[SPOILERS] Tatan, CFCJester and Nakor try their hand at Mansu of India...

[mackoti]

so lets do a litle math here. If you growth and worked those 3 tiles, you would get 3 food more,and 9 gold turn.When you whip a pop you get 30 production and 10 turns cant work a good tile,after 10 turns whip again.So you got 30 production towards workers setlers. With the other way you would get same 30 production towards worker setler, and 90 gold in same time.actualy i am wrong cause you could work 4 more tiles in same time so if you factor a mine here,which means anothe 20 production toward setler, the things are becoming even worse for your aproach.

And more than that you have wines which its a great tile with financial,and 1 more hapy cap in other cities.

[Nakor]

Thanks, mackoti!
You're making a very valid point.
What would happen if we tech Monarchy before Math?

[CFCJesterFool]

Thanks, mackoti!
You're making a very valid point.
What would happen if we tech Monarchy before Math?

We could do Monarchy after Writing. I've already tested it and it works well. We'll just need to be selective on what forests we chop but then again I'd rather improve FPs with cottages before chopping GF anyway. Maybe only chop the PHF and mine it so CC has a production tile. I think we can delay Math so yeah let's go Monarchy.

[Nakor]

Thanks, mackoti!
You're making a very valid point.
What would happen if we tech Monarchy before Math?

We could do Monarchy after Writing. I've already tested it and it works well. We'll just need to be selective on what forests we chop but then again I'd rather improve FPs with cottages before chopping GF anyway. Maybe only chop the PHF and mine it so CC has a production tile. I think we can delay Math so yeah let's go Monarchy.

Priesthood first for discount?

[CFCJesterFool]

Thanks, mackoti!
You're making a very valid point.
What would happen if we tech Monarchy before Math?

We could do Monarchy after Writing. I've already tested it and it works well. We'll just need to be selective on what forests we chop but then again I'd rather improve FPs with cottages before chopping GF anyway. Maybe only chop the PHF and mine it so CC has a production tile. I think we can delay Math so yeah let's go Monarchy.

Priesthood first for discount?

Yes. I thought I'd see what I could do going Writing->Priesthood->Monarchy->Math. I went ahead and had FoF complete the library and CG is running a priest. City eight will be slightly delayed and I did cut the worker from FoF (went settler instead) but our worker turns don't get impacted and FoF is 2t away from another worker (#4). FoF could even do another worker (#5) before getting out another settler (city 9). We'll have Math in time to bulb Currency. Do you have time to look over the sim? I can provide the micro if you agree on what I've done. I just don't think it's worth it to put hammers into a library we don't plan on finishing soon (plus the library was finished when tech was turned back on to tech Monarchy).

The sim...
  sim monarchy-library-temple.zip (Size: 221.02 KB / Downloads: 2)

[Nakor]

Took a look at the sim you made.

Things look good there :
* we want FoF to be size 8 for the Library to be more effective, so it needs to grow bigger and build those workers/settlers at size 8, so there might be space for another grasland cottage there.
* we do want an escort for the settler on clam island
* I think we can skip the mine near CG in exchange for a farm at the horse city. Another netted crabs there would be even better.
* Silver city must grow to size 2 at least once the seafood is netted

And we must keep an eye our for Galley's from Serdoa/Space. Should those appear, we need to whip out some defenders.

All in all, let's fine-tune and go with this plan. FoF can grow to size 9 with Wine and HR and even bigger if we build some military.

Can you end turn? I'm off to bed.

[UnforcedError]

so lets do a litle math here. If you growth and worked those 3 tiles, you would get 3 food more,and 9 gold turn.When you whip a pop you get 30 production and 10 turns cant work a good tile,after 10 turns whip again.So you got 30 production towards workers setlers. With the other way you would get same 30 production towards worker setler, and 90 gold in same time.actualy i am wrong cause you could work 4 more tiles in same time so if you factor a mine here,which means anothe 20 production toward setler, the things are becoming even worse for your aproach.

And more than that you have wines which its a great tile with financial,and 1 more hapy cap in other cities.

Absolutely right. Thanks for the little support

Took a look at the test save. What's the reason behind stagnating a city on size 1 just to work the silver with a happy cap of 6? It should be growing onto the two improved crab tiles and pick up the silver afterwards.
Our Academy will be delayed a bit by that merchant but there's nothing to be done about it (unless we want to take our chances?). I'd actually build a farm for SM right away, make it grow and improve their wine first. FoF has lots of great tiles to work. (Btw 3F3C tops a full grown grass town in my book in effectiveness prior to cottage enhancing civics / techs. I'm not saying we shouldn't grow those cottages. But 3F3C now is better than 2F7C tomorrow.)

EDIT: And a question: BtS has a known "bug" of not feeding the first unhappy citizen when building workers / settlers. Is this present in RB mod too?

[CFCJesterFool]

Took a look at the sim you made.

Things look good there :
* we want FoF to be size 8 for the Library to be more effective, so it needs to grow bigger and build those workers/settlers at size 8, so there might be space for another grasland cottage there.
* we do want an escort for the settler on clam island
* I think we can skip the mine near CG in exchange for a farm at the horse city. Another netted crabs there would be even better.
* Silver city must grow to size 2 at least once the seafood is netted

And we must keep an eye our for Galley's from Serdoa/Space. Should those appear, we need to whip out some defenders.

All in all, let's fine-tune and go with this plan. FoF can grow to size 9 with Wine and HR and even bigger if we build some military.

Can you end turn? I'm off to bed.

I forgot to switch to the crab once I netted it (wasn't paying attention) so that won't be what we do in the live save. I'll make the modifications and post the micro so it can be looked over. Went ahead and ended turn.

[CFCJesterFool]

so lets do a litle math here. If you growth and worked those 3 tiles, you would get 3 food more,and 9 gold turn.When you whip a pop you get 30 production and 10 turns cant work a good tile,after 10 turns whip again.So you got 30 production towards workers setlers. With the other way you would get same 30 production towards worker setler, and 90 gold in same time.actualy i am wrong cause you could work 4 more tiles in same time so if you factor a mine here,which means anothe 20 production toward setler, the things are becoming even worse for your aproach.

And more than that you have wines which its a great tile with financial,and 1 more hapy cap in other cities.

Absolutely right. Thanks for the little support

Took a look at the test save. What's the reason behind stagnating a city on size 1 just to work the silver with a happy cap of 6? It should be growing onto the two improved crab tiles and pick up the silver afterwards.
Our Academy will be delayed a bit by that merchant but there's nothing to be done about it (unless we want to take our chances?). I'd actually build a farm for SM right away, make it grow and improve their wine first. FoF has lots of great tiles to work. (Btw 3F3C tops a full grown grass town in my book in effectiveness prior to cottage enhancing civics / techs. I'm not saying we shouldn't grow those cottages. But 3F3C now is better than 2F7C tomorrow.)

I forgot to switch to the crab..wasn't paying attention. Yeah, SM is getting that farm since Nakor agrees. We'll have to agree to disagree on working coast tiles over growing cottages. I don't think waiting for Emancipation to grow cottages is the way to go. The thing with cottages is you grow them early or don't bother. Late game we'll be running caste+SP so Emancipation won't even be an option. I had 3 Academies in the sims I've run, getting GS won't be a problem. The GProphet for the shrine otoh will be a problem though.

[UnforcedError]

I forgot to switch to the crab..wasn't paying attention. Yeah, SM is getting that farm since Nakor agrees. We'll have to agree to disagree on working coast tiles over growing cottages. I don't think waiting for Emancipation to grow cottages is the way to go. The thing with cottages is you grow them early or don't bother. Late game we'll be running caste+SP so Emancipation won't even be an option. I had 3 Academies in the sims I've run, getting GS won't be a problem. The GProphet for the shrine otoh will be a problem though.

Not until Emancipation. But we should be whipping more effectively than we are now (others are surely doing that), and therefore we need food. Also, FoF is better atm with the three lake tiles instead of the cottages so it should work them (and whip on occasion). I often build support cities to grow cottages for my cap and only pick them up with the cap after Bureau. With HR FoF should have no problem working all its good tiles.
As for the Prophet we should not try for a ~100% chance IMO. We can run the odd priest if we want. Not worth it though until we have a bunch of cities. We should have enough auto spreads from the holy city without a shrine anyway.