(June 21st, 2013, 07:35)Gazglum Wrote: I think wolves are likely to be much more careful about their postings than MJW is.
I think Day 1 has played out enough times with vocal people being hanged for perceived slip ups, wolf or town, that wolves are likely to lay low. So I'm wary of players who haven't posted much yet.
quote is from early in day one. he says that, then he spends entire day targeting loudest strangest player.
i dont see any reason for villager to say thats their philosophy then do opposite thing.
This is a good point. I think Gazglum justified his vote for you quite well earlier though:
(June 22nd, 2013, 07:30)Gazglum Wrote: I also agree that you've been posting in a weird way all game. But Lewwyn is right, it's not so much that you CHANGED your style, it's that you double downed on it. You went from a bit weird to 'look at me i'm drawing attention to how weird my posts are'. I admit that I don't quite know why a wolf would post like you were to start with, but it's the shift in emphasis that I can read as Wolfy.
But for me, its simpler than that, I don't like your votes. You talk about 'playing for the team', and it doesn't mastter if you go down as long as you reveal a wolf, etc., but by your own admission you're just self-preservation voting the people in the lead. You're not even questioning them or challenging them to give them something to defend against. That's not good teamwork.
Have you responded to this, Jowy? (Honest question)
Switching up your style is definitely helpful for you if you draw scum in any future games, but how is it helpful for village in this game? And why would you need to "switch up" your style in your first game? Shouldn't your first game be your baseline?
Brick in quicktopic Wrote:The post with the thumbs up and down was just me trying to communicate something along the effect of "Okay, I could just post simple things like the a plain thumbs up and down, but that's boring and makes me sad, so I'm going to go for pictures with more to them and that might be somewhat entertaining instead, I'll enjoy dealing with this alot more."
I realized after I did that that it was dumb and an unhelpful post, due to everyone spending time on it, but my attempts to tell people to forget it ended up being worthless. So count that as a stupid post while I was figuring out how to go with this and stop spending time on it.
Brick in quicktopic Wrote:The post with the thumbs up and down was just me trying to communicate something along the effect of "Okay, I could just post simple things like the a plain thumbs up and down, but that's boring and makes me sad, so I'm going to go for pictures with more to them and that might be somewhat entertaining instead, I'll enjoy dealing with this alot more."
I realized after I did that that it was dumb and an unhelpful post, due to everyone spending time on it, but my attempts to tell people to forget it ended up being worthless. So count that as a stupid post while I was figuring out how to go with this and stop spending time on it.
(June 23rd, 2013, 16:46)pindicator Wrote: I agree with that last one brick. Gazglum, what are your thoughts? I remember the last time I thought you were abnormally silent day 1 in a game was when you ended up being the president in 2R&1B.
I said in the signup thread that I would be a bit less vocal this game, cos I'm moving house at the moment. But the main issue for me is that the deadline is at a really crappy time. I'm not a night owl, so I go to sleep 6-7 hours before deadlines.
(June 23rd, 2013, 16:23)Jowy Wrote:
(June 21st, 2013, 07:35)Gazglum Wrote: I think wolves are likely to be much more careful about their postings than MJW is.
I think Day 1 has played out enough times with vocal people being hanged for perceived slip ups, wolf or town, that wolves are likely to lay low. So I'm wary of players who haven't posted much yet.
quote is from early in day one. he says that, then he spends entire day targeting loudest strangest player.
i dont see any reason for villager to say thats their philosophy then do opposite thing.
Jowy, that is a fair point. And I did try, my first main vote was for UBerfish. But at the time, it gained no traction, and Uber also responded a bit. I was still far from sold on him, but it seemed churlish to keep a 'lurker' vote on him when he was talking more than others. But of the others: Jkaen, Novice, Mattimeo and Azza, I couldn't see who was more deserving. Novice and Jkaen had real life excuses, and Mattimeo and Azza take as much notice of pressure as a stoner angler fish.
I wanted my vote to count, and of the candidates under fire: you, MJW, Slowcheetah, Pindicator, I liked the case on you by far the most. I still do. I put my vote on you, felt like you didn't answer my questions very satisfactorily. I still thought there were lurking wolves, but I didn't have much to go on as to who, and I thought you seemed pretty likely to be a prancing wolf. My deadline came up when I was talking to you about your voting record and style, I wasn't happy with your responses, or with the other cases, so I kept my vote on you.
My main problem was that you were going on about being willing to sacrifice yourself for the team, but also voting to save yourself without seeming to care where your vote landed. Taht's the discrepancy I don't like in your play.
If I had stayed around, I would have been interested in going back to Uberfish when it began to look more like a real chance, but at the time I left you were the best option for me.
I don't know if saying I would sacrifice myself for the team is an accurate way of putting it. More like I was so exasperated with being targeted that part of me thought it wouldn't be such a bad thing if I died. Because in the past when I've managed to shake this it just means it gets brought up again late as a reason to lynch me in LYLO.
If I missed any of your questions, it was not intentional. I'm happy to address them now
actually i never said i'd like to sacrifice myself
i said that i thought about it, but there was no guarantee wolf would get caught as follow up, so i didnt.
in general sacrifice bad play, need to be very confident to do it.
novice, i play 2r1b, most people here played it too. first ww, second forum game. obviously if change style, has to change every game. if only change when wolf, then that defeats purpose.
tbh probably making changes more subtle in future, to not annoy ppl, but not change mid game.
gaz if believe ur own philosophy, why not reluctantly vote best option of ones targeted, but focus post about who u really think are wolves? even after explanation i find ur act wolfy. if u think we target wrong people and ur villager, u would say "hey guys ur wrong heres who we should look at", instead of bandwagon.
I still think jowy is innocent atm. I don't care if he posts in a weird style so long as he is producing actual content. If all 3 main candidates (MJW, jowy, myself) at the end were innocent I think that's somewhat a village tell on Ichabod too, I don't see much incentive for wolf ichabod to start a last minute run on MJW under these circumstances. I think scum would regard me as a higher value mislynch target than MJW anyway since it's easier to get MJW lynched late in the game for acting weird.
I'm ok with pind's explanation of his vote, starting to sound a bit like the emotional village pind from previous games. Brick's vote is weird.
@Novice my point was MJW's speculation was particularly detailed compared to say, Q's, and that gazglum post later was a response to MJW
Speaking of gazglum he definitely feels off his regular game, he usually doesn't hesitate to give a clear opinion on people instead of posting stuff like this:
gazglum Wrote:I wouldbn't be at all surprised if there was wolf involvement in that last minute MJW push, but I do sympathise with the people involved. Deadline hopping is pretty fast-paced stuff, and I know its easy to get caught up in the moment. While I can see why people are suspicious of Pindicator, I can also buy his behaviour as a villager excited at having gone from 'probably going to die' to 'hey, maybe we're about to catch a wolf'.
People on the MJW train the first time through the station don't have teh adrenaline rush defence, so I'm more suspicious of them than the final voters. Skim reading back, that's Uberfish, Mattimeo, Jowy, Ichabod and Pindicator, maybe a couple of others I missed.
There's a lot of hedging there, and the interesting thing about what he mentions concerning MJW voters is that he'd already called everyone voting for MJW potential wolves in the early part of day 1. I think if he's a first time (? not sure) wolf he might be finding it hard to make up reads. Thus the hedging (and spotlighting MJW voters is a pretty convenient method for getting "reads" if you're a wolf and already know MJW is village.)
