[Spoiler] RB Pitboss #2 - Shaka of Rome

[Shoot the Moon]

I would perhaps take the NAP discussion out of the last two paragraphs. I don't see the point in emphasizing what you disagree with, and would instead put the emphasis on what you are offering them.

[Whosit]

Excitement! I finally got to log on, and confirmed that Seoul is still a turn away from their Settler. Mine is already on its way. This should be in the bag. Just 3 more turns until I have my second city . . . . I wonder if it will be the first second city in the game? There are still 3 turns for someone else to get a city down, but I guess it would be a nice bragging right if I make it.

Anyway, thanks you all for the suggestions for my letter! I haven't sent it yet, but I'll be revising it now and sending it off to the winds shortly.

@zakalwe: Not sure I really care to call for a settling race. That might end up sounding more antagonistic than I'd like right now. I don't think I'm giving up anything I don't want to. I honestly don't care if they settle in the border area first. In fact, I hope that they do! It means they won't have a metal from their second city, and neither of those locations have a ton of production potential (aside from whippings/chopping). I would just bypass them and head to Seoul and keep a garrison in my territory for protection.

@Kyan: Good point about the "hill." Yeah, no reason to mention that. I honestly don't know what visibility Korea has in the area. I haven't seen any of their units since I've started playing (well, units not in their territory), but they have at least explored as far north as the Silk. It's possible that they've gone no further . . . . I don't know if their offer to trade me Silk is genuine or they didn't notice the silk in my planned city's BFC.

@Shoot the Moon: Also good point. I'll try to focus on the good parts. I imagine that I'll have to explain my position on the NAP again (or, maybe not? They might not really care anymore).

Here's the final (sent) version:

Dear plako and Broker33,

Good to hear from you again. I apologize that I could not reply more promptly, but it is a very busy time. I hope that you understand. However, the delay has given me time to consider the latest offer. I will address it point by point.

*NAP. As I have expressed before, the Imperium does not desire an extension of the NAP. We trust our Korean neighbors not to attack us and consider the threat of war deterrent enough. I do not desire hostile relations between our people; I simply do not desire to sign long-term agreements at this time.

*City placement. I've taken another look at your offer, and I actually do not believe that there is any conflict with my planned settlement. I can settle at my desired location and you will still be able to settle 1W from the north Silk as well as on the hill NW of the crabs. All three cities should be able to coexist and Korea will control the entire border region, which I do not think is a bad deal for you.

*Open Borders. This is the one point on which we have had no disagreement. We declare Open Borders as soon as one party has learned how to Write, and up to two observers may enter the other's territory. These observers may be either Scouts or Warriors.

*Trade. The Imperium is open to any fair trades that could be made once we have trade routes with Korea. The exact items to be exchanged will of course be determined at that time, but I am sure that we would both find a trade of luxury resources favorable.

I believe those were all of the points that we have discussed. We seem to be in general agreement aside from the NAP issue. But for everything else, it seems to me that we are on the same page and I think that we are more in agreement than in disagreement. This appears to be the basis for final discussions or perhaps an actual deal. Does this seem agreeable to you? Please let me know as soon as you have reached a decision.

Best regards,

Whosit, Ruler of the Interim Imperium

[Swiss Pauli]

I think Korea got a bit confused in their previous email: isn't the hill 1NE (not NW) of the crab, and 1W of the upper of the twin silks has no food (I think they meant 1NW). Which is their problem, not yours

[Whosit]

I think Korea got a bit confused in their previous email: isn't the hill 1NE (not NW) of the crab, and 1W of the upper of the twin silks has no food (I think they meant 1NW). Which is their problem, not yours

Actually, the hill is 1NW of the crabs. But you're right, they probably did make a mistake saying 1W of the Silk. And you're right, it is their problem. Heh heh.

Looks like I won't get to play the next turn until late tonight since we're still waiting on regoarrarr. Oh, well. I guess after getting in, like, six turns over the weekend, I've gotten spoiled.

Edit: Oh, figures! The new turn starts as soon as I leave home for the day. Oh well. Tonight. Tonight, to glory.

[MWIN]

Small request: When you are posting new information, can you create a new post instead of editing old one. This thread does not come on top, if you edit old post.

Also, you want to win post count race, don't you? Well with Sulla in the race you need squeeze every last drop….

[Whosit]

Small request: When you are posting new information, can you create a new post instead of editing old one. This thread does not come on top, if you edit old post.

Also, you want to win post count race, don't you? Well with Sulla in the race you need squeeze every last drop….

I didn't really consider that comment major enough to warrent a new post in and of itself. But, I'll remember to make new posts for significant updates.

Also, I don't really care about the "post count race." So long as I generate enough interest to get some lurkers to comment, that's good enough for me. =)

Though you'll all have to wait about, uh, five, maybe six hours before I can play my text turn and update.

Remind me to post the picture I had, but last turn Thannis was running from a bear. I think I forgot to mention that what with all the other excitement. Bears are scary!

[Whosit]

Finally got my turn in. Nothing exciting. All is proceeding as I have foreseen.

Except that Thannis is taking a detour in the east, due to the bear. I really hope I meet someone else soon, even the violent Inca.

And it appears that the stalling has come to an end.

Dear Whosit,

Alright we accept. Here are or the ingredients of the deal. I hope I got them right:
* NAP until turn 66. Deal must be canceled before turn 56 starts. If not canceled it is automatically continued until turn 106
* We settle northern city 1W from the northern silk
* We settle southern city 1NW from the crabs
* You settle city far norht 1E from the cows
* Rome will not expand any further to the west. Future expansion will be to the east.
* Open Borders agreement right away when other party has researched Writing. We both have a right to send at most 2 observers (either scouts or warriors) on other players land

Best regards,
plako and Broker33

Quick analysis, as I need to get to bed quite soon.

NAP: Good for me. The only downside is that they get a 10-turn warning to cancellation, but I can live with that. I will definitely have to set reminder for myself. Are there turn alarms in Civ? But I'll do my best to recall that I must notify them ON T55 (note the wording).

Everything else is fairly clear. Note they say my city is the "far north." Hmm. Does that mean anything? I won't read that much into it, as that is a dangerous path, but it suggests they haven't scouted too far that way.

Seoul has produced its settler. I will be eager to see if they go for the Silk or Crab location with it, but I doubt it. If they do not settle in the border region, I suspect that they have metal somewhere.

As a quick, quick side-note, I was thinking . . . After Pottery, if none of the early religions have fallen (5 civs started with Myst, I guess no one was in a hurry to get religions), maybe I can try to get to Priesthood, use City 4 to get that marble, and build/chop out the Oracle, maybe taking Metal Casting or something. I won't plan my strategy around it. Getting Currency and CoL will be important, too, but if no one has taken the religions (meaning no one has Poly or Meditation) I might be able to pull it off.

I'll play it by ear. For now? Securing Copper and Iron is of the utmost importance.

[Whosit]

Hmm . . . I may have cause for concern yet.

I suspect that Korea has Copper in their BFC. On a plains hill. And it has just been mined. That is the most logical explanation for the jump in their production. I should be able to confirm it in a couple turns when the Food graph will register a slight drop in crop yields (they would have stopped working a grassland hill mine to work the Copper mine). Checking my records, from when they chopped a forest for their settler, this gave them just enough time to move their worker and complete a 4-turn mine. Interesting. Most interesting. Perhaps that explains their new willingness to cut a deal with so many concessions? They'll be able to build bronze-equipped soldiers for a full 14 turns before I can. And shortly after I get copper, I will have to announce my cancellation of the NAP.

Things are going to get interesting, indeed.

Well, here's an older picture:



Run from the bear!

And now he has found this:



If there is food near the gold, that could make another nice place to settle at some point. If I don't get beaten to it.

Anyway, I plan to accept the treaty. I'll also know next turn, probably next turn, if Korea is settling in the border area. Regals Reach will do a quick Monument, Barracks, then a couple of scouts (Warriors aren't going to be too useful right now). One will head West to get a better idea of what's around Seoul, the other . . . either north or northeast. At that point, Copper should be connected, so I will build some belated Axemen.

I really hope that Iron is very close by, or I will be sad. Korea has Copper in their BFC . . . didn't see that coming.

[Whosit]

OK, after a bit of consideration and testing in the Sandbox, I think I will probably slot in Archery after the Wheel and before Animal Husbandry. It will delay Iron Working until T64, But I can get 2 Archers out by T54, which is better than nothing. Lacking AH will slow the growth of Regals Reach quite a bit, but I'll make due.

The only good thing is that the changes (I think Imperial Center does an Archer, Scout, Axeman before the Settler comes out) is that the 3rd Settler will definitely be a couple turns after IW, so I'll know where to go and won't have a Settler sitting around for a turn or two.

Once the cows are pastured, Regals Reach will take off and can pump out Axemen fairly quickly. If nothing else, the extra soldier points may give Korea pause if they aren't crunching the numbers too carefully.

So, yup, slight alteration to the plan, but I'd rather get IW 4 turns later than be dead 10 turns earlier.

I think this is the best choice, but thoughts?

[Swiss Pauli]

Well if you're not getting AH then why not settle by the copper and skip archery?