[SPOILERS] Lurkerloos and map discussion

[Gaspar]

The bottom line is that Commodore and scooter et al's personalities were always going to lead to this outcome - total war. Unfortunately for team scoopin, Noble (who btw is the best civ player on that team) is the only who recognizes it and they think he's just being crazy because he hates Commodore (for the record, he is crazy and he does hate Commodore, but it doesn't change the fact that he was right.) You can't simultaneously think someone is an irrational warmonger and then take a half-assed passive approach to said war, which is what they did.

I think they'll fight to a bloody stalemate before eventually Commodore's far greater appetite for that sort of thing leads to him winning the overall area, much the same way he eventually beat Cyneheard in PB5.

Like I said, immaterial because plako is going to win - high skill, weak neighbor. That's the problem with these random games - they look and sound fun, but you get what you pay for. Good player with weakest neighbor wins. Its fine though, plako deserves to finally win one of these - he easily could have won PB2 or PB4 with a bit more luck/less crazy neighbors.

[Nicolae Carpathia]

Would Plako really have won if he didn't get Praet rushed? Strong competitor, dogpilee, but winner?

For the record, Scoopin really should have seen total war coming the moment he noticed he cut Commodore off from expansion. After all, one of the points of diplomacy (and there's still diplomacy here, it's just all unspoken) is to redirect your opponent's energies into routes that don't harm you.

And they're still building Settlers and Workers, they're still gambling on the future. It's just that there might not be enough troops that Commodore's pressure could give him a temporary advantage.

[Gaspar]

Would have? Doubtful. Could have? Definitely.

[Ceiliazul]

Scooter baited Commodore into attacking, and Commodore declined. If he had offered peace after that turn, I wonder if Scoopin would have taken it...

yeah, probably not.

Also, that Iron tile is crying out for a fort, is it not? It would reduce the city from sad to pathetic, but I don't see any other way to keep the iron hooked. Do forts count for City Garrison bonii?

[Krill]

Forts need Maths IIRC, but they count as cities for all purposes, CD and CR promotions, flanking protection...

[timski]

I hope Azza realises how vulnerable Commodore's traded Iron is, and makes every Praetorian-production turn count. Too often in this game we've seen Azza not change strategy quick enough. Azza's chances won't get much better than this one.

That said, Commodore's Iron is remarkably well defended, all things considered. 3 Archers fortified in trees, with one on the forested hill behind. Commodore's Iron city is pumping out an Archer every couple of turns to augment those defenses, with most of Commodore's back-line cities also producing military. That will take a good few Axes to shift. And Scooter doesn't have a good few Axes, nor will they anytime soon.

Unfortunately for Scooter, even Commodore has limits to their risk-taking:

So, rather obviously, I declined action this turn. It felt weird, normally I'd take the chance on killing something, but metal being so limited, I need play cautiously.

[Krill]

scooter should have researched HBR. HA and impi will just wander round and pillage anything on the ground.

[mackoti]

scooter should have researched HBR. HA and impi will just wander round and pillage anything on the ground.

This is very true .And i think alfabeth its very less utill in this situation.

[Gazglum]

Agree that the geography and matchup is very much in Plako's favour at the moment. It's too early to say he's got it won, but he's certainly going to be the man to beat.

I feel a bit sorry for Commodore, and all the venting Scooter et al are doing towards him. Yes he's aggressive, but in his position he's been forced to play aggressively or lay himself open to being destroyed by metal units. Team Scooter really needs to sit down and work out a long term strategy here, because right now they're just reacting to Commodore's moves, and dont seem to have much plan to regain the initiative. Perhaps this is an illustration of the problems of fighting tactical battles as a team, versus Commodore's bloody single-mindedness.

[Twinkletoes89]

So what are the thoughts on Commodore's trading of Iron to Azza for copper and gold?

If Azza can hide his Praets until the critical moment he could really surprise Lewger