WW35: Not Another TPS Report [Game Thread]

[Gazglum]

Is anyone else feeling the absence of Lewwyn, who has reserved a seat on the Q-Train and apparently dozed off there after getting some heat?

Lewwyn, are you round?

[Qgqqqqq]

I just noticed something odd. How is Jabbz on 6 votes - tied with me - based on his earlier behaviour with regards to me, and no one has ever quoted his response to that? Or interacted with it in any obvious way?

[zakalwe]

Not sure exactly what you mean, Q, but I think his scum buddies would want to see how the town reacted to his defense before committing one way or the other. The case against him has been furiously ignored by several players.

[Qgqqqqq]

Not sure exactly what you mean, Q, but I think his scum buddies would want to see how the town reacted to his defense before committing one way or the other. The case against him has been furiously ignored by several players.

His post on my page 13 (20ppp), right before I signed off this morning.

I do agree entirely, however.

[Ichabod]

That being said, the day seems pretty quiet. Not a lot of cases, some people pretty unusually silent... Holy! Zak has the most posts in the game? I thought he was one of the silent ones...

A day where you've participated but people haven't noticed your presence is a good scum day

I didn't mean it in that sense, it was not a hidden suspicion thrown at him. I think Zak contributed quite a bit on different cases. But it seemed to me that he was around way less than usual, but he still had a lot of posts.

[Meiz]

Well, I don't want to defend Jabbz too much since I don't have a good read on him. But I think his reply for not immediately attacking your post was ok. Taking a second look at players posts and finding them more suspicious afterwards is natural in my books. I also believed his claim that he wouldn't want to play scum third time in a row, but that's of course banking on him not getting two scum roles to choose from. All in all he wouldn't be my #1 pick to lynch today.

[Ichabod]

I don't get what you're talking about by "messy" (yes, I get this was TT, but that's the problem with reading backwards). IMO, the first 12 hours or so of the game were far too cut and dried. We had definitive stages - novice up, novice down, Q up - when has that ever happened in mafia? I don't know if that was influence by scum or simply the result of the meta start to this game, but as someone who also reads in big chunks, it felt really weird.

As far as I'm concerned, what has happened since has felt far more natural - more people being argued even if not gaining massive pushes, slow coalescence around the parties most found scummy which eventually leads to the big leads.

I don't get what swung you back here, Ichabod. I get the Fenn thing not taking off, but I don't see anything in TT's post that's good. We have the "messy" thing that I talked about above, and then there's just meta that no-one would ever reject roleblocker (wait, what?), gut, and that scum-me would, for some reason, never consider that I might get heat for losing a role in advance, but instead be left scrambling.

What you bolded wasn't even something that is relevant - it's a general thought, and one I agree with (as my "stages" of posting should make clear). I get voting for me, but I don't get how TT's post made you return - is it just coincidence that the two occurred alongside, and more about leaving Fenn, or have I missed something?

What I agreed about TT's post regarding you is that I was getting cold feet after keeping my vote on you for quite a long time.

The rest of the post I just found interesting, because I never really thought with that point of view. Hence my questions.

[Gazglum]

Not sure exactly what you mean, Q, but I think his scum buddies would want to see how the town reacted to his defense before committing one way or the other. The case against him has been furiously ignored by several players.

Ok, I feel that is a fair poke. Early on I discounted Jabbz because I thought (and think) that he would have picked town over scum, and the likelihood of him having been offered scum/scum wasn't high enough to make him a good suspect for Day 1. But as a few of the more statistics minded people have pointed out, that's not how probability really works, and he's just as likely to have been offered scum as his second choice as anybody else was.

So rereading his posts, yes I think Jabbz comes off scummy, and I take back what I said about putting Fenn ahead of him on vibes (though will get back to you on that Fenn). After a promise to give us his thoughts, his main summation post is really bad.

That being said, I'm going to reread all the posts I skimmed this morning, and see where else I need to place arguments. By all means, let me know if this is insufficient.

So. Forty plus minutes of trying to parse through this mess has left me with the opinion that I don't read nearly as much into everyone's statement as some of you guys do. I guess I'm just looking for direct contradiction, or poorly constructed logical arguments, and day one doesn't seem to present too many of those.

I am still not overly convinced of TT's argument as to why he dropped the Hider role. The fact that it's his first day back could be used to justify any number of choices/discards, and as such doesn't seem to have a lot of merit. It certainly isn't enough for me to want to vote for him at this point, but it does strike me as suspicious.

-TT suspicious but I'm not going to vote him

I get pretty good vibes from Zak's analysis as a whole. He is active, he is posing a lot of questions, and as someone said earlier, he seems genuinely interested in finding the scum.

- Zak is good

Az seems to be getting a bit of a pass here, once the "misunderstanding" about what his role actually entailed. I'm not saying I lean either way on him yet, it is just worth noting that it is occurring.

- Az is suspicious but maybe he isn’t

The reads on a couple of other people partially depend on where I end up falling on the "claiming is good for town" spectrum. I am leaning a bit towards it being useful for those who discarded top roles to claim, as they are likely already targets by scum for doing so, unless they are themselves scum. I'm still stuck a bit though, because as scum knows more power roles, they can plan/plot more effectively. So it's a bit of a tossup.

- Claiming is good but maybe it isn’t

As for myself, I've reached the understanding that no matter what I do, I appear scummy. My first game, I was told I was "scummy as fuck", which is appropriate as I was actually scum that game. My second game I was also told I was scummy as fuck, which was disappointing, because I was trying to play the first day or two as pure town, and not start working towards town destruction until I had more info. I was trying to balance that with looking really defensive, in hopes of being scanned clean, so that might have screwed it up. This game, I'm 100% town, and trying to find scum, and still looking scummy :/ I guess that's something I'll have to work on.

- I am town

That being said, I still think Qg looks scummy, and my vote is going to stay there for the time being. It seems that he has agreed to claim if time gets close and he is up for the devilishly designed torture machine that a group of talented engineers can produce with paperclips, rubber bands, and the spare mop in the closet, so that might be where we find out more.

-Voting Q, because he still looks scummy

So yes, Jabbz I would say that was insufficient. If you do find out more from the paperclip torture on Q, and decided he was not a good lynch today afterall, is there somebody else you would vote as second choice?

I don't like moving off targets who I also think are suspicious, just because they have gone AWOL, so I don't want to give Lewwyn a pass yet.

[Ichabod]

Jabbz

More people I suspect on Qg than on Jabbz. On that sense, I'm willing to accept that I may be reading too much into Fenn's posts.

I still want to hear a claim from Qg soon, though. Otherwise we'll spend the game talking about only that. I think Q is the one who knows about when to do it, but I wouldn't go much past day 2, if he isn't lynched here. We can than judge him by if he claimed a role that make sense to do so much drama about revealing.

If I cut to the chase, case on Qg is basically meta. "Hard to avoid voting because" meta, but meta nonetheless. At least Jabbz case is based on reads and Zak in particular seems dedicated to find scum (and Q too, if I think about it). My own cases haven't got any strenght in them, so might as well give some of my strenght elsewhere.

Q's votes are pretty lazy, overall. People parked there and forgot about the game. To note, there isn't almost any post with a Q voter saying: "yeah, I'm voting Q and I'm proud of it, won't change my mind". It's mostly just the first vote and forget about it... Perhaps more lazy villager behaviour than wolf? I don't know.

[Ichabod]

I could vote for Lewwyn, but he kind of didn't play day 1.

Can we get a tally?