Gillette Turn Discussion

[Old Harry]

I don't think they are razing those cities. Does that show up in civstats?

5/6/13 10:56 am Zakalwe Logged out
5/6/13 10:44 am Zakalwe Score decreased to 1471 (-4)
5/6/13 10:43 am Zakalwe Score increased to 1475 (+4)
5/6/13 10:43 am Tazunke Score decreased to 777 (-21)
5/6/13 10:40 am Zakalwe Logged in

Aha! They did raze the most recent one. And it looks like they kept one and burnt one on 900 AD, although we only got one city-capture message. Tas wasn't logged in so he couldn't have whipped. Any ideas?

5/2/13 10:53 am Zakalwe Score decreased to 1485 (-15)
5/2/13 10:49 am Zakalwe Score increased to 1500 (+15)
5/2/13 10:49 am Tazunke Score decreased to 773 (-36)
5/2/13 10:42 am Zakalwe Score increased to 1485 (+13)
5/2/13 10:42 am Tazunke Score decreased to 809 (-14)

I can't see far enough into the past to tell about the other city...

[YossarianLives]

Yeah, that's exactly correct. They burned one and kept one on 5/2, and burned one on 5/6.

[Old Harry]

Yeah, that's exactly correct. They burned one and kept one on 5/2, and burned one on 5/6.

So if we only got one message on 5/2 (900AD) does that mean Trolls burnt a city we didn't have visibility on? Perhaps on an island?


In that case I don't think Tas is putting up much of a defence

By the way - researching Astro reduced our income by about 20gpt and 30 beakers per turn. That's worse than I thought it'd be

[Old Harry]

Turn 159

Tas missed this turn - his response in the tech thread? ">_<" - not sure what that means? Anyway now that we've got the coast of Smoothfoundland uncovered I'd like to use our caravel to investigate what else is going on in the war - does this stack of Zerks indicate another fight coming up?


On SFL our scouting plan develops:


First galley upgrade costs 110.


Second galley upgrade. At this point I realise they only carry three not four units - so it'll take a bit longer to get all the units we need over there. The northern galleon will take a couple of workers and a settler to Rapier. The southern one will take a settler and two workers to Quama, before coming back for the settler and workers for Scimitar or Trident (Trolls still don't have Astro, so maybe we can hold off settling Scimitar til we've got Caste System?) I think we want two workers with each settler.


This is the current (overcomplicated) plan.


Back on the mainland Occam starts on the observatory, we'll need to complete the cat when its done if we don't want to lose the hammers.


Golden age coming on t165.


I've been stacking more whip unhappy than I'd like, but if we're going to be in Caste System soon it'll dissipate. Actually, if we're going to get infrastructure up on SFL we'll need to get back into slavery briefly. Perhaps we want to get the pop up in as many cities as possible then set off another golden age and swap to slavery for the duration, or maybe we switch back at the end of this one?

Lets see the recent graphs, our score has flatlined for a little while:


But I'm happy with our current GNP, M3 are in a Golden Age - I'm not sure why Pirates' GNP is so good, maybe because they are still small...


With all our settler builds our MFG has gone up.


And our Crop Yield has flatlined.


We got a knight this turn.


And now that we have research visibility on M3 what would you like next? I'm thinking we should put them on Trolls to try for city visibility, but Pirates for research visibility might be a good idea as they will be our neighbours once they get Astro...



I'm saving money this turn - do we want more galley upgrades next turn? Also any thoughts on Slavery vs Caste after the golden age?

[Cheater Hater]

Things look good on SFL

How much time can we save on the GA by starving BoG, but not starving it enough so it loses a pop?

How much infrastructure does SFL need other than a granary, at least until we cottage all of it? I'm not sure we need to slave SFL at all (though most of the city sites have enough food to do so profitably).

I say go for reseach visibility on Pirates--we need to know when we'll be contested for SFL.

[Old Harry]

Bog is starved as far as it can go I'm afraid.

I thought courthouses as well, but we want state property ASAP so maybe we don't need them? How about workshops rather than cottages on SFL? Then forges and maybe barracks.

Will concentrate eps on pirates.

[Old Harry]

For our attempt to get to state property we're going to need some lightbulbs. Our tech path is going to be something like:
Philosophy->Paper->Education->Alphabet->Printing Press->Sci Meth->Liberalism->Communism

(we have the red ones and want the green ones)

I've reduced the GP preference lists to techs we can bulb or will soon be able to. Both the Prophet and Artist bulb Music first so we need to stear clear of those:

Great Prophet:
-Music
-Philosophy
-Printing Press
-Paper
-Education
-Liberalism

Great Artist:
-Music
-Loads of crap

The Great Scientist gives us Education once we have Paper, then Printing Press, then Scientific Method.

Great Scientist:
-Scientific Method
-Physics
-Education
-Printing Press
-Philosophy
-Chemistry

The Great Merchant and Great Engineer don't do many of the communism techs, but do have some value...

Great Merchant:
-Banking
-Economics
-Corporation

Great Engineer:
-Replaceable Parts
-Steam Power
-Steel
-Railroad
-Fascism
-Corporation
-Gunpowder
-Constitution
-Economics

So I think that once we have our Caste/Pacifism golden age going we need to work all scientists everywhere we think we can get a great person from. Any that come out as non-scientists will need to be saved for future golden ages. (Although banking wouldn't be bad for mercantilism and more specialists). Have I missed anything?

[Cheater Hater]

That seems fine--while we're on our scientist bulb-fest, is there anywhere that really wants an Academy?

How long will it take to get to communism--20 turns? 30 turns? How much does SFL temporarily tanking our economy factor into this? When will we need to divert research into the Rifling Line: (Paper->Alphabet->Printing Press->)Banking->Gunpowder->Replaceable Parts->Rifling? After we get Education, we should check if the Economics merchant is available, and maybe parlay that and a scientist to sustain our GA.

On a somewhat related note, how much does Banking do for us (and what is its ETA)? It would gain us a lot of money in the shrine city, and improve our economy elsewhere, but in those cities we're building a lot of Observatories and Universities, and our cities are relatively hammer-poor :/

[Old Harry]

Our top beaker producer is Occam with 144 at breakeven, second is Dirk with 33, then In the Stone with 18.

So at Dirk we could get about 15 extra beakers a turn from an academy, (I think) a bulb will get us about 1500 beakers (does anyone know how you calculate that?) so it'd be turn 260 before the academy beats the bulb. I think we need to replace some of Dirks farms and mines with cottages - then perhaps it'll deserve the academy...

Actually BoG will be a decent commerce city when it recovers from making the great person - so perhaps an academy could go there along with Wall st. I'd wait and see how its looking in five turns though...

Edit: According to this thread a GS is worth 1500 + total civ pop * 3 = 1500 + 130*3 = approx 1900 beakers.

[Old Harry]

One other thing - now that we've got Astro should we ask Pirates about a NAP? Or should we catch them by surprise and steal some cities once we have State Property and maintenance isn't an issue?