[SPOILERS] Cornflakes and Q Eat 'Em for Breakfast!

[Qgqqqqq]

What do we tech after myst (I really think we should try for Buddhism)?

[Cornflakes]

Commodore's up to 3 cities now (settled near the end of last turn, so after I'd played).

Buddha might be an option, although it won't benefit us much short term. We'd need to revolt to it, we won't be able to spread it around until either monotheism/OrgRel (another revolt, which could be synced with HR if we wait) or monasteries with a heavy hammer investment. Plus our GProphet from 'henge won't be around for 50 turns minimum, but I want to sneak out a GScientist for an early academy.I think it's best to pass for now and head up writing > maths > currency line (possibly grabbing Confucius).

On the other hand, meditation is on the way to Monarchy, and HR would be really nice to grow the capital. Plus there's the off chance that nobody rushes for Oracle, and MC for IND forges would also be nice. So I could see an argument for that too. I'll save gold for a couple turns while we hash this out and decide on a direction (we'll be down to about 8g in the bank @ -4pt). Our next decision will likely determine the Big-Picture plan for the next 30 or so turns.

EDIT: forgot the Demos T51

[Qgqqqqq]

It saves having to nvest in one later on, and lets it start auto spreading (the other big reason for the shrine btw) and gives a good use of the shrine.
It also REDUCES our nessecary investment into that line, and amkes the pro[het points not a waste that we have to try and plan to avoid.
As for early academy, I just think that getting it too early (<T110 compared to T135) is a bit of a waste as at that time we'll want to be rexing (and thus have a low slider) at that time, but by 135 (the earliest we can get it presuming we wait for thwe GP, and henge is built on T60 (I know this is wrong but don't remember the date:/)) we'll be trying to level off more and start developing wiht things like monarchy etc. Shrines are also more powerful on large maps (which this is) and I doubt we can get another one after the henge one.
Getting out the GS will also cripple a city for 25 turns, especially early on.
TLDR I agree with early capital, but think earlier then the henge GP is a mistake.
Post by Krill in PB5(http://realmsbeyond.net/forums/showthrea...#pid246092) on the subject.

[Cornflakes]

Bit of a change of plans. Stonehenge was founded by AT last turn (beat us by 3 turns ). He's Charismatic so that was an even better grab for him. Therefore I'm funneling the production into a settler instead. I've sent the warrior to the north to check out the lands around Red dot some more, either the hill or the grassland 1W. both have wet corn first ring, with a forest that can be chopped into a granary, so Red will be another quick-off-the-start city. Workers will head thataway shortly, farming the corn 1-2 turns after I found the city.

I sent one of the workers down to connect ivory, which times perfectly with growth at Grand slam

Demos T52

[Cornflakes]

With the two chops at Doughnut now going into a settler I'll get it out in about 3 more turns. According to the sandbox, Red dot will cost 5gpt, but produce 3 from trade route + city center + river corn. Grand Slam will be hitting the happy cap about when the new city is founded, so I'll start a worker then (possibly whip). I'm slow-building and impi now with about 20/35. If necessary we can swap from cottages to the hill and speed it up, but as long as no enemies appear I'll keep working the cottage and growing pop. (in an emergency it could be whipped and reach any of our cities 1-turn later.

The question of next tech remains. With one turn of saving we'll have enough gold in the bank to research Meditation. Two turns of saving will get us through Priesthood, but Monarchy is EXPENSIVE compared to ancient techs. We don't have a hammer heavy city that can knock out the Oracle, and without the Stonehenge now we won't be getting an GProphet points for a shrine any time soon, so an early religion is less appealing.

On the other hand, you are right that writing doesn't benefit us a whole lot either because the opportunity cost of library + scientists for 17 turns is pretty expensive. Since we have copper connected for defense in emergencies we are pretty safe. I think the best plan here is to set our research to Fishing > Sailing, REX + cottage spam out to 6 cities ASAP until we crash the economy. Blue and Yellow dots both have seafood first ring, so once Fishing is in we can produce WB's at Porcupine for each.

[Qgqqqqq]

I think we might want a religion for the culture now though (), what plans have to change because of it?
Yeah rexing sounds good - could you post the ditmap again (I can't remember red dot).

[Qgqqqqq]

Oh and remember that it'll cost empire wide as well.

[Cornflakes]

The short-term change now that we can't build stonehenge is that I'm putting the chops and granary overflow into a settler instead. The long-term change is that we don't have free border pops on our cities We have enough gold now to research Meditation in 5 turns. As long as Buddha hasn't fallen yet I suppose we might as well try. I'll double check the game log before turning research on.

I don't actually remember what the individual maintenance of the city was from the sandbox, I just know that 100% research went from -4gpt > -9gpt so that is the empire wide cost.

Dotmap reposted:

[Cornflakes]

I confirmed the Buddha hasn't fallen yet and then turned on research ... 5T, with a couple gold to spare. If we do get Buddha, should we take a stab at Oracle? With some careful whip overflowing and can land it in Grand Slam on the turn Priesthood comes in, which is 4 turn after Meditation (while still getting a 4th worker out of Grand Slam first!). If we miss Oracle we'll just funnel the production into another settler, so nothing is lost (except the research).

When I played it out in the sandbox I also completed an impi from Porcupine for defense since we're approaching the time when barb warriors might appear on our borders. If we happen to land Oracle we could take Monarchy rather than MC. IND forges are 60h (either 2-pop whips or something to build while regrowing after whipping workers/settlers). Monarchy would get us HR about 15-20 turns sooner. MC would practically guarantee Colossus for us if we want it.

Demos from T53 ... Plus top 5 cities since I haven't posted that in a while.

[Qgqqqqq]

Hmm, what's t61 like as a date for Oracle?
Do we take MC if so?
Id lean yes - collosus will be big on this map, and we want to be rexing more atm, trying to take as much land as possible.
Forges/collosus we wouldn't want to build immediately, but could guarantee coll for us and give denial.

What I meant by short term is does any micro depend on expanding borders?