Posts: 12,510
Threads: 61
Joined: Oct 2010
(July 30th, 2013, 10:39)scooter Wrote: This isn't a straight Rifles vs Cuirs question. This is a Cuirs X turns earlier vs Rifles question. What "X" represents here is what we need to know, and I don't have the time/opportunity to look into that now. Well, we're currently making about 250 gold/turn. That's improving, but I don't know how fast, so assume it's steady. 2880 beakers difference in path = 2400 base beakers = 10 turns, back of the envelope. Likely to be less, because we're putting serious investment into infra, but I can't say how much less.
Quote:Drafting and building Cuirs are not mutually exclusive choices. An army of Cuirs, Muskets, and Cats can absolutely beat anything that anyone can field in the next 30T.
Agreed. We'll be drafting regardless, even Muskets are worth drafting. But...building Cuirs and building Cats is mutally exclusive, isn't it? I would argue that you can substitute Knights, Muskets, and Cats, or also Knights, Rifles, and Cats. The most vital ingredient is Cats.
Maybe I'm ill-informed, but I think we have only about 20 cats, total, at the moment. I don't think we have spare hammers for either Knights or Cuirassers, really. And once we start fighting, that'll get worse, because we'll be using up cats a lot faster than we use up anything else. I guess that's the main thing. I don't see us having hammers for any serious amount of non-catapult military. We'll have draftees, because those don't cost hammers, but otherwise we'll have to lean on our veterans from the German war.
EitB 25 - Perpentach
Occasional mapmaker
July 30th, 2013, 12:43
(This post was last modified: July 30th, 2013, 12:50 by antisocialmunky.)
Posts: 4,443
Threads: 45
Joined: Nov 2009
(July 30th, 2013, 12:05)scooter Wrote: I'm not talking about shuffling between east and west, that's not possible pre-rails. But of course mobility matters when your western border alone is about 20 tiles and 5 cities.
If they hit us at the same time, I'm not sure how much mobility will matter because we can't simply be at two places at once.
In Soviet Russia, Civilization Micros You!
"Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must."
“I have never understood why it is "greed" to want to keep the money you have earned but not greed to want to take somebody else's money.”
July 30th, 2013, 12:58
(This post was last modified: July 30th, 2013, 13:01 by sunrise089.)
Posts: 6,484
Threads: 63
Joined: Sep 2006
Trying to start answering my own questions.
(July 30th, 2013, 10:56)sunrise089 Wrote: 1) How many Apolyton units do we expect to see, how many will be rifles, and in how many turns.
On t162 Apolyton drafted/whipped 8 times. That's at most 8 jans. On t163 & t164 Apolyton had rifling whipped/drafted a combined 13 times. If we assume Apolyton is making 7 rifles per turn via hurried production, and their front cities are 2/2/3/3/3 turns away from us, that means on t170 they could land at The Gauntlet their t161 existing field army, 8 jans, 46 rifles, and whatever their non-hurried production of units is over 6 turns.
If they move in on t175 as I would, that means they could land at The Gauntlet their t161 existing field army, 8 jans, 81 rifles, and whatever their non-hurried production of units is over 11 turns.
I'm trying to get a handle of Apolyton's total power and production numbers and any known units, but the above is a starting upper bound for what we need to be prepared to handle. Obviously I hope to get this refined soon.
My guess is they won't be slaving an additional 2 rifles per turn and that they may not be able to draft for 13 solid turns, but something like 32 rifles, 5 jans, 20 mixed older units, and 30 cats on t170 and 45-50 rifles, 5 jans, 20 mixed older units, and 30+ cats on t175 seems possible.
Posts: 8,796
Threads: 75
Joined: Apr 2006
I don't think they have enough cities to sustain that draft rate without destroying their civilization.
Darrell
Posts: 6,484
Threads: 63
Joined: Sep 2006
(July 30th, 2013, 13:16)darrelljs Wrote: I don't think they have enough cities to sustain that draft rate without destroying their civilization.
Darrell
If they don't plan to draft at least pretty aggressively then drafting a round of jans was a weird call. They have 18 cities so we're talking 2-3 drafts per. We've said ourselves a lot recently that if we survive the next few dozen turns we probably win, so I think it's fair to plan at least for Apolyton to make One Giant Push to try to remove us from contention.
Posts: 8,796
Threads: 75
Joined: Apr 2006
Stacking three drafts per city means 9 unhappy for 30 turns, in addition to the loss of 48/124 = 38.7% of their population (unadjusted for regrowth). I agree with you they might do it, but it will destroy their civilization unless their invasion is successful beyond the dreams of Avarice.
Darrell
Posts: 6,484
Threads: 63
Joined: Sep 2006
I know we're talking on chat, but I don't think draft unhappy works that way. I think it's 9 unhappy for 8t, 6 unhappy for 9t more, and 3 unhappy for 10t more.
Posts: 5,455
Threads: 18
Joined: Jul 2011
(July 30th, 2013, 13:52)sunrise089 Wrote: I know we're talking on chat, but I don't think draft unhappy works that way. I think it's 9 unhappy for 8t, 6 unhappy for 9t more, and 3 unhappy for 10t more.
It's like this. Fo 'sho.
Posts: 8,796
Threads: 75
Joined: Apr 2006
Yeah...I probably should have been stacking drafts and whips more in my game.
I still don't think it changes the fact that it will wreck their civ, though  .
Darrell
Posts: 70
Threads: 0
Joined: Jan 2013
(July 30th, 2013, 09:05)scooter Wrote: 3) Besides, if CFC is heading for Grens next to go with their cannons (they almost definitely are),
Are you sure they're actually going for steel next? Teching chemistry could be their route to communism. Especially since they're in pacifism, which doesn't make much sense if they're preparing an army but would make sense for pumping out a quick great scientist o bulb sci method.
|
