0. Player Requests: The player's requests take precedence, even if they contradict the following guidelines.
1. Balance: The map must be balanced, both in regards to land quality and availability and in regards to special civilization features. A map may be wonderfully unique and surprising, but, if it is unbalanced, the game will suffer and the player's enjoyment will not be as high as it could be.
2. Identity and Enjoyment: The map should be interesting to play at all levels, from city placement and management to the border-created interactions between civilizations, and should include varied terrain. Flavor should enhance the inherent pleasure resulting from the underlying tile arrangements. The map should not be exceedingly lush, but it is better to err on the lush side than on the poor side when placing terrain.
3. Feel (Avoiding Gimmicks): The map should not be overwhelmed or dominated by the mapmaker's flavor. Embellishment of the map through the use of special improvements, barbarian units, and abnormal terrain can enhance the identity and enjoyment of the map, but should take a backseat to the more normal aspects of the map. The game should usually not revolve around the flavor, but merely be accented by it.
4. Realism: Where possible, the terrain of the map should be realistic. Jungles on desert tiles, or even next to desert tiles, should therefore have a very specific reason for existing. Rivers should run downhill or across level ground into bodies of water. Irrigated terrain should have a higher grassland to plains ratio than dry terrain. Mountain chains should cast rain shadows. Islands, mountains, and peninsulas should follow logical plate tectonics.
(January 17th, 2014, 21:12)Merovech Wrote: Three people who come across as slightly suspicious, in order of increasing suspicion: MJW, zakalwe, and Sunrise089. MJW's play seems erratic and tentatively held, but I suppose tht is normal. zakalwe is more of a feeling; he seemed obfusive to me. Sunrise's big post I just didn't like at all, though he is new and I remember tht I was terrible my first game.
I will keep my vote on sunrise for now, might switch to zakalwe, probably not to anyone else unless something extraordinary happens.
This is a bit bastardly perhaps, because I agree with you on Zakalwe and will keep my vote on him till he responds about you, but this post rang some alarm bells for me. First off your doing the dance of indecision on MJW (he's suspicious! But normal!) that helps prolong the pressure currently on him without officially taking part in what might turn out to be a typical Day 1 lazy lynch.
Also, there's still a day of chatter left to play out, so it seems a bit premature to start locking yourself in. And its kind of a convenient list too. If Zak is innocent but pressure keeps building against him, then you've set yourself up to join a lynch on him that could see a strong troubleshooter out early. And if that fails then you have the ever mislynchable MJW or a new player to fall back on. If I look at this with my paranoid glasses, I see a commie setting himself up to be able to ride through to the lynch without any more scum-hupost nting required.
But other than that, thanks for your support on Zak and it IS good to share thoughts! Keep it up
(January 17th, 2014, 21:59)Merovech Wrote: Also, can I scrub myself?
You should, twice a day.
I really don't like how after being prodded about his not giving any reason for voting me, Old Harry just makes an offhand comment about how his reason is consistent with his goals, like he had given one earlier and people just didn't like it.
I know this is spacetyrantxenu's first ww game, but he seems to be playing up the noob thing a bit, he's devoting a good chunk of page space pitching up questions, rhetorical and otherwise. It could certainly be genuine, it just seems a bit much. I was actually planning on sticking my vote onto him for now, until I noticed this post from Gazglum.
(January 17th, 2014, 18:52)Gazglum Wrote: Bob, your logic makes sense, but reasons of sportsmanship and roleplay mean that we have to lynch. As Happiness Officer, I need to push for what will make the group happiest, and I think we all know that Happiness is a Dead Commie. The second-best option is to die gloriously for Friend Computer, so even a mislynch is happier than not doing our duty!
But it's really great that you're throwing up these ideas for discussion.
Merovech and Azarius haven't offered us anything much yet, but the second day is just getting rolling so I expect to see them chime in soon. Mattimeo is playing the strong, silent, leadership card, which is great and I'm sure he'll step in to guide us before the end. I'll hold off on Old Harry until he's had a chance to respond to some of the points made to him, MJW seems in character, and I think Jowy is being helpful and desesrves a pat on the back.
Lacking any obvious tells like hammers and sickles being found in people's personnell lockers, I'll vote Zakalwe for making lots of 'maybe X could be scummy' musings without following up with the big red pencil.
Zak, you haven't shifted your first vote yet. Does that mean you think Merovech is genuinely most suspect still?
Lots of x could be scummy musings without backing it up with a vote. In general I would agree that zak does tend to this when he is scum. However, I don't think he has been doing it this game. He has seven posts so far. He only really mentions any type of suspicion in three of them, and of those one is his first post with his joke vote. He questions a bit in the other two, but I think it's a huge stretch to say he's been throwing around lots of suspicion without backing it up.
Quote:Catwalk and Q (and Zak I think) - yes my posts have been fluff, but can you point out any in the first hundred that weren't? I thought the point of this game was to let everyone know what you're thinking early on so that the village has the most info available to make decisions on.
My problem was with the MJW vote and then dismissal, I didn't see anything particularly wrong with your posts (although I would definitely disagree that most posts have been fluff).
I'm leaning Catwalk currently, as a read-through of the first half of the thread makes him sound very odd to me. For example, his case on Old Harry is extremely grasping at straws, including as it does a criticism of Harry's opening joke post, and his interplay with Lewwyn is also rather odd. I don't think I've played a game with Catwalk before, however, so I'm hesitant to jump to conclusions, especially given how lynchable he looks. Another that I can't help but find scummy is Spacetyrantxenu, but I'm not sure why that is, possibly his meandering writing style is reading like scum fluff. I dunno sorry.
Q, you yourself were voting for Old Harry shortly after Catwalk did, you even cited his reason in your post. Why is his case now grasping at straws when you agreed with him before? (Which as Ichabod said is half of the game, especially so early in it imo.)
(January 17th, 2014, 20:38)Mattimeo Wrote: Yes, because the mutant commie traitors would never think to utilise the existence of clones to set one of their own number up as one of these 'guaranteed loyal' team members created by their night kill.
Or are you proposing this course of action specifically to fulfill the exact scenario I presented, as part of your nefarious plan to subvert our glorious Friend Computer?
Yeah, if only I had brought up this exact scenario myself as a possibility and my rationale for why it was an acceptable risk- oh wait I did:
Quote:Or the wolves could attack one of their own members- but that's also a minor win for the village, even if it buys the scum some temporary cover, since it makes the wolf vulnerable to a vig kill later on.
Shouldn't our team leader at least be literate?
Anyway, I will vote for someone since I don't think No Lynching is happening right now, and by itself my vote is useless.
I can see the MJW situation a couple ways. He could be a commie, who either reveals the identity of anyone who performs a night action on him or who will have an allied Watcher targeting him, hence why he wants powerful villagers to investigate him.
But that doesn't seem too likely to me, in large part because it's a huge risk strategy which has a good chance of getting him killed on Day 1 for no benefit to his team, and if my understanding of the wounding rules is correct his cover would be completely blown once the people who used their powers on him started started losing clones in the night. Would sacrificing MJW for a chance at catching some village power players make sense for a wolf team? Maybe, enough that I can't rule it out completely, but it doesn't seem particularly likely to me.
What makes more sense I think is that he's a villager who in typically hamfisted fashion is trying to make use of some exotic power apparently not found on the Mafia Wiki. Maybe he learns the alignment of anyone who performs an action on him or gets to communicate with them or something and is trying to put together a secure network. I don't know, and I don't want to know- MJW has played this incredibly poorly (if he isn't just lying through his teeth), having given away just enough about his role to make himself a both a target (if he's village) and suspicious, but poor play from a villager standpoint is a bad reason to lynch someone, unless it is incredibly egregious- which is not the case here. Or like I said he could be lying, and I can think of some pro-town reasons for that.
(Edit while I'm writing this- or his homebrew villager power could be getting free vig shots. Okay. But he's not giving it away, guys! Also good catch, Mattimeo.)
So I'm going to vote for Azza, because I think MJW is most likely innocent, and voting for him right now is in most circumstances unhelpful. And Azza's reason for voting for MJW is really lame. MJW is "playing it up for the crowd"? Why would that help a wolf? What does that even mean? And voting for anyone for being "meta-crazy" is just a terrible rationale. Half of my posts here have been meta-crazy, and you apparently liked those!
I wouldn't normally be locking myself onto anyone, Gazglum, but I'll be with very limited Internet access until Sunday and I want to make clear where I stand right now.
I'm thinking of scrubbing MJW; he seems to really want some night action and delaying that for a day might be a good idea, if he is not provillage, with not nearly the potential loss of lynching him if he actually gets village power with being targeted.
Merovech's Mapmaking Guidelines:
0. Player Requests: The player's requests take precedence, even if they contradict the following guidelines.
1. Balance: The map must be balanced, both in regards to land quality and availability and in regards to special civilization features. A map may be wonderfully unique and surprising, but, if it is unbalanced, the game will suffer and the player's enjoyment will not be as high as it could be.
2. Identity and Enjoyment: The map should be interesting to play at all levels, from city placement and management to the border-created interactions between civilizations, and should include varied terrain. Flavor should enhance the inherent pleasure resulting from the underlying tile arrangements. The map should not be exceedingly lush, but it is better to err on the lush side than on the poor side when placing terrain.
3. Feel (Avoiding Gimmicks): The map should not be overwhelmed or dominated by the mapmaker's flavor. Embellishment of the map through the use of special improvements, barbarian units, and abnormal terrain can enhance the identity and enjoyment of the map, but should take a backseat to the more normal aspects of the map. The game should usually not revolve around the flavor, but merely be accented by it.
4. Realism: Where possible, the terrain of the map should be realistic. Jungles on desert tiles, or even next to desert tiles, should therefore have a very specific reason for existing. Rivers should run downhill or across level ground into bodies of water. Irrigated terrain should have a higher grassland to plains ratio than dry terrain. Mountain chains should cast rain shadows. Islands, mountains, and peninsulas should follow logical plate tectonics.
(January 17th, 2014, 22:47)Merovech Wrote: I wouldn't normally be locking myself onto anyone, Gazglum, but I'll be with very limited Internet access until Sunday and I want to make clear where I stand right now.
I'm thinking of scrubbing MJW; he seems to really want some night action and delaying that for a day might be a good idea, if he is not provillage, with not nearly the potential loss of lynching him if he actually gets village power with being targeted.
If he has some passive effect that triggers when he is visited, will scrubbing even have an effect? It says they can't "perform any actions" but would that effect passive type abilities?
Great post Bob. I agree with what you're saying about MJW and that's sort of what I was pointing to earlier as well.
Matt you can't say that MJW is implying that that is his role. If he is, it doesn't matter. More likely he's in his own head making up roles to see who reacts. Then he applies what reactions he thinks he should get to everyone else and figures out who is scummy or townie via that. All that post does for me is confirm more that MJW is likely innocent because its a post village MJW would make to try and trap scum.
“The wind went mute and the trees in the forest stood still. It was time for the last tale.”
Also good catch, Mattimeo.)
