(February 2nd, 2015, 14:39)zakalwe Wrote: I'm not convinced you are scum, Jabbz. I'm giving you a hard time to get a better read on you. And it's useful to interrogate you when you actually are around so I know that you didn't have a long time to carefully craft your response. I'm sorry if you find that annoying or uncomfortable, but I'm afraid it's part of the game.
One of the best reasons for suspecting you is outside your control, namely the way Lewwyn ignored you. But he could have been setting you up. That, in combination with your long absences at what feels like strategic moments, means that it's hard to just let you go.
It's cool zak. It's a bit annoying, but that's about it. It was only uncomfortable when half the damn town was doing it with you
(February 2nd, 2015, 14:17)Ichabod Wrote: I think we have an SK and SK killed Lewwyn. I think a vig would have claimed the kill (it wasn't dtay, he'd most definetely have claimed it), when I asked. I think that the silence that followed my prompt for the vig to reveal himself was more than enough confirmation that we have a SK.
Not sure a vig would have claimed, we know there's maximum one so he's important to town.
(February 2nd, 2015, 14:00)zakalwe Wrote: Seems like most of the votes for dtay were justified with "better him than Bob". So if you had gone with TT instead of dtay, it could possibly have made TT hang instead. You started the day making a huge case against TT and you have not updated yourself on anything that happened after that. So I thought it was strange that you felt so little attachment to that case now. Yes, if you had stayed on TT with a single dead vote, I might have called you scummy for it. But after Molach's vote, TT looked like an equally viable option for saving Bob. They were tied for votes.
This, big time. Before you made that post, I was about to vote Twinkletoes to try and save Bob. Your vote there killed that wagon, really.
So because I followed you, EXPLICITLY followed you, SAYING I was following you, you didn't vote for the guy I was on before I followed you? There is no way in hell I could have known that, and TBH had you said something, given that I admitted I was following the people I trusted, I would possibly have changed back, especially if other people I trusted followed.
What?
This reads like you once again overstating it. I skimmed your post, tbh, but you definitely didn't say that. Here is what you posted:
(February 2nd, 2015, 11:45)Jabbz Wrote:
(February 2nd, 2015, 11:40)Rowain Wrote: All 3 have also people I trust and people I don't trust voting for them too.
I think this is what it's going to come down to for me. The people I trust so far this game are Rowaine, Qg, Ichabod, and AdrienIer. Right now I have Qg and Ich on dtay, and AdrienIer on Bob. I'm more inclined to vote for Dtay than bob already, as I feel the case against bob is off, based on the limited time I have had to read (I just know this is going to come back and bite me in the ass when people read it as scum, but whatever). If Rowain votes dtay I'll have a clean conscience, if not well. I'll live with it either way I think.
A) this was shortly before the lynch, when I was scrambling to catch up and a bundle of nerves + having just woken up at 5 in the bloody morning, B) you said you were following a bunch of people you trusted, naming a bunch of people and saying me and Ichabod being on Dtay.
How was I supposed to know you were going to jump back?
Besides, there's a very different thing following the way, say, Gazglum did Rowain yesterday and jumping on a wagon because you trust the people on it.
Erebus in the Balance - a FFH Modmod based around balancing and polishing FFH for streamlined competitive play.
(February 2nd, 2015, 14:50)AdrienIer Wrote: Not sure a vig would have claimed, we know there's maximum one so he's important to town.
I agree with Ichabod, a vig ought to have claimed. I'm not sure what you're obsession with numbers is, but it's not *that* important a role, and often hits town anyway. Besides which, there were 3 vigs before Dtay died.
Erebus in the Balance - a FFH Modmod based around balancing and polishing FFH for streamlined competitive play.
I don't think a vig necessarily would have claimed. A 1-shot vig sure, but not a full vig. I don't get why Ichabod is so convinced one would claim just because he asked them to either.
A bit frustrated that Dtay didn't claim. That was a very very safe claim he had, we would expect inconclusive "vanilla town" from him. So at least we would have gotten to see another's alignment today
So not sure claiming first thing tomorrow is best time, Jabbz.
Still for everyone, sometime before one is strung up is better than preserving the PR just ..one more...turn.
TT: "I know you [Gazglum] want to push me to reveal, I can save you time by saying that I will not. I do not see the need right now and I don't understand why you push me for my role yet give other suspects a free pass?"
It was obvious why you had to claim first of the suspects. (Dtay and Bob, who both threw away negative-town roles)
I can see you want to protect the PR, but you didn't post any more the day. Were you online and ready to save yourself? My late vote might have picked up another, perhaps. And then bob switches onto you, and we both mislynch and lose a PR.
(February 2nd, 2015, 14:17)Ichabod Wrote: I think we have an SK and SK killed Lewwyn. I think a vig would have claimed the kill (it wasn't dtay, he'd most definetely have claimed it), when I asked. I think that the silence that followed my prompt for the vig to reveal himself was more than enough confirmation that we have a SK.
Not sure a vig would have claimed, we know there's maximum one so he's important to town.
There were *harumph* some people that claimed that the vig save the claim because just knowing if a SK is in the game is less important that using the claim more proactively later on.
This reads like you once again overstating it. I skimmed your post, tbh, but you definitely didn't say that. Here is what you posted:
A) this was shortly before the lynch, when I was scrambling to catch up and a bundle of nerves + having just woken up at 5 in the bloody morning, B) you said you were following a bunch of people you trusted, naming a bunch of people and saying me and Ichabod being on Dtay.
How was I supposed to know you were going to jump back?
Besides, there's a very different thing following the way, say, Gazglum did Rowain yesterday and jumping on a wagon because you trust the people on it.
I'm not sure where you are going with this. I'm not claiming you did something wrong. I'm saying theres no fuckin way in hell I could know that my changing votes would derail the train. AFAIK I have/had zero town cred from you, or most people for that matter, so why would people jump on my vote? I made the call I thought was best, by following people I trusted, and supported by the quick read through I did of the claims. I also hopped off TT, as I said, because I didn't have time to evaluate his counter-claim, and at the time, it didn't look like his bus was going anywhere anyway.
(February 2nd, 2015, 13:18)Rowain Wrote: In case Bob turns out to be scum me thinks Azarius is a perfect follow-up lynch. Works vice-versa too (if Azarius is scum than Bob is a good follow-up lynch too).
Glad we're on the same page. This was the plan, and the events just before today's lynch have increased my confidence in that plan.
1. Claimed vig is confirmed non-mafia. He's either villager or SK. Either a confirmed villager or a cornered SK, both good village outcomes.
2. More information is better and I find that a confirmed villager is more useful to the village than a Vig. Vig is not a good role, except on very late game situation, where we can kill a player without losing another day of lynch, so it helps trimming the options. Confirmed villager is a massive thing for villagers, it's one less person that you need to read with suspicious eyes between all the madness.
3. I don't trust our Vig to make good shots. Shooting Lew was bad play, in my opinion. Yes, he got a Mafia, but he risked a good town player with not a lot of evidence behind his guess.
4. Every day we lynch someone without the useful information we could get by a reveal we lost something. Yes, I understand why cops and watchers and such should not claim, I'm not saying that everyone should claim, but it's beyond me why a villager Vig wouldn't claim, after we are sure he's a villager.
5. Villager Vig claim would narrow down the other power roles scry/watch/track list. And if he gets killed by Mafia in place of the cop, that's good news for village, since cop is way more important.
Anyway, like I've said, I'm sure we have a SK. There's no rationale that I can see behind not claiming the Lewwyn shot for a villager Vig. It's very, very obvious play for me and I'll operate under the assumption of a SK from now on. Later, if we have a villager vig and he claims, we can have a talk about his reasons and perhaps I'll be enlightened/we'll understand each other. But right now, I say we have an SK and I think that's a pretty fair assumption to make.
