WW25 - Game Thread

[Gazglum]

Ok Uberfish, I didn't offer a lot of godo reads Day 1. I find Day 1 hard. I do think that the first batch of MJW voters were suspicious, and that's hardly the whole team. Ichabod, Jowy, PIndicator, Uber, Mattimeo. Of those, I think Ichabod's intuition-style attack was in character, so I looked at the other four. Pindicator I thought could be a wolf, obviously, but I did think that his tone sounded genuine.

That only leaves you, Mattimeo and Jowy. And I voted you and Jowy. I've been consistent about where my suspicions were. I do think Mattimeo could be scum - he sails by, tosses a bandwagon vote at MJW and fades away again - but as I said to Rowain, Mattimeo never offesr much Day 1.

And Mattimeo - I do think that being on MJW earlier is potentially more suspicious than being on him at lynch. Because a wolf want to put your vote somewhere where you know it will be safe during the day, and avoid starting debate with it. The actual lynch vote doesn't matter as long as its not on a scumbuddy.

I think youcould be scum Uber - I didn't like your hostile responses to Pindicator during the night. Jowy I still think very much could be scum - he's making some very coherent points about people today, (again, a shift in style from his noncommunicative votes yesterday), which make him seem very switched on, but yesterday he was playing the noob card.

I also dont like that ýou and Jowy have both come out at the start of Day 2, after a controversial end to Day 1, by both launching fresh attacks on m, when you hadn't pushed at me at all before, even though I had voted both of you.

[Gazglum]

@ Q: I’m not sure about Slow’s case. Sure, it’s silly to say that the wolves were all out to get him. But Slow’s attack on Pindicator felt like real scumhunting, and he followed through on it, keeping his vote there. I agree with him that pressuring lurkers is a good move on Day 1, so I don't mind his Azza vote. He was looking around at other targets, considering Ichabod as well.

Looking back at that exchange, I actually find you more suspicious Qgqqqq. Your initial vote was on Slow, for semi-random reasons (as initial votes always are). But then you spend a day doing nothing except asking questions of Zak and Brick. Your only opinions are

37: Slowcheetah is suspicious for relying on history/bandwagoning
56: I don’t find MJW’s vote suspicious, but fake-edit maybe I do if it was a pressure vote
162: Jowy is screaming wolf, but I don’t think he is.
162: Novice is quiet.

To paraphrase Uber on me, that’s a lot of hedging.

Zak accuses you of making reasonable sounding posts that don’t add much, and then Rowain adds his vote to Slowcheetah bringing him up into lynch territory. So then you bring out the full attack on Slowcheetah, which is fine, except that you were already parked on him and so were presumably thinking about him. But you had said that you “didn’t see any tells”, I’ve not noticed anything in particular” and you told Slow that you weren’t really going after him.

Lynch tells, nothing strikes me as obvious. Q feels curt and I'm a relatively easy mislynch, so good to go after. On the otherhand my first post was apparently pretty baity based on the reactions of most.

I know its a instant reaction to go after someone you feel attacking you, but I don't like this post. Firstly, I'm not really going after you as you claim, a simple post saying a reason I found you suspicious is nothing more then half the players have at this point. Therefore it seems to me that you're simply attacking people voting you at this point, which is an easy move to get away with because you can claim emotional reaction. In the process you are dismissing the vote by saying that you're easy to go after, while simultaneously excusing your suspicion against me by saying that it was a bait worthy post.
I'm not sure I've explained myself properly, but the summary is an attack without attacking, avoiding a confrontation while smearing my vote on you.

I don't want to kill Brick entirely because I'm enjoying his posts. Zak and you are sparring, leaves me fairly convinced that my vote for you has less of a point than it did in the first place.

Fluff, dismissing his earlier vote (though I still find the timing suspect). Is he saying he has town read on zak/Rowain? I can't tell.

Azza hasn't really said much.

A very easy on azza, no real explanation and maintaining that there's no suspicion (so he has no responsibility). Azza never says much, but you really do seem to be trying to fly under the radar.

Wel if nobody is really ringing, surely the best option is ringing up one of the guys with low post counts. It's not like we are particularly late in day one yet.

Why is the best option to dump a vote on someone who isn't going to post because of it (azza)? And someone who isn't going to be lynched today, who you have no suspicions on?

Slow doesn't say much in his other posts. Suffice to say, I think he's trying desperately to lurk and avoid confrontation.
slowcheetah

This post came after you'd already responded to Slow’s 'Q feels curt'post you quote here,and you just gave a friendly apology. Why did you then decide it was scummy?

Rowain and Zak had both voiced suspicion of you, and you end up launching your attack on the other player they had voted for, and Rowain voted you, but then he switches to SLowcheetah. That’s when you stopped hedging and went all-out on Slow - which had the benefit of keeping momentum on him, instead of it drifting back to you. I don't liek the timing.

I think you fall on the scum side of the line Q, more than Slow.

I know people’s opinions can change when you re-read, so I don’t think you’re obv-scum. But I think you, more than Slow, fit the profile of a wolf easing through on Day 1. You minimised antagonising people by not moving your vote around at all.

However, hacing said all that,

Uberfish.

- initially quiet, jumped on MJW and Pindicator once they got going, was part of the mislynch of MJW and then dodged Pindicators questions until he repeated them, and called them mud-slinging. Then he starts Day 2 with a fresh line of attack on me, so he can now say I'm counterattacking.

[Gazglum]

This post I found be one of those announcing "I'm going to bed and I'm leaving my vote parked here for this reason" type of votes. I felt he was pretty obviously doing something that I've done when I was scum which is to lock his vote in.

Lewwyn, I appreciate your belief in my devotion to the cause, but I am only human! It was getting to 11 pm, and Ms Gazglum-to-be was starting to get annoyed. You of all people know what that’s like. Of course I had to lock my vote in, it was my last vote.

Mattimeo, you can’t just offer the tidbit you did and submerge again. Did you follow Lewwyn to Azza, or watch Azza and just see Lewwyn? It’s a pretty important distinction.

[pindicator]

Travel Guide to Speaking Brick. I've added links to the posts being referenced for ease of translation.

Okay, if it's a short post that just has what looks like a simple emotional reaction, that's what it is. Other than those, I'll run through all of my important posts and provide a translation.

#12 & #14: Initial anger at my PR, and that it has to do with sanity.

#30 & #38: My PR can be removed if the sanity drops low enough. However, I have not been told what that exactly that threshold is. I'm guessing since Sanity started at 20 and went down, it would most likely be 10, though 15 and 5 are also clean numbers for it to be at.

#39: Pin already posted explanation.

#105 (I was aiming for literal translations here, looking back this was poorly thought out.) iPad, makes it hard, to post. But! MJW looks crazy. Statement at the end means when Sanity falls, I can talk.

#106: My post #39 is disconnected to sanity, it is connected to trying for a good use of a PR.

#140: STOP! I made everyone confused. That makes me sad. So I'm thinking. About how I can talk. So that everyone understands. And then all of us can shoot those motherfucking wolves, Pulp Fiction style.

#152: Mostly reactions to Jowy's posts. At the end, "WTF Jowy? Why are you not talking right? And, you're talking mainly just about my pictures, not about wolves. Wolf-Jowy!"

#153: I'm facepalming about me, and don't listen to me, that post isn't hunting wolves.

#176: Reactions to novice's posts, observing there's mainly him joking, and i'm not impressed at the others. At the end: "Novice, i'm not impressed. Village novice talks alot. Wolf novice is pretty subdued. I think i've found your evil scheme out."

#177: However, I feel twice as sure Jowy is a wolf than novice.

#180: Telling Slow I could use his name in red to refer to him instead of HAVING to have a picture.

#185: Trying to explain that; the twin babies are identical, so is posting slow's name and his picture.

#188: Nice conspiracy Jowy. I think, instead of what you said, this is just Wolf-Jowy running for his life?

#275: Longer post. The numbers on the dominoes are Post numbers, these are comments on those posts in particular instead of copying all of them. #209: "Yes, I want you to hunt wolves not talk about me" #221: "What? Idk what you're getting at..." #224/228: "Jowy, you're not talking much, not listening, and not hunting wolves, you're just running from accusations. I'm not impressed." #249: "Ooooooh. Jowy knew about 3 wolves? Wolf-Jowy."

#280: Pindicator- you're hunting Zak why?

#286: Okay, Ichabod has 13 posts. 4 are him joking. 4 are him talking about my PR. 3 are him going "Hahaha!" at MJW. 1 is him using that pic to vote Pindicator. 1 is him talking about MJW, joking, and just throwing out that Jowy and slow are innocent. Ichabod isn't talking about hunting wolves at all. I am not impressed and disapprove.

#292 / #294 / #296: Jowy as a pot calling the kettle black, and me freaking out cause i realized that there was accidental small text in the corner i did not realize. I was just given a warning for that since it was 1st offense and accidental.

#320: at that point, i didn't like any of the lynch candidates. I thought pindicator was village, Jowy 50/50 village/wolf, and uberfish 66/33 village/wolf. I am frustrated at that situation, and vote Jowy.

#324: Lol Ichabod starting on a new candidate?

#355: reasoning for my vote. how i felt about pind, jowy, and uber is the same, but i thought ichabod was a wolf. I voted for ichabod, but everyone else was mainly on the other three. So when Ichabod went after MJW, i had an idea. I would vote MJW too, because i had some feelings that he was wolfy, though not strong. If he was a wolf, awesome, wolf killed! If not, i think ichabod likely wolf trying to stir up trouble (and maybe save a fellow wolf...) So now, kill the ichabod.

#408: yeah, gazglum has been tight lipped...

That should be it, if there's anything else i missed you wanna know about feel free to ask me.

[pindicator]

[quote='Lewwyn' pid='386247' dateline='1372034509']
Mattimeo, you can’t just offer the tidbit you did and submerge again. Did you follow Lewwyn to Azza, or watch Azza and just see Lewwyn? It’s a pretty important distinction.

I'm not sure he should reveal that. I agree with Lewwyn that Mattimeo really misplayed that by revealing so soon; why let scum know this distinction as well?

[BRickAstley]

[pindicator]

I re-read a uberfish's day 1, too, Gazglum. Probably am going to re-read Day 1 a lot since I was sick during it. But I'm more willing to think it was uberfish being uberfish -- he's always been a bit gruff in his games and played things really close to his vest. It's annoyed me in the past, too. So i wanted to look and see if he was being inconsistent at all. And it looks like with Jowy you can see he is being consistent - he doesn't explain it very well, and he doesn't follow up a lot, but that's been villager uberfish M.O. in the past. So I think I give uberfish a village lean after the re-read.

But I agree with the others that you've been hedging a bit. And you've been playing things closer to the vest than I recall you doing in past games. It's not just the when of your posts, but the tone. (Zak & novice are probably gonna at me using the T-word again.) You've had a lot more energy behind your posts in previous games; here you feel like you spent your first day trying to play things close to the vest. And it reminds me too much of your 2B&1R game where you had something to hide (being the president). I'm going to bet you have something to hide here as well.

So my vote goes to Gazglum

[Ichabod]

WW25, Day 1. My take using BRick's style:

[Qgqqqqq]

I'll respond to the rest later Gazglum, as I don't have time, but this:

Looking back at that exchange, I actually find you more suspicious Qgqqqq. Your initial vote was on Slow, for semi-random reasons (as initial votes always are). But then you spend a day doing nothing except asking questions of Zak and Brick. Your only opinions are

Where do you get this from?
I thought Slows vote was suspicious, and said so, albeit not locally or loudly, as I didn't have time.

[Mattimeo]

huh

Lewwyn, why were you visiting Azza last night?

Why would you do this? Why would you out yourself as a tracker like this if you were villager? Are you a villager? It's only been 1 night and you immediately run out spill the beans? Why couldn't you wait and follow me again the next night?

I do not want to divulge what my role is. I did not go to Azza to kill him. I did not go to Azza to protect him.

Jesus, Matt either you are scum or you've fucked up.

I did not follow you. I was tracking Azza, and you were the only person to visit him. He did not visit anyone himself.
So, the only conclusion I can make is that you were the one to kill him.

And why would I not out someone who, as is apparent, make a kill on someone? Especially since I seem to recall you being firmly in the "Vig should not shoot first night" camp, which would indicate such a kill was not of town-origin. As worst, your buddies (or the wolves, if you're the SK) kill me off tonight and I've made a 1-1 trade with scum, about the best you can expect as a villager.

[quote='Lewwyn' pid='386247' dateline='1372034509']
Mattimeo, you can’t just offer the tidbit you did and submerge again. Did you follow Lewwyn to Azza, or watch Azza and just see Lewwyn? It’s a pretty important distinction.

I'm not sure he should reveal that. I agree with Lewwyn that Mattimeo really misplayed that by revealing so soon; why let scum know this distinction as well?

Again, why? I can trade 1-1 with someone who it appears almost certainly committed a night kill, in a situation where from past experience he's unlikely to have done so as a town-friendly role. How is that not I thing I should be attempting to do?