WW 31 Game Thread PARANOIA

[zakalwe]

Well, I don't get the case against Rowain. He's not a communist based on day 1, and he's been his usual, tight-lipped, stubborn self as far as I can see, so I don't think he's third party, either. Do you think he'd put his vote all alone on Azarius and sign off, if he's a bad guy? Surely one of the claimed vigs would make a better lynch.

[Serdoa]

And as I intend to go to sleep now and don't see novice getting lynched:

Gazglum

Also to whoever claimed before that it was somehow suspicious why I gave an item out when we still have hours to deadline. In Europe it is now 23:56. I'm normally in bed since an hour. It wasn't all that early that I gave the item out. In fact, I had not really much more time for it as I had intended to go to bed at the normal time...

[zakalwe]

I can understand pressuring him for a claim, but it's not that urgent to hear it that we actually need to lynch him today just because he refuses. IMHO.

[Imana-665-C]

Surely one of the claimed vigs would make a better lynch.

Gazglum

[Merovech]

Fishy vig claims notwithstanding, I can't walk away from this. Rowain.

And to think, I was about to move off you.

[Qgqqqqq]

Or anti-scum. Why would you call it anti-town? Serial killers are equally against both scum and town. Pursuing serial killers is a good backup option if we can't find any scum, but I think we have good reason to assume scum are still our main threat here.

A serial killer is an anti-town vote, power and player. A survivor is a different matter as they may win with the town, but a SK remains anti-town almost by definition. At their very best they can function as a vigilante, but they are not pro-town, they are anti-town and should be treated as such. I'm not sure why it matters that they are also anti-scum, that doesn't hold any relevance to how they should be approached or lynched. As to your question, I call it anti-town because I am town, and approaching it from that perspective. I don't care what the scum view is.
Serial Killers should not be sought first and foremost as that leads to meta-based play and can be a good disguise for scum, but given the choice between killing a scum and killing a SK, a SK is obviously the better choice because it destroys an entire faction worth of power (SK's are generally more powerful then the average scum) and removes an anti-town power. (I'm not sure why you bring that up as I *haven't* been hunting SK or third-party at all, unlike some players here...)

Oh come on, I was taking an amusing dig at Rowain with those posts.

If it was meant as a joke (which I did see in some parts) then it certainly wasn't meant as such primarily, as you use it to accuse Rowain of buddying up to Serdoa to get items. So yeah I certainly saw an undercurrent of jealousy in "he has items and I don't, he must be manipukating Serdoa for them."

I don't think you're a communist, I think you're third party. Which of those actions is a bad play if you're playing on your own? I also think you're grasping for straws to get out of a sticky situation.

Well for a start there is the problem of attracting too much attention either way. As SK you want to survive at all costs, and Rowain's play has been pretty much the opposite of that. And moreover, no matter whether he's third part or not, pro-town actions are pro-town. What is it that makes you think he's third party anyway?

You think a serial killer would want to lay low? Who's the town going to hang first down the line? The only viable strategy for him as a serial killer is to be as pro-town as possible. With protective roles in play, scum may even be discouraged from shooting you at night. I think he's third party because he's lying being extremely disingenious concerning his statements about you. I don't think he's scum because that would mean bussing Azza, and I'm not inclined to think that happened until we see evidence for it. I also don't think he's town because of how he's been conducting himself today. I think he thought he could get away with clamming up about his statements about you, and is struggling now that he's been called out on it. To me, that matches SK play far better than villager play.
[/quote]

What is the premise of this?
A SK acts under the assumption that they will be lynched the instant they are discovered. Therefore their best option is to remain forever in the middle of the pack - too scummy and they will be lynched, too villagery and they may be killed - and thus any attention is bad attention. This doesn't nessecarily mean lurking, but it does mean playing conservatively first and foremost. While I've never played SK myself, the one I always remember is how novice played/was planning to play back in WW17.
I'm not certain who you're talking about or talking to here. Is it Bob, Serdoa, Rowain? What statements have they made that are odd concerning me? (Or, more likely, did you forget who you were replying to? Presuming you mean Rowain as the proposed SK and Serdoa as the person this is addressed to, I disagree. I think he has played very pro-town and that he simply disagrees with the need to claim at this point. But regardless of how you view the recent events, any SK acting as Rowain has been is playing very, very poorly as they are drawing far too much attention to themselves when it really wasn't needed [Serdoa was not in much danger of the lynch, and why would Rowain do that as SK?])

[Qgqqqqq]

Well, I don't get the case against Rowain. He's not a communist based on day 1, and he's been his usual, tight-lipped, stubborn self as far as I can see, so I don't think he's third party, either. Do you think he'd put his vote all alone on Azarius and sign off, if he's a bad guy? Surely one of the claimed vigs would make a better lynch.

This too. I'd still probably prefer novice, but:

And as I intend to go to sleep now and don't see novice getting lynched:

Gazglum

Also to whoever claimed before that it was somehow suspicious why I gave an item out when we still have hours to deadline. In Europe it is now 23:56. I'm normally in bed since an hour. It wasn't all that early that I gave the item out. In fact, I had not really much more time for it as I had intended to go to bed at the normal time...

So, Gazglum

Actually, I'll sse about getting a vote count up.

[Catwalk]

You think a serial killer would want to lay low? Who's the town going to hang first down the line? The only viable strategy for him as a serial killer is to be as pro-town as possible. With protective roles in play, scum may even be discouraged from shooting you at night. I think he's third party because he's lying being extremely disingenious concerning his statements about you. I don't think he's scum because that would mean bussing Azza, and I'm not inclined to think that happened until we see evidence for it. I also don't think he's town because of how he's been conducting himself today. I think he thought he could get away with clamming up about his statements about you, and is struggling now that he's been called out on it. To me, that matches SK play far better than villager play.

You realize that you answered to a post from Q, not one from me yeah? I mean in all honesty and trying not to be mean: Don't you think you should at least get the main facts straight before you argue about them? I felt the whole day when talking with you that I was speaking against a wall - and the above post is just reinforcing that feeling.

I was fully aware I was responding to Q, and my entire response makes sense as such. Substitute "you" for Serdoa, I was used to discussing the matter with you. I think you're stretching a tiny mistake if you're going to use that to dismiss my argument. I'm not getting any facts wrong here.

[Gazglum]

Happy officer is having happy times at beach. Jowy, you need to practice your happiness a bit.

I think rowain a bad lynche for today, though he been prety weird today. I like plan to have Ryan scan him. Don't much like novice ending onrowain.

Bob is slinking towards lynch, trying to survive. He needs a lethal dose of happy pills.

[Azarius]

Leaving very soon to out of town for the weekend, I just got home and only had time to quickly skim the thread to catch up. Internet where I'm at will be questionable and I'll be traveling at the deadline in a couple hours. I will try to follow until then if I can, but it's likely I'll miss it so this will be my chance to pop in before then. Will make a quick post on the main discussions, and will be around for a short while before I leave if anyone has anything to ask or point out if I missed it.

I still do not buy, or at least understand, where Rowain was coming from with his don't lynch Serdoa statement. I do think what has been said of this today makes it very unlikely they are scum together, as it would be very strange to have the type of conversation they are in thread. I agree that Rowain, if not town, is a solo role or a second scum faction as I don't see him bussing Azza so casually day 1. Even though it seems off to me, the very fact he did it makes me feel that he is more likely town then not because he had to know such a statement would draw a good deal of attention, and I don't see him making that kind of mistake as scum. So ya, I don't get it, and I wish he would at least explain, but I'm not willing to vote for him over it. Serdoa has read to me more like his usual self today, and his defending Rowain and believing him to be town seems genuine.

I do not think that novice's suspicion of Rowain for his "lie" is a good enough reason to vote for him. As I said, it was a very odd thing to do, and while I do think that Rowain would not make such a mistake as scum, I can see why someone could disagree.

For me it basically boils down to Bob vs Gazglum, and while I think that Bob's limited shot vig claim was off, it is possible as part of a broader role, although I wish he had at least hinted at this earlier as it would make it easier to believe. Ultimately I will choose to stay on Gazglum, as I find his story less credible, and his claimed power is more suspicious.