Whosit Clowns Around in EitB PBEM XXVI [SPOILERS!]

[Qgqqqqq]

The civ that kills Muirin is able to choose an enemy civ which will instantly have every city nuked thrice over.

[Brian Shanahan]

Slavery isn't as good as in BtS, and it's hardly every used in these pbems, but it's not useless either. You probably won't do much gold-rushing.

I find slavery is best when you decide to break the world. Raise the AC to about 20, research malevolent designs and adopt Sacrifice of the Weak/Slavery, grow like mad until AC hits thirty and plague hits all cities, whip all the (now) excess population into an army, go conquer a few AIs while they are still in the shite from massive population loss.

Actually with SotW Slavery is a strong civic. It is basically the same nerf as in the RB mod, i.e. you get half the hammers of BtS for every pop you whip, so 2 pop whips in EitB are 4/5 pop whips. With Sacrifice's 1 food per citizen you can grow those big whips back in no time.

One thing to note Good civs cannot adopt Slavery. This removes the religions which turn you Good (Order and Emperyan if you're Neutral {IIRC}) from play in a Slavery strategy.

[Whosit]

The Clan has Warrens, which lets them produce 2 units for one, yes? Combat units only, or Workers/Settlers, too? Are Clan units on par with other civs, or are theirs weaker to account for faster production?

Most Clan units will be doubled by warrens. Settlers, workers, work boats, priests, warriors, etc. The only exceptions are units that are limited in number such as Heroes or National units(limited to 4 per civ), as well as siege and naval.

Clan units in general are similar to those of other civs. In some cases they are slightly better, for example they get Lizardmen(which can attack amphibiously without a penalty) instead of Hunters and Shamans(which don't require a mage guild) instead of Adepts.

Well, fuck. They really can double up on Settlers and Workers?? Ok, I mean, I know that EitB isn't really "balanced" per se, or at least, there are some really strong abilities, but if the Clan can double produce equally strong (or stronger) units, how does one fight them? Hope they bankrupt themselves by making too much stuff?

I do know that Swordsmen can use iron. I think I was gonna talk about that but decided it isn't relevant. I think right now, when Iron Working is really far down the road, it would still make more sense to stock up on Warriors, and switch to Swordsmen and other things as I get closer to IW. Freaks are good, yeah, but it's a gamble. I'll still be making plenty, I'm sure. Combat, Garrison, and Freak Shows.

The civ that kills Muirin is able to choose an enemy civ which will instantly have every city nuked thrice over.

I'm going to kill the crap out of Muirin. It's only, what, like strength 8-10??? Ok, but seriously, how do I kill him? I would love to see the Clan nuked.

And @Brian because too lazy to quote again: That's an interesting plan. If I live long enough to go for the Veil, then I will definitely try that out. It's not like I have to adopt the Kilmorph religion to get the gold benefit.

On another note: Getting Construction slotted in earlier means that travel in the empire will be easier. The rivers, especially the one to the east of the capital, make travel a huge pain right now. I'll still probably get BW first, though. I wanna be able to clear out that Goblin Fort north of Coombe View, too, so I can safely improve the other tiles.

[HidingKneel]

Well, fuck. They really can double up on Settlers and Workers?? Ok, I mean, I know that EitB isn't really "balanced" per se, or at least, there are some really strong abilities, but if the Clan can double produce equally strong (or stronger) units, how does one fight them? Hope they bankrupt themselves by making too much stuff?

With the fact that you get two extra golden ages for free due to your worldspell, the fact that you're teching 10% faster than them due to their barbarian penalty (that's huge!), the fact that you get three traits instead of two (and, since they rotate, you have the potential to take advantage of many more than three), the fact that your mages are much better than his (puppets give a crazy amount of mobility), ...

Also, there's a slight nerf to warrens-produced units: if you've got some source of free xp (apprenticeship, conquest, FotT), then only one of the two units will benefit from it.

The game isn't balanced, but there's lots of awesome to go around.

[Qgqqqqq]

Sorry I was joking about Muirin, he's just a drown with a different skin that appears in one of the scenarios.

[Whosit]

Sorry I was joking about Muirin, he's just a drown with a different skin that appears in one of the scenarios.

>:|

Anyway, yeah, yeah, I know all the civs get crazy good stuff, but that doesn't mean I won't complain about the good stuff I don't have and that can kill me now. I'm pretty sure I'll have the advantage long-term, but I just have to figure out the best way not to die short term....

I suppose that means I should avoid going off half-cocked and declaring war at an early stage in the game, and just try to hunker down and grab up as much land as I can, tech, and keep a large enough army to survive any surprise attacks.

[Brian Shanahan]

I do know that Swordsmen can use iron. I think I was gonna talk about that but decided it isn't relevant. I

You're Kilimorphe, tech Arete>build Mines of Gal Dur. You don't need no steenkin Iron Working.

On a totally unrelated note, the only language where the word for "railway" which doesn't include the equivalent for "iron" is English!

[Ellimist]

Well, fuck. They really can double up on Settlers and Workers?? Ok, I mean, I know that EitB isn't really "balanced" per se, or at least, there are some really strong abilities, but if the Clan can double produce equally strong (or stronger) units, how does one fight them? Hope they bankrupt themselves by making too much stuff?

With the fact that you get two extra golden ages for free due to your worldspell, the fact that you're teching 10% faster than them due to their barbarian penalty (that's huge!), the fact that you get three traits instead of two (and, since they rotate, you have the potential to take advantage of many more than three), the fact that your mages are much better than his (puppets give a crazy amount of mobility), ...

This. The primary Clan weaknesses are going to concern research, so you'll probably be able to reach some of the stronger late game toys before Serdoa can. (Clan can't build libraries either.) The key will be to take advantage of your strengths, as well as the exceptional versatility of your leader and civ.

Also, there's a slight nerf to warrens-produced units: if you've got some source of free xp (apprenticeship, conquest, FotT), then only one of the two units will benefit from it.

I've seen this documented in several places, but this was not the case in FFH-XX or in other test games I did with the Clan.

The game isn't balanced, but there's lots of awesome to go around.

100% agree.

The Erebus in the Balance mod tries to smooth out some of the less balanced features, but ultimately the game is still about finding something awesome and unfair and exploiting the heck out of it.

[Whosit]

Wait, if I build those mines, I get the benefit of Iron without having to tech Iron Working? I thought you still need that tech to get the benefit of iron, even if you have access to it.

Also, I apparently missed the save in my inbox from this morning. Bleh. Gonna do that.

[Ellimist]

Iron Working is needed if you want to produce iron from a mine. Without it, it will be as if the resource isn't even connected.

If you obtain iron (or mithril) from some other method such as the Mines wonder or trading for it, you'll be able to use it regardless of which techs you know.