Map/Difficulty: Random Continents, semi-balanced
Speed: Quick
Players: 4-6
Bans: Standard PBEM bans. Corps, nukes, War Elephants (except Khmer), Random Events, Vassal States, Barbarians, AP cheese, Swap Religion/Civic espionage missions. No banned leaders/civs
Diplo: Up for discussion
Winning: The first player to receive 500 Victory Points wins the PBEM. Victory Points are received by completing objectives.
Setup:
-After all signups are filled, the players must secretly PM Mist with what role they would like to play.
-A turn order will be rolled, followed by a snake pick, followed by starts being revealed.
Notices:
-Every time your score increases past an increment of 50 (50, 100, etc.), please post your achievement in the public scorekeeping thread.
-You are under no obligation to share your role.
10 points for owning Angkor Wat, Creative Construction HQ, Mining Inc. HQ, Moai Statues
20 points for owning Cristo Redentor, Hagia Sophia, Hanging Gardens, Pyramids, Three Gorges Dam
50 points for owning Ironworks
1 point per each 10 points of MFG score in a turn ( rolling, current turn only )
1 point for each owned :
Dike, Levee, Shale Plant
2 points for each owned :
Forge, Mint
3 points for each owned
Factory, Industrial Park
5 points for each owned
Assembly Plant
Merchant
1 point for each of following techs known :
Currency, Banking, Economics, Corporation, Metal Casting, Code of Laws, Mining, Constitution, The Wheel, Alphabet, Pottery, Sailing, Paper, Railroad, Industrialism, Monarchy, Civil Service, Guilds, Fascism, Mass Media, Agriculture, Writing, Mathematics, Printing Press, Flight
10 points for each Great Merchant born
10 points for owning Aluminium Co, Jewelers Inc., Creative Construction, Mining Inc., Standard Ethanol, any of the Shrines, Spiral Minaret
20 points for owning Cereal Mills, Sid Sushi, Colossus, Eiffel Tower, Statue of Liberty, United Nations, Versailles
30 points for owning Temple of Artemis
40 points for owning Great Lighthouse
50 points for owning Wall Street
1 point for each 10 gold income per turn ( rolling, current turn only )
1 point for each 10 beakers produced in a turn ( rolling, current turn only )
10 points for owning Aluminium Co., National Park, Red Cross, Standard Ethanol, Oracle
20 points for owning Space Elevator
30 points for owning University of Sankore
40 points for owning Great Library
50 points for owning Oxford University
1 point for each owned :
Academy, Monastery (of any religion), Seowon, University
1 point for each 10 culture output in a turn ( rolling, current turn only )
10 points for owning Jewelers Inc., Heroic Epic, Mt. Rushmore, National Epic
20 points for owning Notre Dame, Parthenon, Statue of Zeus, Hermitage, Taj Mahal, Mausoleum of Mausollos
30 points for owning Broadway, Hollywood, Rock N Roll
40 points for owning Globe Theatre, Sistine Chapel
1 point for first religion in owned city
2 points for second religion in owned city
3 points for third religion in owned city
etc.
10 point for owning Moai Statues, Temple of Artemis
20 points for owning Shwedagon Paya, Stonehenge, Apostolic Palace, Oracle, Spiral Minaret, Chichen Itza
40 points for owning a Shrine ( of any religion )
50 points for owning Angkor Wat
1 point for each owned :
Temple ( of any religion )
2 points for each owned :
Madrassa, Obelisk, Cathedral ( of any religion )
General
1 point for each of following techs known
:
Physics, Artillery, Archery, Rocketry, Bronze Working, Construction, Industrialism, Civil Service, Radio, Guilds, Steel, Optics, Flight, Military Tradition, The Wheel, Machinery, Combustion, Astronomy, Compass, Chemistry, Sailing, Iron Working, Military Science, Advanced Flight, Hunting
10 points for each Great General born
1 point for each population point in a razed city
2 points for each population point in a conquered and kept city ( as long as it stays under conquerorâs control )
10 points for owning Chichen Itza, Globe Theatre, Heroic Epic, Mt. Rushmore, Red Cross, Statue of Zeus
20 points for owning Great Wall, Pentagon
40 points for owning West Point
1 point for each owned :
Bomb Shelters, Bunker, Hospital, Jail, Mausoleum, Military Academy, Trading Post
I had the this idea randomly come to me back when we were randomly kicking around ideas for the Demogame, and I think it might work for a PBEM.
Generally, the objective will be to obtain the most points, similarly to an Epic. I think there should be global objectives which are pretty general, and personal objectives that are yours and yours alone. Examples of the former are things like 'Build Stonehenge, 2 points,' 'Win by any means, 20 points' and 'Be the first in GNP in 1 AD, 10 points.' Examples of the latter could be mundane 'Possess at least 5 cities by 1 AD, 2 points' to more difficult 'Possess at least 10 cities by 500 AD while maintaining at least a 20% research rate, 15 points' to... strange 'Ensure that no civilizations that are still alive in 1 AD are eliminated, 20 points.'
Details will need to be worked out, and there will definitely need to be a lot of balancing, but is there any interest for this? I need to run off now.
Thinking about it, public objectives probably can't be balanced, except for 'Win by any means possible.'
I think that all objectives should be private, and each player should have the same number of them. Objectives are broken down by category, difficulty, and time period. The harder the objective, the more points it scores. I think the players should be able to request the Category/Difficulty/Time Period of their objectives.
The Categories are things like Economic, Expansion, Military, Culture, Religion, Diplomatic, and possibly World Police. The Difficulties should be Easy, Medium, Hard, and Very Hard, where Easy is 'you have to be trying to not get these points,' while Very Hard is 'having to bend your entire civ to this goal.' Time Period is generally what era they are in: Ancient, Classical, Medieval, Renaissance, and End of Game.
Each player sends in a PM to whoever is in charge of these objectives, stating the 10 preferred objectives they'd like and 5 backup objectives. The GM then gives them their exact objectives.
Example:
1. Religious/Medieval/Medium
2. Financial/Classical/Very Hard
3. Military/Ancient/Hard
4. Expansion/End of Game/Easy
1. Found two of Islam, Christianity, Confucianism, Taoism (5 points)
2. Research Mathematics, Monarchy, and Civil Service by 300 AD (20 points)
3. Capture at least one capital by 1 AD (10 points)
4. Have five cities at any point (2 points)
Map/Difficulty: Emperor/Flat or Prince/Torodial. Fairly standard map, with room for expansion. Not too cramped. No tricks.
Speed: Quick
Players: 5
Bans: Standard PBEM bans. Spies, corps, nukes, War Elephants (even Ballista), Random Events, Vassal States, Barbarians, the AP. Leaders/civs banned: India, Inca, Sury, all non-Wang Kong Financial leaders
Diplo: AI with Banter or Public
Winning: The player who receives the most Victory Points wins the PBEM. Victory Points are received by completing objectives that are given out to each player
Setup:
-After all signups are filled, the players will be given their objectives in their respective spoiler threads or by PM.
-A turn order will be rolled, followed by a snake pick, followed by starts being revealed.
Notices:
-I will randomly assign the objectives, ensuring that each objective is handed out once (like a deck of cards) and that each player receives an equal number of objectives from each difficulty. Each player should receive 3 Easy, 3 Medium, 2 Hard, 2 Very Hard, and the 'Win by any means' objective.
-There will be 'Be #1 in XXX in the year YY' type of objectives. During the turn mentioned in the objective, you must take a screenshot of the Demographics screen right before you press 'Enter.' You may not do anything except press 'Enter' and end your turn after the Demographics screen is viewed. This screenshot will be the one used for official scoring purposes.
-There will be a public scoring thread, where the GM will post whenever a player completes an objective. The score will be updated whenever someone completes an objective.
-You are under no obligation to share your objectives. You may if you wish.
-I'll be willing to play if someone else will GM. I'm fine with GM-ing, though.
-Any help on balancing the objectives would be appreciated. I've tried to make them balanced, but I'm just one person who has only player in 1 MP match. Any bans I've forgotten? Any mistakes I've made?
[SIZE="3"]Objectives:[/SIZE]
Common dates:
1000 BC (T60)
1 AD (T85)
400 AD (T95)
1000 AD (T110)
1500 AD (T130)
Easy - 4 Points
[SPOILER]
Build an Axeman by 1000 BC (T60)
Build at least five Scouts before 1 AD
Have 10 non-Warrior military units in 1 AD
Generate a Great Prophet by 200 AD (T84)
Be 1st, 2nd, or 3rd in GNP in 400 AD
Have at least 60% of your cities (rounded up) have popped borders in 400 AD
Get at least 10 gold per turn from shrines in 400 AD
Be the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd most populous civilization in 400 AD
Be 1st, 2nd, or 3rd in Crop Yield in 1500 AD
Be in the top half of the power rankings (rounded up) (Eg. 3rd or higher with 5 civs, 2nd with 3 or 2 civs) in Power in 1500 AD
Experience at least two Golden Ages by 1500 AD
Conquer at least three cities by the end of the game
Found at least two religions by the end of the game
Reach 20% of total land area by the end of the game
Have Open Borders with at least three civilizations at once
Medium - 10 Points
Construct four Libraries by 1 AD
Experience a Golden Age before 1 AD
Raze at least one city by 1 AD
Be 1st or 2nd in Crop Yield in 1 AD
Be 1st or 2nd in Power in 400 AD
Ensure that all your cities have at least two units garrisoning them in 400 AD
Have Open Borders with all civilizations at once in 400 AD, excluding those that you have gone to war with
Be 1st or 2nd in GNP in 1000 AD
Be 1st or 2nd in Population in 1000 AD
Be 1st or 2nd in Population in 1500 AD
Be 1st or 2nd in Power in 1000 AD
Raze four cities by 1000 AD
Have the most gold in the bank in 1000 AD
Construct six Temples by 1000 AD
Construct a Cathedral by 1000 AD
Circumnavigate the globe (even if the map doesn't have any water)
Hard - 15 Points
Be the first to 7 cities
Raze at least two cities before 1 AD
Hire ten Scientists in 400 AD
Be the 1st in Crop Yield in 400 AD
Be the 1st in Production in 1000 AD
Be the first to adopt Bureaucracy
Control four holy cities by the end of the game
Declare war on two civilizations only
Capture a city from three different civilizations
Receive a city through diplomacy
Very Hard - 20 Points
Construct four of Stonehenge/Great Wall/Oracle/Temple of Artemis/Pyramids
Be 1st in GNP AND MFG in 1 AD
Research Liberalism before 1000 AD
Never lose a city before 1000 AD
Ensure that four of the Top Five cities are controlled by you in 1500 AD
Conquer two capitals in the Medieval Era or later
Be the first to Music AND Liberalism
Never adopt Slavery
Ensure that three of your rivals survive until the end of the game
Capture one city founded by each of your rivals (one from PLAYER 1, one from PLAYER 2, etc.)
Win by any means
I think a point based game could be fun, but my suggestion would be to keep the scoring system as simple as possible. Having too many scoring categories with too wide of a variation in points risks turning the game into 'who can figure out the optimal scoring path' which I assume you don't want.
This reads to me very much like designing a single player tournament event that has custom scenario scoring.
The answer to "is there potential in this idea?" is virtually always yes. The devil is in the details and the execution. For this idea to work, we would need a sponsor to work through all those specific categories and point values, to produce a fully fledged game proposal. PBEMs 32 and 39 have pulled this off successfully, with SevenSpirits and Commodore taking charge of designing the specifications.
If you want to see this happen, you should step up with a fully formed proposal. Work those examples into real stuff. I'm not sure whether you're angling to be a player or if you just want to watch such a game?
I do think the concept of having an objective or mission based game could be a good one. It needs to be fleshed out a bit more, but I love the idea of shaking up the traditional PBEM with different victory conditions.
sunrise089 Wrote:I think a point based game could be fun, but my suggestion would be to keep the scoring system as simple as possible. Having too many scoring categories with too wide of a variation in points risks turning the game into 'who can figure out the optimal scoring path' which I assume you don't want.
So make the objectives roughly equal in difficulty and approach? I was thinking more along the lines of 'several objectives of different difficulty and nature, with the intent that no one should be able to obtain every single one.'
Oi, this is a problem. Either you make the objectives virtually identical, with all that implies, or you make them different and watch as someone draws the short straw.
T-hawk Wrote:This reads to me very much like designing a single player tournament event that has custom scenario scoring.
The answer to "is there potential in this idea?" is virtually always yes. The devil is in the details and the execution. For this idea to work, we would need a sponsor to work through all those specific categories and point values, to produce a fully fledged game proposal. PBEMs 32 and 39 have pulled this off successfully, with SevenSpirits and Commodore taking charge of designing the specifications.
If you want to see this happen, you should step up with a fully formed proposal. Work those examples into real stuff. I'm not sure whether you're angling to be a player or if you just want to watch such a game?
I'll get a proposal sent to you sometime, which is currently running off the 'different' model.
Quote:-I will randomly assign the objectives, ensuring that each objective is handed out once (like a deck of cards) and that each player receives an equal number of objectives from each difficulty. Each player should receive 3 Easy, 3 Medium, 2 Hard, 2 Very Hard, and the 'Win by any means' objective.
I'm not playing this, but why not give players choice? You've given them a list, let them pick their poison.
Selrahc Wrote:I'm not playing this, but why not give players choice? You've given them a list, let them pick their poison.
I pictured this as 'play the hand you're dealt' rather than 'stack your hand with the best cards.' The primary reason I revealed the objectives was to let people see them before signing up (rather than 'sign up for a game with objectives of unknown nature'). That, and to allow people to inform me if I was smoking weed when writing the objectives.
The problem is some of those objectives are much easier/better to achieve than others, so a lot of it is just going to be random of which you get. If you don't let people pick, there is a serious threat of someone getting a much, much worse starting position before the game even starts.
