WW17 - A Game of Thrones

[zakalwe]

I'm off to bed. I'd love to hear some theories from Rowain beyond "everybody else is an idiot".

[Twinkletoes89]

Well it has gone past halfway in this day and they haven't turned up.

coco

[pindicator]

Zak- do you have any other reasoning besides Rowain dropping oh-so-obvious hints about his name? He clearly isn't the only one doing that, even if he's been the least subtle about it. There's the Serdoa bit, but I'm not sure we couldn't apply the same to twinkletoes - Serdoa defends him in the QT thread day 1. Also, why the change of tune on Coco?

I'm not done with my re-read, just finished day 1. But rowain, cut the shit and be productive. Or go throw a temper tantrum and selfishly hijack the discussion just because someone suspects you. After the dogged suspicion I got all of last game, you'll just have to excuse me if I have zero sympathy for this play by you. You want me to not vote for you? Do some hunting, don't throw a pity party.

[zakalwe]

Rereading day 2 changed my mind, Pindicator. TT is another option. Zzzzzzz

[Tasunke]

I'm voting for Twinkletoes, not Coco >.>

[pindicator]

Twinkletoes89

Serdoa in quick topic 273-

I actually agree with uberfish on this point. Yeah, it is bad as I assume by now that you are a villager, but it is as bad to let you live now. Whatever we do, it will be slightly altered. And tbh, I'd rather have the vote as it should have been on RB than having something else just because the forums-software here is ... odd.

At the time of posting uberfish had ruled that Rowain's vote switch from Twinkletoes to Bigger should count, so Serdoa here is argeeing with a decision to lynch Bigger, which would keep Twinkletoes from the tie.

More than that, though:
On QT post 232 Brick does a recap with 5 minutes to go

Brick (4) - Mattimeo Lewwyn Sareln Mardoc
Bigger (4) - Novice Thestick Twinkletoes Pindicator
Pindicator (5) - Jkaen Bigger Serdoa Brick Zakalwe
Twinkletoes (2) - Ichabod Tasunke
Mardoc (1) - Rowain
Serdoa (1) - Coco
Tasunke (1) - Azza

Not voting - Qqqqqq

What happens next is the late push on TT. (Also, i just realized i was 5 min away from being lynched. Holy crap guys, thanks for dangling me in front of the noose like that!)
* Zak votes Bigger
* Rowain votes Twinkletoes
* Brick votes TT
* Bigger voted TT

A rush of votes onto TT, and we all know about his defensive vote fail. But right after that is Serdoa voting for Bigger
* Twinkletoes votes me (off Bigger)
* Serdoa votes Bigger (off me)

Given the rush of votes and the names put down, i don't think the traitors had time to do the math and figure out the tally before voting. Which is why Serdoa votes Bigger: to try to save twinkletoes.

This is more than just circumstantial evidence, in my opinion, because right before this Serdoa was defending Bigger:

Bolded the relevant part:

As for the TT / Bigger / Ichabod-thing: I'm a little surprised about what was posted tbh. Why is it so surprising for some that TT got pissed at Biggers comment. For me that seems absolutely in line with what you'd expect from TT. And arguing that he used it as an escape (like Ichabod did) is something that we can do with basically every post. "Yeah, he acted like you would expect, but just because we expected it"... yeah, right. Maybe because he is like that? Could be a possibility eh? ... The same goes for Bigger imo. He told me last game when we were Masons that he likes to aggravate people to get a reaction from them which he then uses to tell if that player is genuine and therefore probably innocent or not. I completely disagree with this style and would rather lose than play like that, but that still seems typical Bigger for me. So again, using that as an explanation for his scuminess doesn't make sense for me. I understand that for TT (I would be pissed at Bigger as well quite honestly after such a comment), but everyone not emotionally involved should imo just relate to TT but tell him that Bigger is probably just Bigger. Unfortunately all that stuff tells us nothing about their guilt imo, but it sure did waste much of the first day. Great job!

So just after arguing that both Bigger and TT were acting like normal and cases against them were bogus for thinking they were acting differently, Serdoa does a last minute vote onto Bigger from me? For what purpose? He wrote only that he agreed with zak when he did the switch. So why open himself up to such a contradiction, unless there was an important reason (like saving a scum buddy)?

Add in Ichabod’s argument and i can see a Twinkletoes as a good place to go in lieu of Coco

[Jkaen]

Well that was not a very chatty night, hoped to come back to a lot more to read.

I agree with Pind that given the chaos of the last minute voting on day 1 there may be info we can pick up on, problem is TT always seems wierd to me, so I struggle to pick out different play styles with him.

As for TT voting coco because he hasnt turned up, surely if he isnt turning up its better to just let him get mod killed unless you are basing the vote on a lot more than posting presence (as Pind seems to be)?

[zakalwe]

Yeah, that post by Serdoa really drives the point home, Pindicator. Why indeed would he switch at the last minute, after setting up for town cred with that post. If Rowain flips scum, TT would almost certainly be next, but I don't mind doing it in the opposite order, either. I guess there's also a minor chance that TT is scum while Rowain is innocent. I've evidently been falling for TT's act, but the objective evidence keeps piling up. Twinkletoes.

[Azza]

If I wasn't voting zak, I guess right now I would go with Azza.

Low post count (same as coco) and post 295 was just all kinds of wrong

I don't post my thoughts, I get jumped on for being a lurker. I post my thoughts, I still get jumped on for being a lurker, and my thoughts are declared wrong. What the hell am I supposed to do?

I agree with the sentiment that Coco can wait. If he's scum he's not doing any damage, and he needs some serious activity increase to avoid a lynch if he does show up before being WoG'd. And since Pindicator makes a very strong argument against Twinkletoes, I think I'll move my vote there.

[Sareln]

Slow American Days --> am I the only one left in PST for this game?

Players Remaining:

Azza
Zakalwe
Tasunke
Rowain
Sareln
Lewwyn (aka Loki)
Qgqqqq
Twinkletoes89
Jkaen
Pindicator
Thestick
Mardoc
Coco

Current Lynch Tally:

(6*) Coco - Twinkletoes, Mardoc (Mardoc), Qgqqq, Sareln, TheStick
(4) TT - Tasunke, Pindicator, Zakalwe, Azza
(2) Zakalwe - Jkaen, Lewwyn
(1) Rowain - Rowain

Coco not voting.

Coco: Lurker Lynch + Some suspicion based on opening (hi guys, I'm new and am tooootally not scum, honest!) + him not being in trouble yesterday by virtue of Serdoa pushing hard on Mattimeo. Really just blank though.

TT: Moving part in Zak's day one conjecture with Serdoa and Rowain. Part of the 3-way tie on day 1 with Bigger/BRick, so flipping him will also give us a better idea of what was going on, day 1. Making the easiest vote in the world on Coco, btw, pure policy.

I'm going to swap over to Twinkletoes89

Which should make it this:

Current Lynch Tally:

(5*) Coco - Twinkletoes, Mardoc (Mardoc), Qgqqq, TheStick
(5) TT - Tasunke, Pindicator, Zakalwe, Azza, Sareln
(2) Zakalwe - Jkaen, Lewwyn
(1) Rowain - Rowain

Coco not voting.