PBEM46 tech thread

[Serdoa]

Picking: I know I said I'd butt out of setup discussions, but I really like double reverse snake pick with a point buy system. The 45 system was the most balanced and varied so far IMO, and I also like not needing bans.

Tbh, I think PBEM32 was the most fun system I had up to now, but thats really hard to do and needs a good mapmaker (while simply rolling a map is of course much easier, especially with Sevens map). 45 was certainly an interesting system, I haven't studied it in detail but will go and take a look now.

Diplo: I'm actually pretty flexible about diplo systems, I just like having variety. AW suits me fine in PBEM42, I like how little time it takes. I do think that green player should have a chance to try a diplo at some point, so they don't get used to non-talking being the only way to play here.

Yeah, like I said, if the majority wants that, I just have to bow out, but I certainly won't hold a grudge because of it It is just to time-consuming for my life (and tbh from what I read I get the feeling for at least half the other players of this game as well).

Size: 40x40 is a pretty big map, will lead to a very builder focused game. I'm not against that, just want to make sure that all players approve.

Um, no, it is not. Take a look at PBEM43, which I am playing right now (and leave a comment in my thread when you are there ). 40x40 with some water (20-25% to make circumnavigation impossible) will give everyone ~250 tiles to work with. 21 tiles per city are around 10-15 cities before you bump borders with everyone. In reality, it can easily be 6 to 8 cities when you already start the first wars (again, look at PBEM32 or 43, both were 40x40 maps). That means that Ancient Era is mostly harassing and in Medieval the real wars start. Thats not my definition of "very builder focused". But of course of definitions could vary here

[Catwalk]

Agreed, a low-diplo system (AI or CTON) sounds good here. I'm not as against CTON as I used to be, and I admit I'm enjoying it in PBEM42.

I just checked, PBEM37 is 40x40 with a total of 1250 tiles for 6 players. While there has been harrassment, I think it's been quite builder focused. There's just been too much land available for offenses to be worthwhile IMO. I was a little disappointed with that because I picked Ragnar of Rome hoping to smash heads PBEM42 looks to be a lot of fun with a 24x24 map. On the other hand, big maps are more friendly to green players like yourself

[Serdoa]

Just my opinion, but 24x24 for 5 players is already variant play. Thats 576 tiles total IF there is no single water tile. 115 tiles per player? Thats 10x10 tiles. One city with popped borders takes 5x5. 4 cities total? 5 with some cramping in? Yeah, thats a variant

edit: That said, yes, those can be fun. But they are vastly different than playing "normally".

[slowcheetah]

Skill: Any chance a veteran or two want to sign up as dedlurkers? With Serdoa on the roster, the skill level just took a jump

Now that 33 has finished I probably have time to dedlurk if anybody wants. This comes with the caveat that I am nowhere near as skilled as Serdoa .

[BRickAstley]

When you decide on a map, I can roll one up for you. If you use something like Seven's script I can do one no problem, if you want hand crafted, I could do that as well, it'd just take a bit longer.

[Catwalk]

Just my opinion, but 24x24 for 5 players is already variant play. Thats 576 tiles total IF there is no single water tile. 115 tiles per player? Thats 10x10 tiles. One city with popped borders takes 5x5. 4 cities total? 5 with some cramping in? Yeah, thats a variant
edit: That said, yes, those can be fun. But they are vastly different than playing "normally".

It's 4 players, not 5. Realistically, each player will have room for 7-8 cities easily without major cramping. I think your math is a little off about how much cramping is common, I'd estimate 12-16 tiles per city in general. With 576 tiles (and only small lakes), that's 144 tiles per player. That's easily enough for 8-10 cities per player, enough to feel that you get to develop your civ before getting in each others' faces. I do find the 20x20 in PBEM44 to be extreme, but 24x24 feels like a pretty normal game with early contact. I'm definitely enjoying PBEM37 too, but it surprised me how much of a builder map it turned out to be. Azza, what's your take on it?

Skill: Any chance a veteran or two want to sign up as dedlurkers? With Serdoa on the roster, the skill level just took a jump

Now that 33 has finished I probably have time to dedlurk if anybody wants. This comes with the caveat that I am nowhere near as skilled as Serdoa .

I was going to make fun of your lack of skill, but I see you beat me to it

How about a random 7-map touched up slightly by BRick? Not sure what would need touching up, I'm clueless with map making.

[Serdoa]

Sevens map don't need any touching normally. Except if you want to add some improvements and stuff.

As for players, we are five. Lego, Cornflakes, Azza, OldHarry and myself.

Azza, OldHarry, Cornflakes please provide your answers to my questions when you get a chance. After we've summarized those we'll probably have a better idea of what we want to do and can go on from there. For example, I'd like to discuss with you guys rules regarding city / unit gifting. But that obviously doesn't make sense to discuss now, with the chance still that we'll play AW.

[BRickAstley]

Yeah, just small edits for playability would be all.

If you prefer handcrafted I actually just had a great idea for a 5 person 40x40 map, so just let me know.

[Old Harry]

Hi Serdoa - looks like the rest of us are playing for second then! (I'll get my diplo in before we decide we can't!)

a) Diplo: - AI diplo
Although wouldn't mind always war

b) Bans?
- Nukes yes
- War Elephants yes
- Corporations yes
- Statue of Zeus ?
I haven't see the SOZ ban before - is it overpowered?

c) Civ / Leader Bans?
I don't think we need these in a five player game

d) Picking Method?
- Snake Pick

e) Variants?
Not needed in a (mostly) greens game

f) Map-Type?
No opinion

g) I certainly have forgot stuff, please fill in here
Scout start?
I can't think of anything else...

I'd be in favour of BRick as map maker - I'm really liking the 43 map.

And finally Lego - you could have early evening 1700-2100 GMT and I'll go for 2100-0100? Anyone else want to claim a slot?

[Lego]

That is good with me. I think it's good to hae Serdoa's playing with us. A challenge is good, that's by I wanted a game. If I wanted to just win, I'd play against the AI.