WW 18 Siege of the Dragon! (Game Thread)

[Selrahc]

MJW. Attend please sir. You've slipped away. Come back to us, from whatever dark abyss you're currently whispering in.

Spent the first day angrily pointing out non-attendance, to walk out in the middle of a deathstorm? I don't like it. Not one bit. This is the kind of thing that should have him buzzing.

- Selrahc only talking about meta and old games

Pretty important stuff I think. Meta isn't a synonym for useless.

[Serdoa]

But zak, to be fair, an answer to your question: There is only one player you know is not against you, and thats your teammate. So in general your scum-play will be exactly like your town-play, except for that one player. And that is exactly what we were shown D1. So, there is your answer: Your play makes more sense for scum because you defended valiantly scum the whole day.

I disagree. Like I said earlier, if I were scum, I would focus much more on attacking someone else, and much less on defending my scumbuddy.

But you did focus quite a bit on attacking. In fact you only attacked, that was your way to defend Q. You declared him innocent and then attacked everyone getting near him. I wrote "defended valiantly" - but isn't it said that offense is the best defense? It nearly worked.

It is a difference if I call him innocent or if I just say that I think that you choose an interesting target. As in a target that is telling, for the fact that it is very easy to point to something he did and call it scummy. Doesn't mean he is innocent, but means that I get the feeling that you are deliberately not attacking those which do show scum-signs but could fight back much more than MJW probably will.

I don't view MJW as an easy target. Maybe he was, in the first game or two that he played here, but not anymore. I don't see why you would expect him to not fight back, either. And anyway, there are only 11 players left. I'm innocent, Azza is innocent, so that leaves 9 players out of which it seems that at least 3 must be scum. So I'm not giving anyone a free pass at this point, whether it's because they are too easy a target, or whatever else.

See zak, that part of your post above is exactly why I suspect you. You have taken several parts of my opinion on MJW and just changed them slighty, so that they fit your argument more. I'll make it easy to see:

I wrote: "I get the feeling that you are deliberately not attacking those which do show scum-signs but could fight back much more than MJW probably will"
You wrote: "I don't see why you would expect him to not fight back, either."

Where did I write that he would not fight back? I didn't. You just made it up to strenghten your argument. What I wrote was that he will probably fight back less then others.

I wrote: "it is very easy to point to something he did and call it scummy"
You wrote: "I don't view MJW as an easy target. Maybe he was, in the first game or two that he played here, but not anymore."

Again, where did I write that he is an easy target? I didn't. I wrote it is easy to point to something he did and call it scummy. Thats not the same.

What you did with my whole reasoning for why you attacked MJW was picking out single words and building new sentences around them which you than carried on to answer. Of course that answer gave the reader the feeling that my reasoning would state wrong facts or be simply unjust because I only want to implicate you. And then you go on to state that you wouldn't give anyone a free pass - of course every villager reading this will agree with it. But I never said you should.

These two passages that I've quoted are contradictory, as well. If I played exactly as I usually do on day 1, not shying away from confrontations with powder kegs like yourself, why would I only be going after soft targets today? Again, you're just trying to make things fit.

What is that even for a logic? "If I would play as always on D1 why should I play not as always on D2." zak, quite honestly, that makes no sense at all for me. I have commented on how you played - there is no question about it, those are facts for everyone to read - and you state now that I am contradicting myself. How can I contradict myself by stating facts and adding my opinion on why you do it?

And on that matter, if you did actually write what I believe to have read: If I say you played differently on D1 to protect Q and you answer "But I am not playing like that on D2" then I can only answer "Q is dead, if you haven't noticed".

[waterbat]

On phone. Matt, given the pace of deaths, i do want to relay my ability as soon as practical.

Also, I expect to die after revealing. Either by mislynch based on its characteristics, or by one of the scum factions fearing it.

I'll probably reveal at deadline - although with 1-1-1 scum factions, they won't need to coordinate in their QT. they can react quickly. I risk missing lewwyn Mattimeo and, azza though. My power likely will influence the vote. What is the latest you 3 will check in here?

[Mattimeo]

Deadline is actually 9am for me (and probably Azza as well, going by simple population distribution), so if I'm not awake 'til stupid hours then I should be around for a while before deadline.

[Tasunke]

MJW(3)
Zakalwe(2)
Mattimeo(1)
Slowcheetah(1)

[Selrahc]

You know I'm going to keep voting MJW between every tally, since my vote seems to be getting counted again.

[Serdoa]

We'll know more in a few hours. Pindicator - out of the q voters, who do you suggest is in the other faction?

Zak is the clear frontrunner there. I was thinking mattimeo could also be in league but that doesnt make sense with the setup revelations. And zak was pushing alternative targets to Q all day. Zak, are you going to say anything btw? Been silent since Q was lynched.

With our scum groups of hunters and wolves... could one be responsible for the novice death? I'm wondering if hunters kill by day and wolves & sk kill by night. Will be interesting to see how many kills there are

Ichabod the White Werewolf was burned alive

Uberfish the Argonian Alchemist was eaten by wolves

Pindicator the Seeker of Truth was poisoned

So the dragon killed Ichabod, and the werewolves killed Uberfish. But who poisoned Pindicator? Seems hard to believe there will regularly be one day kill and three night kills. Should be a fast game, in that case...

Before I head for bed; MJW, why did you switch your vote from Q to Waterbat a couple of minutes before the deadline?

I think that post here is also interesting. zak isn't asking "Why was pindicator poisoned?" what would be the really interesting question, but he just asks "who poisoned pindi?". And we knew at that point that there are 3 factions + one faction is called hunters ... so yeah, I think it is easy to realize who killed pindi most likely. The why is what has to be asked, wouldn't you agree zak?

MJW. Attend please sir. You've slipped away. Come back to us, from whatever dark abyss you're currently whispering in.

Spent the first day angrily pointing out non-attendance, to walk out in the middle of a deathstorm? I don't like it. Not one bit. This is the kind of thing that should have him buzzing.

Rereading this, I can't remember MJW pointing something out angrily. And the "I don't like it. Not one bit." sound insincere to me Selrahc. I have the same feeling with you as with zakalwe, you guys are jumping on someone for flimsy reasons when there are much more evidence pointing to other players (and yes, zak is one of those players for certain...). And no, that doesn't mean I think you two are in the same team. Just that you two are both interested to get someone lynched - someone, not scum. Everyone, as long as it is not you.

- Selrahc only talking about meta and old games

Pretty important stuff I think. Meta isn't a synonym for useless.

No, but doing only that is certainly not a sign for scumhunting. And what you did above with MJW is not scumhunting either. And no, thats not me trying to to tell you to play like I do. Thats me telling you that you have not once this game done anything to actively search or hunt for scum. At all. If it wouldn't be so obvious that zak is scum, I would vote you second. But you are just not hunting at all, while he is actively twisting words to appear in a better light.

@zak

Before you get me wrong. I am still open to listen to you. But stop trying to twist what I ask you. Stop hitting just the most obvious stuff (like MJWs switch). Are you village? Then stop acting like a survivalist and help us find scum. 3 out of 8 players (Azza not counted and believing we both are innocent) should actually be a cakewalk. Thats nearly 50% chance to hit on scum. Put forth 2 targets and you are nearly required to hit scum, just by chance.

[Serdoa]

INOFFICIAL TALLY

MJW (3) - zakalwe, Selrahc, Azza
zakalwe (2) - Serdoa, slowcheetah
Mattimeo (1) - Lewwyn
slowcheetah (1) - Mattimeo

[Selrahc]

Rereading this, I can't remember MJW pointing something out angrily. And the "I don't like it. Not one bit." sound insincere to me =

Return to the character I played in the Slowcheetah exchange, so the phrasing might be a little off compared to my normal mode of speech.

I think I've got a real point here though. To wit, MJW fricking loves theorizing on this kind of thing. 5 kills in one day with unrevealed methods of killing would ordinarily bring a dozen solutions of varying applicability and thread acceptance. And yet he's kept schtum since the lynch. It wasn't why I initially voted for him, which was a standard pressure move, but I find his silence deafening at this point. He has left a void where normally he would leave a cacophony.

[waterbat]

From what little I've played with MJW, I'd have to agree with selrahc. Cacophony ! Great word. Better than malarkey.