Intersite Game - Turn Discussion Thread

[TheHumanHydra]

Good work MH, thanks for sticking with the turns.

+1. I'm still reading .

Darrell

+1

+1, even if there's not much for me to say.

[mostly_harmless]

Looks like Starfall still stands. That counts as a success. Will log in and post pics in around 12hrs.

mh

[Fintourist]

Looks like Starfall still stands. That counts as a success. Will log in and post pics in around 12hrs.

mh

[mostly_harmless]

Need another 8 hrs before login.

[mostly_harmless]

T175 early:
We lost Denial of Nile as expected to the big Apolyton Rifle stack.
And this is the Apolyton front. They split their stack.


Nothing we can do about the two big stacks. But we can hit those three Rifles and the cat on the Hill at PETA with our large cat and mace stack. At least we start hitting back somewhat and get our maces into play. Thoughts?
In other news, there is an Apolyton cannon now!
Apolyton is going to take three cities from us next turn:


Doppelgänger is gone. I suggest drafting one last Rifle out of it which then retreats. Unless you feel that we should keep it on the Doppelgänger hill to trade maybe one of their rifles for it? I don't like this idea, though. Rather retreat and form a stack of our own.
After drafting the only worthwhile thing to whip is a spy, as it won't get killed instantly next turn.
Once Doppelgänger is gone, they can road the tile 2SW of War paint with the two workers in Beyaz Penyar and take War Paint with a single Horse Archer from the tile 2W of Doppelgänger. We cannot get a unit into War Paint unfortunately to hold it for one more turn. Again, I suggest whipping a spy as a last action here.
And there is finally a galley up in the north. If there is a unit on it, which will be the case, it will take Dom Dilemma.
So, nice progress for Apolyton. But I rather have them taking the German lands than rushing our core.

Here the Civplayers front:


They are forming another Cuirassier stack. There is also mobility Cuirassier in there, which could hit Frozen Jungle if we are careless, or PETA Crusader.

And here the CFC attack:
Yeah, the plan to whip those walls in Eastern Dealers, Starfall and Forbidden Fruit to stop rushing Knights last turn did not work out, as apparently the walls got made obsolete by Rifling before they got built. So that's a lot of pop wasted, because the hammers vanished completely. Not overflowed into anything else. That sucks big time. Bug?!
I of course blame all you pro players for not pointing this out last turn.

First Starfall, which still stands, despite the walls desaster.


CFC is not risking their Knights and is waiting for the slow cannons. Fine.
We retreat the Starfall troops westwards. Might decide to pillage a road to prevent the Knights from chasing.
One last draft from Starfall as well and a Spy whip.

Eastern Dealers:


Big stack incoming. But I think we can put enough defenders into Eastern Dealers to prevent the Knights from taking the city early next turn after the Great Person is born.

There are also a couple of CFC Knights headed north towards WPC lands. Not sure whether they are part of a wide flanking operation.

And this is us in full Rifle mode.


I reckon we can get 7-10 Rifles per turn via production, whipping, upgrades and drafting.

And here is what we are facing:



Another decision: I would like to use some of our cash to upgrade worthy Muskets to Rifles in crucial positions. That will delay paying back UCiv, but half a dozen Rifles might make a difference to holding onto a couple of commerce cities a while longer.
Thoughts?
Can someone count how much cash we got from UCiv?
We are making ~250 per turn. Will be more once we decide to go into a Golden Age.

mh

[Zargon]

I wouldn't bother attacking any of Poly's stuff. That stack of stuff we could throw at 3 rifles could be used to wipe out a CFC stack.

The goal for the CFC front should be to make them roll cannons up to any city they want to take, then mostly empty it. It might be worthwhile to leave 1-2 defenders in the city when we empty it, so long as they can't get odds on them without bombarding the city. Their options would presumably be to sacrifice a unit or two, or bombard and delay a turn, both of which are good outcomes for 1-2 defenders. Hopefully at some point we can amass a big enough stack to credibly threaten to demolish their stack.

I don't think we should do cash upgrades.

Another +1 on thanks for sticking with the game =]

[T-hawk]

Yeah, the plan to whip those walls in Eastern Dealers, Starfall and Forbidden Fruit to stop rushing Knights last turn did not work out, as apparently the walls got made obsolete by Rifling before they got built. So that's a lot of pop wasted, because the hammers vanished completely. Not overflowed into anything else. That sucks big time. Bug?!
I of course blame all you pro players for not pointing this out last turn.

It's obvious in hindsight. The same mechanism that auto-upgrades musket build orders to rifles will also clear out obsolete build orders like walls or duplicate wonders. But I wouldn't have thought of it ahead of time.

I'm for some very limited musket upgrading, only in key positions where it will be defending a city that same turn.

[Boldly Going Nowhere]

In cities that we are about to lose, I suggest burning as much population on dry whips as possible. I like the spy builds, I hadn't thought to do that. In addition to the spy whips, if we can then kill more pop with a second dry whip or more, I suggest doing so. A size 6 city 2 pop whips a spy, swaps to whatever will 2 pop down to two, swap build to scout, 2-->1 whip again, then swap production back to the spy that we can keep. I don't want to give anything over except blackened soil. It's war, nothing personal.

Thanks for fighting on, mh.

[DaveV]

Another +1 for playing on, mh.

My take on the upgrade question: any money spent on upgrades should be made back in a very short time (three turns, say?). So, if an upgrade will save a city that pays back the upgrade cost in three turns or less, I think it's OK. Otherwise, I think we're morally obliged to pay back the loan ASAP, even if it hurts. uCiv made some sacrifices to help us out; now it's our turn.

[mostly_harmless]

I wouldn't bother attacking any of Poly's stuff. That stack of stuff we could throw at 3 rifles could be used to wipe out a CFC stack.

I rather not lose PETA Crusader now if I can help it, as it opens up too much of a hole in our culture. The longer we can hold the Frozen Jungle the better.
I was thinking a limited number of cats and mace to take out the Apolyton mini stack, to prevent them to take PETA Crusaders.
Those units are nowhere near CFC anyway.

The goal for the CFC front should be to make them roll cannons up to any city they want to take, then mostly empty it. It might be worthwhile to leave 1-2 defenders in the city when we empty it, so long as they can't get odds on them without bombarding the city. Their options would presumably be to sacrifice a unit or two, or bombard and delay a turn, both of which are good outcomes for 1-2 defenders. Hopefully at some point we can amass a big enough stack to credibly threaten to demolish their stack.

Yep, something like this.

I don't think we should do cash upgrades.

I'm for some very limited musket upgrading, only in key positions where it will be defending a city that same turn.

My take on the upgrade question: any money spent on upgrades should be made back in a very short time (three turns, say?). So, if an upgrade will save a city that pays back the upgrade cost in three turns or less, I think it's OK. Otherwise, I think we're morally obliged to pay back the loan ASAP, even if it hurts. uCiv made some sacrifices to help us out; now it's our turn.

Ok, agreed. We will start paying pack UCiv in small chunks now, unless we urgently need 110 gold to upgrade a musket.

In cities that we are about to lose, I suggest burning as much population on dry whips as possible. I like the spy builds, I hadn't thought to do that. In addition to the spy whips, if we can then kill more pop with a second dry whip or more, I suggest doing so. A size 6 city 2 pop whips a spy, swaps to whatever will 2 pop down to two, swap build to scout, 2-->1 whip again, then swap production back to the spy that we can keep. I don't want to give anything over except blackened soil. It's war, nothing personal.

We are going to lose mostly cities of size 6 or less in the next turns. Any city that can be drafted will get drafted. At size 5 we can dry whip a Spy and that's it. Remember the penalty applied to dry whips!
What little production remains before it changes hand will go into wealth for example.

mh