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kjn · February 2nd, 2012, 18:21

Yes! The Empy shrine would be very helpful. I also think the Order shrine would be nice - excellent priests, money, and more law mana (reduced maintenance costs and free level 1 spells are always good, even when the spell is crappy).

Selrahc · February 2nd, 2012, 19:36

Quote:Don't know - at least I haven't seen any mention of it. Perhaps it's time for another peek from the ancient tower? White would probably also allow us to get better visibility on his land, and then there's always hawks.

The Illian temple of the Hand is a Pagan temple equivalent, available at mysticism. The computer is not particularly adept at its usage, to the point where I think it will only build it in situations where it would normally build a pagan temple. It's a very early building though, so he has the *potential* to build it.

You can tell if has been building them without up to date scouting of his land. Changed terrain will show up through the fog. Aside from finding the temple of the hands, it also acts as a location finder for Hyborem.

kjn · February 4th, 2012, 09:26

Hart, you OK?

Hart · February 4th, 2012, 10:41

kjn Wrote:Hart, you OK?

RARGH. Um. Yes!

I will play and report tomorrow. Sincere apologies for the huge delay. I offer no excuse other than I am an Australian and thus have no moral compass, due to being descended from convicts, etc.

Hart

Okay, turn played.
Slight problem though, didn't really take screenshots of some of these opening turns. And most of this is actually written post-play, with only a few notes being taken during the turn.

[INDENT]t139:
Moved the Thane to "capture" the Ljos worker, and moved 1N to the forest.
I decide to move up the promotable axes right now - once the road on the sheep tile is complete, the M1 axes can move up almost immediately to Oxford.

t140:

The Ljos archer moves off the copper, and destroys the worker, as predicted.

A warrior moves down to protect the copper. The Thane moves to support him. I expect that the Archer will try to move back to the copper, attacking this unit. I keep moving the axes up towards Oxford.

A second hunter surfaces near Bruti. If I wasn't already trying to knock out any raiding units, now getting rid of those Hunters will be pretty crucial.

t141:
Again, as predicted, the Archer moves back west to the copper. One of the Hunters moves up as well.

I send an Axe up to say hello to the Hunter, and he wins. That leaves the Archer. So I send a Warrior from Oxford to take him out - he's already at half damage and the odds were quite high!

t142:
Archery is nearly complete, and we are at our minimum gold reserve. I decide that going down to 30% research now will be better than trying to reclaim 40 gold...

Oxford immediately begins building an Archery range, due in 7 turns.

The second hunter moves 1S of our main stack. Instead of weakening the stack, I send a M1,C1 Axe from Coimbra to deal with it...

With great success. We just managed to take out all short-term raiding threats with just 1 warrior lost.

Our main stack moves west into our territory.

t143: A busy time.
We move to attack Bruti.
These are our forces at the beginning of the turn.

Our total losses are 1 Axe, and 2 Warriors. 3 for 5 isn't bad at all.
Edit: To be clear, Bruti was razed on the basis that we can't solidly defend another vulnerable city aside from oxford

In domestic matters, Archery is complete. I select Philosophy as the next tech, which will be complete in 13 turns.

Salamanca has completed its Hunting Lodge, and begins building a Hawk. This will turn Coimbra into an effective scouting point itself.

Bologna has completed an Axeman. I queue up one more for good measure (overflow also dictates this will be done in 1 turn.) After this, it'll continue with the Stable.

t145:
Our Hawk arrives and is sent to Coimbra to scout Os-G's remaining cities (Since we have two targets I queue up another Hawk). And the results are very interesting.

Tongurstad is ridiculous. Without BW Os-G cannot improve the city at all. AI = smoke

In our hands, however, it could be very productive...

The only redeeming factor for Grottiburg is being the Empy holy city.

I do a bit of a dance with the scout in NW corner, and find SIX BEARS and 3 barbarian archers in Spilan! They might be a very nice source of happiness once we get some Hunters up.

Speaking of hunters, in a not-so gross oversight I let the Temple of Kilmorph in Salamanca get a turn of production. It can be completed in 1 turn, and we need more gold to offset our upkeep, so I figure to let it come in. After that, a Hunter.

t146:
A Fawn attacks our lookout near Evermore!

This is actually good. Fawns are 90 hammers, while a Hunter is 60 hammers. If Amelanchier is content to waste his hammer bonus on units we can dispatch just as effectively, then good on him. The only bad thing is that he might take out an Axe that auto-moved into an adjacent tile...

t147:
The Fawn loses to our Axeman!

Our second hawk arrives, and I send it to look at the immediate west of Salamanca by accident. This reveals a budding Barbarian Empire to our immediate west!

t148:
I relocate the second hawk to Coimbra, so we now have total visibility of both Evermore and Grottiburg.

...it would appear he can build two hunters in as many turns.

t149:

Bologna finishes its first Horseman. I allow automated moves to go through, and then stop.
[/INDENT]
And thats that.

Some graphs and the save. Pictures will come later.

Your thoughts, gentlemen?

kjn · February 5th, 2012, 04:41

Can't check the save until tomorrow, but it seems like solid tactical play, and some great luck in the battle around Bruti. How many XP did that lucky first axe pick up?

We had a settler in the queue in Bologna, that we should've finished before the stable, I think. We might get some hammer decay there now, I'm afraid.

Did you keep Bruti or raze it? If you razed it, I think we should get a settler down there ASAP to found a city by the rice.

Also, I think we should promote our Subdue Animal scout to a Hunter. That way we can start capturing bears in a few turns time, and get some more growth in Paris and Oxford.

Hart · February 5th, 2012, 05:01

kjn Wrote:Can't check the save until tomorrow, but it seems like solid tactical play, and some great luck in the battle around Bruti. How many XP did that lucky first axe pick up?

We had a settler in the queue in Bologna, that we should've finished before the stable, I think. We might get some hammer decay there now, I'm afraid.

Did you keep Bruti or raze it? If you razed it, I think we should get a settler down there ASAP to found a city by the rice.

Also, I think we should promote our Subdue Animal scout to a Hunter. That way we can start capturing bears in a few turns time, and get some more growth in Paris and Oxford.

The Axeman is at 10 or something, i believe. Pretty good odds.

I did think on the settler but I wasn't sure.

Bruti was razed. I figured that Bruti itself was too exposed (no defensive bonuses, existing path directly to Evermore) and that the AI would want to reclaim it. As it stands Oxford is fairly secure, we now have Horsemen who can rapidly respond to threats, so its a much safer bet now.

There should be funds free to promote that Scout up to a Hunter on this turn.

Brian Shanahan · February 5th, 2012, 08:27

I'll have a look at the save this evening. Will be watching the match before then, so won't have time.

Hart · February 5th, 2012, 08:53

Oh for...

I am terrible this week. I've got work tomorrow (new job, partial cause for my delay) and I've just been so absorbed by this book. I'll make sure to post images ASAP tomorrow.

kjn · February 5th, 2012, 12:16

Well, I usually take a couple of screenshots when I first open the save.

Anyway, I think one more hunter to go capture some bears, supported by an axe or two, can contain Spilan. Should we send over a few veteran axes towards Spilan, or take the town with new construction? (I think the latter.) Raze or keep?

Also, if we are serious about the Mines, I think we should research Arete now. We're quite a bit into the game, and has hardly done any beelining so far (as evidenced by Os-Gabella snatching the Bone Palace, and Auric the Heron Throne). If we were the only ones with RoK I wouldn't be worried, but we're not.

Not surprised on the budding barbarian empire to the west.

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