Warlords has gone gold

[LKendter]

I am in no rush to buy Warlords. I just haven't found the interest in large amount of Civ4 playing time. I have by no means finished the learning curve.


I really hope they did something with WW. WW is so much worse in Civ4, and is one of the areas that still causing massive MM once the wars begin.
I can't stress how much bringing Civ3 monarchy government would bring new life to Civ4 for me...

[uberfish]

I hope Warlords will expand the range of options of how to play the game, because by now I feel CIV's gameplay becomes very formulaic once you know how the game works.

I think this statement is only true of a pure warmongering game, and that's a result of design flaws, namely - the lack of an early counter to axemen, and the AI being too predictable in its defensive unit mixes. This leads to a predictable human warmonger progression of axe -> catapult -> mace -> grenadier. Hopefully Warlords will introduce more diversity in pre-industrial warfare.

Things like expand to 4/5 cities then wait for currency

I don't think there is a magic number, and currency is only one of several things that enable further expansion (Code of Laws, early cottages, Plantations coming online for extra commerce, Great Lighthouse/Colossus to name a few.) Depending on the game situation any of these may be stronger or weaker than Currency.

or if you wage ancient war, a large stack of axes with a spear or two against horses is best (or if it's a modern war, apply the Sirian doctrine)

Axes are a balance/AI issue, I agree.

I think war in industrial age and later gets a lot more diverse, since most units from Grenadiers on get their chance to serve as the backbone of an army. I'm not sure what Sirian doctrine is. It's a shame the late game runs into performance issues.

research techs frequently ignored by the AIs (Alphabet, CS, Liberalism, Radio, ...) to stay ahead in the tech trading loop

Tech trading was infinitely more abusable in previous editions of Civ, and I think even if alpha/CS/liberalism are usually high priority techs, there is sufficient variety in tech choices between and after these points.

CS and liberalism are strong techs in their own right, and I think are pursued more for what they enable than trade value considerations. Similar trade value can be obtained for say, Philosophy and Astronomy if the player goes for them early. Sometimes these techs are better than CS/liberalism.

or switch to Free Religion as soon as you know Liberalism for research/diplo bonus

I don't agree with this one, OR and theocracy are still superior civics if you have lots of infrastructure or military builds in progress, and often having a couple of reliable allies and trading partners is better than everyone being cautious. Free religion is only an automatic switch if you were playing with no state religion anyway for diplomatic reasons.


Anyway I think there are plenty of strategic level decisions, and paths through the tech tree left in civ4 to keep the Epic/adventure scenarios interesting. My SP games do still play out differently from each other even at highest difficulty levels (and more importantly, I believe the divergent strategies to be the correct plays.)

Here's hoping Warlords will introduce more variety in early warfare.

[sooooo]

Looks like Warlords will play very differently due to most of the leaders' traits being changed. The unique buildings seem powerful - an attempt increase the variety in playing different leaders I assume.

Table of new leader traits and unique buildings (via CFC):

http://uk.pc.ign.com/articles/717/717727p1.html

I'm really hoping there's an option to play the "standard" game OR the warlords game having installed warlords. I'm looking forward to getting Warlords, but still want to play in the RB events that use the standard game.

[Sirian]

I'm really hoping there's an option to play the "standard" game OR the warlords game having installed warlords. I'm looking forward to getting Warlords, but still want to play in the RB events that use the standard game.

There was with Civ3. I don't expect any problems here. The main issue for RBCiv is what we (collectively) think of the new package and how much it may serve our interests. Since you are definitely going to get Warlords, perhaps you'll be among the ones who review it and comment on it?


- Sirian

[Berrie]

Iand a seeming under-utilization of the new traits, w/ three known Charismatic, two Protective, and no known Imperialistic - but the unknown Ramses traits must surely include this...?

Maybe somebody already mentioned this, but Victoria, Juul Cesaar (aka Julius Caesar), Cyrus and Catherine all have the imperial trait now.

[uberfish]

Rameses got the perfect fit of Ind/Spi, displacing Gandhi (Phi/Spi), who displaced Saladin (Pro/Spi). Most of the changes to leader traits make sense, except for Napoleon losing aggressive.

I fear that the great general system is just going to lead to a whole lot of axe rushing if they haven't addressed the early game balance, but I plan to get the expansion when it's released here.

[Maksim]

Hmm... If I'm reading this right, every library gives Russians two free scientists?! That can't be right!

But if it is, then the expansion balance must be set a higher level than the original game.

[Rowain]

Hmm looked just over the special buildings and what they do (Thanks for the link sooooo )

Some things :
Mongols: Mongolian Ger, replaces Stable
New mounted units receive +4 experience points

What Stable? Is that a new building ? Didn't find anything about that.

Celts: Celtic Dun, replaces Wall
Free Guerilla I promotion for all units built in city

Very fitting for them and for a Highland Map

Russia: Russian Research Institute, replaces Library
+2 free Scientists

Perhaps the best new building 2 free Scientists that early are great.


About the great General:


There are a few different ways Great Generals can be used. Most obviously, you can turn them into Warlords to lead your military units in the field. When you create a Warlord, you have to join it to another combat unit. Any units that happen to be in the same tile when the Warlord is created, gain an additional twenty experience points.



Now I hope that that is not true. Imagine a stack of tanks/(or cossaks) and a stored General. puff and you have easily (if you add Barraks and the right civic) a stack of Units with 5(!) promotions

The unit the Warlord is joined to receive free upgrades. It also gains exclusive access to five new promotions.

• Combat VI: +25% strength
  
• Leadership: +50% experience from combat
  
• Medic III: Heals units in same and adjacent tiles 15% per turn
  
• Morale: +1 movement
  
• Tactics: +30% withdrawal chance
  

You can also opt join a Great General to a city as a Military Advisor. Once joined to a city, the Great General grants new military units an additional two experience points. Great Generals can also be sacrificed to create a Military Academy. The Military Academy grants an additional 25% bonus to military unit production.

Hope those Generals don't turn out to be too strong.

[Dreylin]

Russia: Russian Research Institute, replaces Library
+2 free Scientists

Perhaps the best new building 2 free Scientists that early are great.

That is fairly nutty, +7beakers (6*1.25) at least is a pretty big bonus ... not to mention the Great Person Points. Maybe they somehow got it confused with the Great Library?

This one worries me:

Malinese Mint: replaces Forge
+10% Commerce

for aiding an often runaway financial AI. Speaking of which, Carthage on a water map could be painful to compete against:

Carthaginian Cothon: replace Harbour
+1 Trade Route


Anyway maybe I'm strange, but this is the one I think I'm looking forward to most:

Incan Terrace: replaces Granary
+2 Culture

An elegant multi-purpose building.

[Sullla]

Don't get too worried about what you read in that article. I think I can fairly say that (as usual) the gaming magazines managed to get some things wrong and/or report outdated info to the public.

Speculation is all well and good, but I'd recommend holding off discussion until Warlords is actually released.