still haven't checked the diplo screen...)
2. Lewwyn is extremely aggressively planting cities. I follow him in PBEM6 already so I know that he does not screw around like others.
3. Lewwyn does not like me, for whatever reason, so if he thinks he can screw my game, he probably will do it. Maybe even for the expense of his game.

So, measures had to be taken and I declared war. I got 3 warriors next to that aggressive city, I think 2 or 3 turns after it was planted. Another warrior got next to his second city.

Now, imagine the situation: In the aggressive city he has 2 warriors, while I have 3 on it. In the other city he has 1 warrior against mine. I thought myself pretty lucky and demanded that he would gift the aggressive city. For a settler I would gift back to him of course (I wanted to find a agreeable solution). Unfortunately the next save I get he has in both cities an axe. Both surely upgraded - the aggressive city cannot have produced enough hammers already for an axe and the second city didn't have its warrior anymore and it is nowhere seen nearby.

I was not really prepared for that. But I have teched Archery and have my first archer produced already. In a hill city with 1 border pop, those guys will be 6.6 str without fortification. With it they will be 7.35 I think.

Base Str: 3
Fort. Bonus: 25%
Hill Bonus: 25%
City Bonus: 50%
City Defenses: 20%
Hill Defenses: 25%
------------------------
Total: 3 + 145% = 7.35

And with a wall (yeah, Masonry is finished T42 or T43) it will be 8.85. Let me know if my math is off please.

Also I will settle copper shortly. As I have (obviously) Hunting already as well, I can then produce Spears or Axes - hopefully enough that I can settle the nearby Horses. Mine are unfortunately not as near as those of scooter (they even wouldn't be as near if I had settled in place). Probably because of my UU, but that sucks right now

So, thats the story till T40 around. There are some things I do not understand still, for example why Lewwyn even choose to settle that aggressively - for me that is the same as declaring war and he has to know that. And I don't think there was a reason to do that anyway, that land there is not that great that he couldn't have found better spots somewhere else. I told scooter in my last email to him that I feel that Lewwyn simply still holds a grudge against me for something and therefore decided to throw away our games only to spite me. Because honestly, what else did he hope to achieve when he settled that city?

[Serdoa]

So, some more info on the past - or to be more exact, some pictures

T0, Starting the game



T0, Final Position



T2, I started with researching Mining. I think because I wanted to get Gold online - before I realized that ... well, I won't work gold before the city is not at least size 3. Build was a Worker, pretty standard



T7, I am researching Agri next, still building the worker. Agri was necessary because it was fast enough finished, had I gone for AH after Mining I couldn't have researched it in time - of course, I should not have researched Mining at the start to begin with. Or build a warrior first and go for Mining - BW (but I think that wouldn't have been good either).



T12, I am researching AH and know quite something about the map. Still I haven't met anyone so I believed that I actually have some way to my neighbours



T25, known techs

[Serdoa]

So, lets get to the war itself. If you would like something regarding the past, ask.

T39, I realize that there is a city which should not be there - or it should be brown at least



Fortunately I had troops nearby and so moved in: start of T40



At the end of T40 the warrior in the south moved 1NW onto the forest with the road. The two workers in Beshbalik moved 1S of the city and built a road. The warrior from the city as well as the one 1E of it moved onto the pigs next to Mt. Nebo. And the warrior 1NE,1E of Mt. Nebo moved 1W next to Mt. Nebo.

That led to 3 agg warriors next to his city when he had only 2 warriors for defence. Should have been enough but he spends 118 gold to upgrade 2 warriors to axes on T41, leading to the following retreat



I used the warrior in the south to cut the road, holding back reinforcements hopefully. And I couldn't save him no matter where I moved too, so I thought thats the best I can do with him.

In the north my settler is heading to the copper and my workers are building a road connection. My warriors have retreated from his city, no way I can hurt axes with them. Doesn't look good, but as you can see Archers are already in the queue and if I hadn't need to whip a warrior in Beshbalik to have another warrior against Lewwyns warrior I would have whipped an archer already.

[Serdoa]

T42, no screenshots but I sacrifice the warrior coming from the cap to kill Lewwyns warrior which was 2N, 1E of Beshbalik. I also moved the Archer finished in the cap last turn in the direction of Beshbalik.

T43, 1 axe, 1 warrior near Beshbalik could be scary - but I have 3 warriors in there. If he attacks, there are at least 1, probably 2 left. Thats enough to get that archer 1NE of the city into it and 1 more whipped next turn (city grew after I hit end turn).

More important are the workers in the north. I am making a second road connection because the one near Beshablik is in danger. Turfan (the copper city) itself is putting 2 hammers into an archer. I hadn't hit end turn when I took the screenshot, so the archer in the cap will be finished as well.

[Serdoa]

T44, I am greeted with this screen



Yeah, walls could prove... helpful

As for the situation at the start of the turn:



First, there is a chariot from scooter in the west. I am pretty convinced that he will attack me because he told me in some emails that he would not want to tip the scales of this conflict in my favor and that he does not want Lewwyn as enemy - I didn't know when to expect him, but I expected him.

Lewwyn himself brought two axes near the battlefield - you can see them 1SE of Mt. Nebo. He moved his axe-warrior-pair onto the hill east of Beshbalik. What he didn't know before he moved there is that I had an archer directly behind it. Are 3 warriors and one archer enough to kill an axe? Well... yes. I attacked first with my 3 warriors out of Beshbalik, the first one damaging it to 4.4, the second not doing anything and the third getting the axe to 2.2 (I think). That was good enough that my archer got something like 73% odds on it, even wenn attacking across the river. He was successful, getting 4 XP in the process and remaining at 1.4 health.

Now, if my 3 warriors hadn't scratched the axe (enough) then I would have moved my archer into the city. Together with the one whipped there this turn, I surely could hold out against an axe and a warrior.

So at the end of turn, the situation looks like this:



In the south, Lewwyns axes are 3 turns from attacking me. Actually thats 2 turns for me, as I am playing after him. That attack will not work though, as I have 1 pop whipped Beshbalik this turn, so that it finished producing the archer in its queue which was at 10/16 hammers. Together with the 20 hammers from the whip plus the one from the city center I am at 31/16 hammers for that archer. So it finished at the EOT and I have still 15/16 hammers for the next archer. Again the 1 hammer from the city center will be added next turn, so EOT45 I have 2 archers in there for sure. If Lewwyn attacks with the warrior my archer across the river and isn't successful, then I will have even 3 in there, one with a promotion. Of course, Lewwyn could attack my city with the archer in it, but thats 6.6 str vs 2 str. If he takes that fight AND wins it, then I simply retire...

In the east my caps archer (finished end of last turn) was moved to the west in the direction of Beshbalik. As you can see, he is still free to go to the copper city if needed. The cap itself produced a worker. Yeah, a worker, not an axe or other war-stuff. Why? Because I cannot double-whip an axe nor can I double-whip a barracks - for both I would need to put in at least 1 hammer and at most 2 hammers so that I do not incur the 50%-whip-from-scratch-penalty but still can double-whip. And as you can see I would have to work 2/0/0 tiles to produce that less hammers. Not worth it in my opinion. I would do that if it would be necessary of course, but I don't think it is. So instead, I started a worker this turn. Not only will he be able to chop me troops out, I also don't have to "pay" food to the unhappy citizen. So, next turn I'll whip the worker and the turn after I'll finish an axe with the overflow - or a barracks for shock-axes, haven't decided yet.

In the north, my workers have finished the second road connection to the copper city. Which does work as "lumberjack-road" as well Next turn all 3 workers will move on one tile together and finish the chop right away. Depending on what scooter does I'll either finish a already start archer, work on the spear or switch to an axe.

I think for how that started it doesn't look that bad. I still don't understand why Lewwyn settled that aggressively. He clearly intended to go to war with me for some time already as he saved money to upgrade troops. But either I got really lucky with my war declaration and he was unprepared at that time - but then, why settle that aggressively in the first place when you are not ready for it - or he underestimated me pretty harshly. Either way, he'll going to bleed for it.

[novice]

Excellent update and well fought!

[Serdoa]

Thanks novice

What is missing though is diplo. You all probably have read it in other threads already, but I'll dump it here anyway.

[SIZE="3"]Lewwyn[/SIZE]

[COLOR="SeaGreen"]Greetings Serdoa,

Our warrior the great Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart has encounter your traveling warrior! As such I'm please to extent our greetings and well wishes. You are the second person we have encountered. We met Scooter earlier when he happened upon our city. I trust you are doing well? You and Scooter both appear to have started off excellently. I have heard from Scooter that he is NW of me (and thus NW of our scouting warriors) and that you are NE of me (and thus our scouting warriors). This is correct? I am not far South of these warriors.

Other than this I hope we may get along in the future and I look forward to more conversations. I believe our interactions will be much less tense than those we shared during WW. :P

Lewwyn[/COLOR]

Greeting message and pretty long for it. I did not really read it as I had no time for that. Probably should have before I answered...

[COLOR="Sienna"]Hi Lewwyn,

I am pressed for time today, so I can't answer your questions right now. But I'll give you a reply, probably tomorrow evening.

Kind regards,

Serdoa[/COLOR]

[COLOR="sienna"]Hi Lewwyn,

your assumptions are correct, though I guess you know that already, with seeing my borders

Have you met anyone else recently? I am still trying to get contact with more people then scooter and you.

Kind regards,

Serdoa[/COLOR]

[COLOR="SeaGreen"]Hey, I just found Sandover... or rather his scout found me. I gave him directions to you, though he's pretty far. If you want to meet him faster you should send a scout due west of your current city. Then when you pass the peaks you go south. He's coming up around those peaks from the south.

I still haven't met Gaspar though.

Lewwyn[/COLOR]

That all happened between the 13th to the 19th April. We then didn't have any more contact till I declared war, sending this

[COLOR="Sienna"]Lewwyn,

I don't agree with your latest city plant - Mt. Nebo. Putting a city directly at my borders AFTER you knowed that I am there and how close that is to my capital is a blunt move in my book. I won't let myself get boxed in by you. So when you receive the save you will see that we are at war. I have 3 warriors next to the offending city and another one at the city below it. I see now two possibilities:

- You try to go through with that. As you will realize when you read other PBEMs I played in, that means that I will go for you - constantly and as my only game target.

- You gift me the offending city. In return, I will gift you a settler within the next 12 turns (including travel time). Also you won't settle above Eureka - and with that I mean the city tile itself, not its borders. There won't be any of your cities further north. As information for you: Above my cap is a one tile wide tundra and then ice. So it is not like I try to extort any land out of you, I only ask for a fair border. And to be clear on that: Even Eureka is slightly aggressive as I moved my starting settler north.

- You won't start a culture war in Eureka, the rice tile 1NW/1N of it will be conceded to me.

Those terms are in my opinion very favorable for you. Taking your clear intention to screw me into account they are probably more then I should offer. Be aware that if you don't take this offer, there won't be another one like it.

Kind regards,

Serdoa[/COLOR]

And his answer:

[COLOR="SeaGreen"]Game on. War for the rest of the game sounds great to me. Though I don't think you'll live to see the end of the game.

Maybe you shouldn't have moved north.[/COLOR]

Over confident. I don't like the style at all to be honest. Having now encountered war with several players, I would Lewwyn put amongst those I would rather not have to deal with diplomatically ever again.

[Serdoa]

[SIZE="3"]Gaspar[/SIZE]

Not much talk between us at all. His greeting message on the 22nd, answers on the 23rd:

[COLOR="DeepSkyBlue"]Serdoa,

It appears our civilizations have met in game, as my scout made the rare and exciting 2 for 1 contact last turn. I'm off for work but didn't want to be rude and not say hello... so hello!

Anything exciting in Mongolia? Are the hordes ready to sweep across the steppes just yet? Maya is pretty quiet, other than the whole predicting the end of the world thing. I'll have more to say at some later date when I'm not about to dash off.

Well met,

Prophet Gaspar[/COLOR]

[COLOR="Sienna"]Gaspar,

hello to you as well. In Mongolia everthing goes it's way. I am not sure if Lewwyn is up to something (he has two warriors near my borders) but apart from that it is just farming, mining and building

Kind regards,

Serdoa[/COLOR]

[COLOR="DeepSkyBlue"]Serdoa,

I'd say my general read on Lewwyn is that he's always up to something. Good luck if it works out that way, and good luck building if not.

Regards to you as well,

Gaspar[/COLOR]

[Serdoa]

[SIZE="3"]Sandover[/SIZE]

[COLOR="yellow"]Serdoa,

Tell me everything you know.

His Dark Lordship, Pharaoh Sandover[/COLOR]

[COLOR="Sienna"]Pharaoh Sandover,

I know nothing.

Serdoa[/COLOR]

[COLOR="yellow"]Serdoa,

That's a shame. I was hoping you'd be useful.

His Dark Lordship, Pharaoh Sandover[/COLOR]

[COLOR="sienna"]Sandover,

I am useful - without me, your game would not continue :P

Serdoa[/COLOR]

[COLOR="yellow"]Serdoa,

Well... yeah. That's hardly worth cheering about though.

His Dark Lordship, Pharaoh Sandover[/COLOR]

[COLOR="sienna"]Sandover,

you get a world to play with every day from me and thats hardly worth cheering about? YOU should bow before ME for this grateful act.

Oh, speaking about this world - have you met all others already or are you still in search for someone?

Kind regards,
Serdoa[/COLOR]

[COLOR="yellow"]Serdoa,

I know nothing.[/COLOR]

Uh well, didn't go as expected. I meant that funny and actually my last message was meant to get us from making jokes to making real deals. Unfortunately Sandover - as I found out later - couldn't laugh about that at all.