WW27 Game Thread: Once there were 12

[Jkaen]

I thought we covered this.

As you said wolves just need the one vote they can use at this point. For you two that had to be a case of either Qgq or Azarius, I believe you decided you could sway Qgq to your vote.

After that the decision is which kill will assist Qgq in still believing the 2 of you are innocent.

Can't kill Jowy as thats who you were hoping to set up, so has to be me or Azarius. I guess the thought was that if I died then maybe Qgq would think Novice/you did it to eliminate my vote against you today, and that the azarius kill was less likely to scare his vote from your voting block

[novice]

JKaen, look at Jowy's reaction to our essays. He doesn't respond to any of it, just locks in his vote since we failed to vote for each other. He wants to close down discussion.

I didn't quote specific examples of Jowy's bad logic (Zak said it well - it's like he intentionally botched his conclusions) because they've been mentioned already, and because I was offline when I wrote it, so I couldn't.

A few examples I remember, from memory:
- botched summary of events wrt Zak on day one, and repeated on day two. Characterized as horsheshit by mattimeo.
- concluding that I'm scum because I'm more likely to be scum than Zak, without explaining why that is or why either of us has to be scum in the first place
- insisting that nothing can be learned from the MJW lynch since both scum were on it
- Saying scum feared Azarius having three shots (and two unused shots on night 4)
- Saying I'm scummy because Zak is sheeping me (and concluding that I'm more scummy than Zak in the same breath)

[zakalwe]

Yes, we've been over it, and like I said, we could also have used Jowy's vote to lynch Azarius.

Killing you would have been the obvious path to victory if your theory was true, as you're the only one who definitely wasn't willing to lynch anyone else.

[novice]

I also found this nugget:

I don't think following novice is like the real Zak...

If MJW had said the sky was blue would you now be doubting that.

Scum saying something that is clearly obvious doesnt make it untrue.

Why draw attention to the one thing that in your opinion reveals us as scum?

[Jkaen]

Yes, we've been over it, and like I said, we could also have used Jowy's vote to lynch Azarius.

Killing you would have been the obvious path to victory if your theory was true, as you're the only one who definitely wasn't willing to lynch anyone else.

Wrong,

This counters your own argument that:

They don't even care about killing off their accusers, per se. The only thing they care about is to ensure that someone who is innocent attracts at least one vote from someone else who is innocent.

As I detailed above all you needed was Q's vote, you then need to work out who to kill in order to secure that vote. Everybody elses vote then is meaningless.

[Jkaen]

Why draw attention to the one thing that in your opinion reveals us as scum?

One of the things, not the one thing.

To be honest as much as I would like a meaningful day of werewolf, we are wasting each others time here. I am not changing my vote, I have no doubt atm that I am correct. You are not going to change your vote onto zak either.

It also seems that even after your responses from last night Q thinks you are scum to, but there is at least some doubt there. I will let you try to continue to convince him, but trying to sway me is pointless given it seems you are quite busy nowadays.

[zakalwe]

As I detailed above all you needed was Q's vote, you then need to work out who to kill in order to secure that vote. Everybody elses vote then is meaningless.

The more "outs" the better, obviously. Ideally, every villager should have someone to suspect that is also a villager. Killing you would ensure that, and keeping you around would just ensure that there's one player who cannot be swayed (as you're eager to demonstrate). That would also be very dangerous for us, because the other villagers could decide that they trust you to be innocent, and therefore feel compelled to vote with you.

[novice]

So because Jowy is the most scummy (hence why he is the others favourites) I must be scum... that makes no sense.

No, what I said was that if one of Zak/Q is scum you're probably the other since both of them are pushing Jowy.

but you're right that it's flawed, since they could just be pushing a Jowy/me or Jowy/Zak wagon and intending to ninja switch.

[Qgqqqqq]

I'm not sure what I'm going to vote, and I'm going to be posting more soon, but as a premise, no vote

[novice]

Well I don't understand how you can have no doubt, JKaen. You and Jowy are even forcing me to just assume that Zak is innocent since you've already locked on to me as scum with Zak.

I suggest you take 8 hours off, reflect, and then reconsider what's happening in this game.

Q, if you're innocent you should vote Jowy, and tomorrow we'll reevaluate everyone.