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(August 13th, 2013, 16:14)Arkipeller Wrote: So... we need to find 3 leaders which we could consider playing and put them in order from most to least interresting. I kind of like Huyana Capac - Idea from earlier. Fin/Ind ain't bad
Well India is pretty interesting! You get an immediate worker turn advantage, and tactical possibilities in war that no other civ can get at any price.
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So who's left who is FIN?
High Tier:
Willem
Medium Tier:
Mansa
Elizabeth
Huayna
Victoria
Low Tier:
Ragnar
Hannibal
Wang Kon
So I guess the problem is that if we choose a civ this early, we won't get a FIN leader probably. I'm nearly sure that HC will be available at 5 if you want him. He's not valued much in the RB meta. I bet Mansa, Lizzy, even Victoria and Hannibal would go before him.
August 13th, 2013, 20:50
(This post was last modified: August 13th, 2013, 20:52 by Lord Parkin.)
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(August 13th, 2013, 16:14)Arkipeller Wrote: So... we need to find 3 leaders which we could consider playing and put them in order from most to least interresting. I kind of like Huyana Capac - Idea from earlier. Fin/Ind ain't bad
I'd be happy with him too, or any of the other good Financial leaders that will still be available. See below.
(August 13th, 2013, 16:22)WilliamLP Wrote: Well India is pretty interesting! You get an immediate worker turn advantage, and tactical possibilities in war that no other civ can get at any price.
The lack of a Fishing or Hunting start though... it would take quite a number of turns (at a guess, at least 50) for India to break even with a Fishing/Mining civ. How many early tiles would actually be improved earlier by the Fast Worker? Not the Sheep, not the Deer, not any of the forest hills... just 2 hills and 2 forests. Sure India will eventually start to gain back lost ground once new cities are founded, but that's a significant price early on for a long return on investment. (Try testing Mysticism/Mining while WorldBuilder-replacing Workers with Fast Workers in the sim to check this for sure.)
So I wouldn't give up the chance to pick a good Financial leader in return for a slower than optimal start.
(August 13th, 2013, 19:07)WilliamLP Wrote: So who's left who is FIN?
High Tier:
Willem
Medium Tier:
Mansa
Elizabeth
Huayna
Victoria
Low Tier:
Ragnar
Hannibal
Wang Kon
So I guess the problem is that if we choose a civ this early, we won't get a FIN leader probably. I'm nearly sure that HC will be available at 5 if you want him. He's not valued much in the RB meta. I bet Mansa, Lizzy, even Victoria and Hannibal would go before him.
I'd probably rank the remaining Financial leaders roughly as follows:
High Tier:
Huayna Capac
Willem
Mansa Musa
Middle Tier:
Hannibal
Elizabeth
Victoria
Low Tier:
Ragnar
Wang Kon
Ragnar would be fine paired with Rome, if only for amusement. I really don't think Imperialistic will be particularly valuable on this map, so Victoria should maybe be shifted down. Will have to test founding new cities in the sim to get a feel for the exact maintenance costs. Either way, there's no way we can't get one of the three high tier civs at this point, so we're guaranteed a good pick regardless.
August 13th, 2013, 23:51
(This post was last modified: August 13th, 2013, 23:54 by Lord Parkin.)
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Quote:1. Team Eagles & Condors - Kurumi / HBHR (with Oxyphenbutazone) - Pacal II
2. Team Dinosaurs - Whiteye / Raptorous - Darius
3. Team Master and Margarita - Slaze / Maga_R (with Jovan Kukic dedlurking) - Willem
4. Bowsling / Aivoturso
5. Team Orgynized - Lord Parkin / Arkipeller / Magno_uy (with WilliamLP dedlurking and Dp101)
6. Team Blame Caledorn - YossarianLives / Caledorn (with Scooter, Old Harry and Cheater Hater dedlurking)
7. Team Care Bears - Yuufo / Bisons
8. Dick76 / DMOC
9. Team My Little Marathon Cannibal Pony - Classical_Hero / Halvgud
10. Barteq / Geo (with Harami dedlurking)
11. Barteq / Geo (with Harami dedlurking)
12. Team My Little Marathon Cannibal Pony - Classical_Hero / Halvgud
13. Dick76 / DMOC
14. Team Care Bears - Yuufo / Bisons
15. Team Blame Caledorn - YossarianLives / Caledorn (with Scooter, Old Harry and Cheater Hater dedlurking)
16. Team Orgynized - Lord Parkin / Arkipeller / Magno_uy (with WilliamLP dedlurking and Dp101)
17. Bowsling / Aivoturso
18. Team Master and Margarita - Slaze / Maga_R (with Jovan Kukic dedlurking)
19. Team Dinosaurs - Whiteye / Raptorous
20. Team Eagles & Condors - Kurumi / HBHR (with Oxyphenbutazone)
Willem before India... called it!
Just look at all those Financial leaders go. It's good we're not much later than 5th in the pick order after all.
Next team's pick... Mansa perhaps? And I reckon Inca will go before India.
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Ragnar of Rome. Why not.
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(August 13th, 2013, 23:55)antisocialmunky Wrote: Ragnar of Rome. Why not.
I think both Mansa and Huyana is better.
I want to win actually
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(August 14th, 2013, 00:51)Arkipeller Wrote: (August 13th, 2013, 23:55)antisocialmunky Wrote: Ragnar of Rome. Why not.
I think both Mansa and Huyana is better.
I want to win actually
Yeah, no point choosing Ragnar when Huayna and/or Mansa are available. It would be funny if Ragnar was paired with Rome, but it wouldn't help us to win. With diplo on such an obviously potent early military combination would be self-defeating, and we wouldn't have a second economically orientated trait available to help us become a later power.
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(August 14th, 2013, 01:03)Lord Parkin Wrote: (August 14th, 2013, 00:51)Arkipeller Wrote: (August 13th, 2013, 23:55)antisocialmunky Wrote: Ragnar of Rome. Why not.
I think both Mansa and Huyana is better.
I want to win actually
Yeah, no point choosing Ragnar when Huayna and/or Mansa are available. It would be funny if Ragnar was paired with Rome, but it wouldn't help us to win. With diplo on such an obviously potent early military combination would be self-defeating, and we wouldn't have a second economically orientated trait available to help us become a later power.
Well... Bowsling and Aivo chose Mansa, so I guess we take Huyana Capac?
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August 14th, 2013, 17:23
(This post was last modified: August 14th, 2013, 17:25 by Lord Parkin.)
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(August 14th, 2013, 17:01)Arkipeller Wrote: Well... Bowsling and Aivo chose Mansa, so I guess we take Huyana Capac?
Yep, he's the best Financial option remaining and the one we were talking about originally anyway.
August 14th, 2013, 17:34
(This post was last modified: August 14th, 2013, 17:37 by Lord Parkin.)
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Here's the current list:
Quote:1. Team Eagles & Condors - Kurumi / HBHR (with Oxyphenbutazone) - Pacal II
2. Team Dinosaurs - Whiteye / Raptorous - Darius
3. Team Master and Margarita - Slaze / Maga_R (with Jovan Kukic dedlurking) - Willem
4. Bowsling / Aivoturso - Mansa Musa
5. Team Orgynized - Lord Parkin / Arkipeller / Magno_uy (with WilliamLP dedlurking and Dp101) - Huayna Capac
6. Team Blame Caledorn - YossarianLives / Caledorn (with Scooter, Old Harry and Cheater Hater dedlurking) - Inca
7. Team Care Bears - Yuufo / Bisons
8. Dick76 / DMOC
9. Team My Little Marathon Cannibal Pony - Classical_Hero / Halvgud
10. Barteq / Geo (with Harami dedlurking)
11. Barteq / Geo (with Harami dedlurking)
12. Team My Little Marathon Cannibal Pony - Classical_Hero / Halvgud
13. Dick76 / DMOC
14. Team Care Bears - Yuufo / Bisons
15. Team Blame Caledorn - YossarianLives / Caledorn (with Scooter, Old Harry and Cheater Hater dedlurking)
16. Team Orgynized - Lord Parkin / Arkipeller / Magno_uy (with WilliamLP dedlurking and Dp101)
17. Bowsling / Aivoturso
18. Team Master and Margarita - Slaze / Maga_R (with Jovan Kukic dedlurking)
19. Team Dinosaurs - Whiteye / Raptorous
20. Team Eagles & Condors - Kurumi / HBHR (with Oxyphenbutazone)
So Mansa Musa was a good guess... what next? There's a little bit of a drop-off to the next Financial leaders, so I wonder whether we'll see Blame Caledorn pick Elizabeth/Hannibal/Victoria... or a non-Financial leader like Sury... or a civ like Inca/India. Hard to tell. I'm going to bet Elizabeth goes before Hannibal, Hannibal before Victoria and Inca before India over the next few picks. Harder to pick where Sury and other non-Financial leaders fit in and how the civs and leaders will fit together - really comes down to the preferences of the individual players.
EDIT: Well that was quick, Inca went while I was typing.
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