[SPOILERS] Tatan, CFCJester and Nakor try their hand at Mansu of India...

[Nakor]

Took a look ingame...

Serdoa build Pyramids and revolted to OR and Rep. Wonderguy...
Space revolted to OR and HR.

Moved Dora.

CG had a build choice. Went for an Axe but I'm not sure what the micro plan wanted.

Have fun with the micro!

[CFCJesterFool]

T97 demos...

I think we need to modify our tech path and take a gamble. Serdoa having Mids+Colossus means he doesn't need to war early..just expand. So unless someone is near him to block expansion, he has no incentive to war (i.e. defensive triremes to safeguard expansion to as many islands as possible). If I were him I would go CoL asap then CS/Machinery. Imo, if we want to win we need to take some risks.

After Math, I think it would be better to head to CoL ourselves. If we snag Confuscianism, great (we could build another temple in CG to run a second priest, speeding up the GProphet for our shrine), otherwise we still can run merchants at FG. Calendar then becomes pretty useful (food for merchants).

Another aspect to consider is would anyone want to open borders with us (omg they get an extra trade route!!). It does happen but how likely is Serdoa to open borders? Space might but Serdoa actually has much to gain by not doing so (settle islands so his culture blocks our movement...even attacking his triremes with triremes is 50/50).

What I propose would be finish Math->bulb Currency->CoL->Calendar->MC->bulb Machinery->CS then whatever (Alpha?) We could do Alpha before CS if we think we could get open borders to make it worthwhile. Getting a second GM would delay the shrine but if we get a second religion (and can run a second priest) then the net effect should be a wash (or close to it). Triremes by themselves don't do much for us but forges/caste boosted workshops for production) and crossbows do (while heading to CS and maceman). Serdoa would be foolish to not run caste (he is already in Rep). IMO, we have to try and match what I suspect he means to do...otherwise it is his game to lose.

Thoughts?

[Nakor]

Took a look in-game. Space has founded his 5th city. We're close to a 7th city with the Settler and Galley being ready next turn.
Are we planning on changing builds to a Settler in CG after growth next turn? Seems like a good plan. Or we could go for a Worker in CG and build another Settler in FoF after growth (skip the worker there).

I think we can build a scouting WB in CC after this WB. We should not whip CC but let it get all those cottages up and running a.s.a.p.

Now, about the cities:
FoF --> Commerce / Settlers
CG --> Settlers/Workers/GP
SM --> weird city, don't know what to do with it.
CC --> Commerce
MS --> Production
IW --> Production? Maoi?
FG --> GP
Have I got that right?

Now, about your thoughts...
I believe, that in these games, it's not up to 1 player to stop the front runner.
Serdoa is playing a good game so far. He is miles away, so at this point in time, there is not a lot we can do about him. His other neighbours should try to keep him in check.
I think we should focus on our own development and I think that MC is much more important (Forges/Triremes) then CoL. We already have a religion and courthouses aren't that good. Also, the Prophet will help getting an better economy.

So I'd say, stick to our plan, tech and build towards the best economy in the game and get that tech lead. When we have achieved that, we can start planning a war with either Space or Serdoa.

People will sign OB is my experience in these games, so Alpha is still a good tech choice in the near future.

[CFCJesterFool]

Took a look in-game. Space has founded his 5th city. We're close to a 7th city with the Settler and Galley being ready next turn.
Are we planning on changing builds to a Settler in CG after growth next turn? Seems like a good plan. Or we could go for a Worker in CG and build another Settler in FoF after growth (skip the worker there).

I think we can build a scouting WB in CC after this WB. We should not whip CC but let it get all those cottages up and running a.s.a.p.

Now, about the cities:
FoF --> Commerce / Settlers yes
CG --> Settlers/Workers/GP yes
SM --> weird city, don't know what to do with it. production
CC --> Commerce yes
MS --> Production yes plus some commerce
IW --> Production? Maoi? yes / possibly
FG --> GP yes
Have I got that right?

Now, about your thoughts...
I believe, that in these games, it's not up to 1 player to stop the front runner.
Serdoa is playing a good game so far. He is miles away, so at this point in time, there is not a lot we can do about him. His other neighbours should try to keep him in check.
I think we should focus on our own development and I think that MC is much more important (Forges/Triremes) then CoL. We already have a religion and courthouses aren't that good. Also, the Prophet will help getting an better economy.

So I'd say, stick to our plan, tech and build towards the best economy in the game and get that tech lead. When we have achieved that, we can start planning a war with either Space or Serdoa.

People will sign OB is my experience in these games, so Alpha is still a good tech choice in the near future.

FoF is scheduled to grow to sz 10 and then do a settler (or sz 9 if preferred). CG will start a worker at sz 6 (library is just to grow on).

I already cued up the scouting WB in CC. We still want to whip the first one right? Chop the scouting WB?

City questions answered in grey.

It will take quite some time to get the prophet. A second temple to run an extra priest would help. I don't think we can wait that long for the next gp (~475 AD running 2 priests and getting the GProphet second). We should either get a GM or GS second and the GProphet third. We need to decide what type we want second.

We'll stick to MC after Math. Trying CoL->Alpha->Calendar following MC is something I'm going to sim (CS bulb). I know from experience that early CS yields the best economy. I'd prefer to go MC->CoL->CS but maybe CS bulb also allows us to grab Alpha and Calendar and still get CS roughly in the same time frame.

[CFCJesterFool]

Tested bulbing and nope not going to work. I went MC->CoL (founded Confuscianism)->Alpha->Calendar->CS. Got CS 450 AD and there isn't enough time to get a gp to bulb anything (or even get an early Academy). Did have 12 cities (grabbed silk) and city #13 is 4t away. With the second priest (whipped temple once religion spread), 9t left until the shrine is founded. FG will be close behind CG with a GS though (~5t).

[UnforcedError]

Did Serdoa GE-build the Mids?

[Nakor]

I don't think there as a GE born already, but we can look into that.

Let's go for your suggested tech path, Jester. Maths - MC - CoL. If we get Confu, that would be great, but it can also be bulbed by Serdoa or someone else...
Maybe it would be better to get a scouting Trireme out after MC and build a Library in CC instead.

We still have a zillion things to do, but that will get better once we've founden FG and can plan for the next 10T.

Will you end turn, Jester?

[CFCJesterFool]

I don't think there as a GE born already, but we can look into that.

Let's go for your suggested tech path, Jester. Maths - MC - CoL. If we get Confu, that would be great, but it can also be bulbed by Serdoa or someone else...
Maybe it would be better to get a scouting Trireme out after MC and build a Library in CC instead.

We still have a zillion things to do, but that will get better once we've founden FG and can plan for the next 10T.

Will you end turn, Jester?

CC can build library after we whip the WB for the seafood. The forest chop we'll save for the scouting trireme. Declined map for map trades with Space and Serdoa. Don't have enough experience playing mp (or opponent knowledge) to know whether the trades are safe or not...my instincts scream no but maybe my inexperience makes me paranoid. Too tired to think clearly on that matter. Anyway, T98 demos and the GNP graphs...


So yes, Serdoa has top GNP (he does have more culture than us). My best guess is that his bpt are roughly the same as ours...not surprising considering he has Mids and Colossus. Ended turn and the new turn started. Haven't done anything yet though...really need to drink some coffee and wake up before even looking at the live save.

[CFCJesterFool]

Plenty of coffee later (plus couldn't help playing a Deity 225 BC engineering rush with Charly and his landsnecks..or however you spell that)... Not much going on although we have a settler and chariot heading towards FG (pig+fish+bananna). We did trade a lake for a hill and whipped an axe losing an oasis tile so our GNP is slightly lower. The T99 demos...


@ Nakor : haven't ended turn yet but will do so in a few hours (in case you want to look around first).

[Nakor]

Commodore took a city from Pindicator. Good to have those two fighting!

Took a look ingame.
SM can work the Wine instead of the farm for 3c 2h in exchange for 1f. Don't know if we should do that and how that goes with the micro plan. It delays growth to size 3 for 3t.

Offered map trades to Serdoa and Space. We won't scout fast enough and an use map knowledge. They may have met others and that gives us an idea of where to scout/send our scout to.

Serdoa is probably number 10 in military, so no need to worry about him.