[Spoiler] RB Pitboss #2 - Shaka of Rome

[Whosit]

Well, everyone is surely following what's going on in the e-mail thread. Craziness. Obviously, I think I want Jowy to get the second half of the turn, but I'm doing my best not to let that color anything I say. I'm a little murky on some of the details, like when exactly Jowy declared war, but hopefully this will get resolved without too many tempers flaring or feelings hurt. Anyway, got a response back from Jowy that seemed positive:

Hey Whosit,

Things are indeed going well here I've been waiting for this war for half the game. I'm not sure will I be capturing any cities.. It'd be unfair to you CoW members further away! I might capture some though if I end up suffering alot in this war. Btw what are your thoughts regarding CoW alliance: I'm personally not sure what will happen after this India war. We'll still have our three-way alliance though Have you got any major plans (that you are comfortable sharing) for the future?
Korea. Well, we're in friendly relations but they haven't really talked about your conflict after the war was over. They did send some updates on what was happening when you declared and during the war. Not sure if you know, but they've retreated on the islands between myself, Ottomans, HRE and you. Not a very good spot considering our three-way alliance Are you personally still bitter with Koreans or is it just the other way around?
Resources. If you get any extra happiness resources, please trade them with me! I'm really low on those. I checked everyone's resources a couple of turns ago but didn't find anything interesting. I'm OK for trading other resources too, just propose a trade in-game and I'll accept as long as it isn't anything ridicilous.

PS. Loved that trap reference in a CoW letter earlier! ^^ Good stuff. I envy your lurkers.
~ Jowy

He was referencing this:

It certainly sounds like things are heating up between the Killer Angels and Romali. Hopefully the fireworks won't go off early. I concur with Dantski's point that it doesn't matter much which city is targeted first. K.A. cities are close enough that they can be rapidly reinforced. The one benefit, especially since we're attacking in waves, is that they may throw the bulk of their defenses at Nakor/DMOC and Dantski, allowing the rest of us to do greater damage. Unless we're walking into a trap, in which case our only hope is to destroy the shield generators.

Considering that the volume of my mail is increasing, I haven't been posting as much, though perhaps I ought to start doing that more frequently. Lurkers, let me know what you want to see!

Anyway, I won't really have extra happiness resources until I snag that gold on Centralia, or until I learn Calendar, but I'll definitely make sure to offer him something as soon as possible, since it sounds like a good way to earn his favor. I'm also glad to have more info on Korea, though I knew most of it already. At least it sounds like he's more on my side than theirs! I'll respond to Jowy soonish.

Here's a snippet of the Coalition discussions:

> HRE and myself both declare on T105, hopefully Indian forces will be mostly
> north. Essentially this means the north is the diversion rather than the
> south,
>
> What do you guys think?

I am not opposed to this plan. I don't think we'll be able to take
Chancellor anymore, but we'll still field a big stack so I am thinking
to just beeline for the horses together with Jowy. Romali/HRE can then
maybe go to Antietam and head for the copper.

On a different note, we have to make sure that Korea/Inca do not gift
India resources. If bad comes to worse wars and/or blockades may be
necessary.

Let us know what your thoughts are.

Kalin

I responded, basically suggesting that Greece, Romali, and HRE build a Galley each with which to blockade India. I offered to build one myself, but noted that I'm further away.

[Whosit]

Oh, got a reply from dsplaisted. Or, Daniel, I guess. Let's see . . .

Thanks, I hope things are going well with you too.

I would like to cooperate on a plan which involves you not attacking me with all the shiny Praetorians you probably have by now. What do you think?

Daniel

Hmm. Well, I suppose that's a reasonable request, considering all my shiny Praetorians will be going elsewhere. Perhaps I should discuss setting rough settlement boundaries in the Zulu wastes? Hopefully he doesn't know that my Praets aren't going after him just yet.

And some CoW stuff that's relevant:

Hi guys,

Just like to tell you that India is fully aware of the situation.
They expect the Ottamans and Dantski to declare as well and asked for our assistance.
They made a very tempting offer, which we of course have to decline in some way.
But this is a though one... If Whosit weren't part of the plan... they do offer a lot, you know...

Well, the die was cast long ago and we'll keep true to our word and attack at t105.

Dantski, there's probably no point in waiting with declaring.

Good luck!
Nakor of HRE

Incidentally I talked a bit with India ingame just before the turn rolled and they were very interested in taking Greece's iron (rather than settling the one on their southern border). They also sent me another email about future cooperation which clearly shows they are spinning for all they're worth right now.

Also I'm pretty sure India is offering you (HRE) at least 3 of my cities. All I have to counter that is that the game would be lost almost certainly if we didn't cut India down ASAP, I would also point to the positive way we resolved our land issues.

-Dantski

And Athlete/Kalin are basically pointing out that dealing with India isn't a wise long-term proposal (and that turning on your allies doesn't make for a great reputation). Hmm, I'm going to guess that the reason I'm a significant factor in Nakor's decision is because my Praets could easily turn against the "traitor" if he allied with India? I'd better hash out a response just to keep in the loop.

[Whosit]

Response to Daniel:

Dear Daniel.

I am sure that we could work something out along those lines.

By the way, how far south are you planning to expand? We both wish to expand into the Zulu Wastes. Perhaps we should at least come to some rough understanding in order to prevent conflict.

Best regards,

Whosit, Galactic Emperor

In case anyone is interested, I refrained some suggesting a line myself (even though I have one in mind) just because I want to see what he suggests. Sometimes I think it's better to let the other person make on offer, in case they're willing to give more than I thought they would.

And interesting bit from Nakor (bold added by me):

Hi Everyone,

We ARE keeping true to our promise.
We have a great cooperation going on here and we want to be a part of this.
So please understand that we'll stay true to our word and will attack at t105/106. Our army is on the move.

I only send my message to keep you informed and to tell you how far India is willing to go and how good India can be diplomaticaly.
Honesty is the best policy when you want to keep friends and we want to be your friends, not India's.

We do hope that the turn order will be resolved soon so the games can contiunue.

Whosit: strange indeed! They do urge is not to trust you...

Good luck!
Nakor of HRE

Perhaps I should ask him about that personally? Not that I suspect foul play, but I wouldn't want to let seeds of doubt sprout at a later time.

[MWIN]

Can sullla sniff something from this post? What is the relation between Whosit and this killing?

... settle our differences by killing each others' soldiers and bringing ruin upon our enemies. You know, like adults.

[Whosit]

Ohz noez!! "Spullla's" thread is so active! Whatevs will I doooooooo???!?!?



Anyway, e-mail exchange-ish between me and Nakor.

Dear Whosit,

India thinks that you are the big threat in this game.
You have taken out your two closest neighbours and in due time will attack us, according to them.
Of course they want us to fear you instead of them.
They didn't mention Korea or the Inca's in their messages, so I wouldn't fear to much from them.

We hope the game will continue soon!

Kind regards,
Nakor of HRE

And my reply, which should make most of my thoughts clear:

Dear Nakor and DMOC,

Well, I suppose that India has a valid point . . . except that the Inca destroyed the Zulu, and Korea is still alive (and thus a potential threat). I couldn't blame you if you wanted to be cautious, in any case, since I've mentioned before that a certain dose of paranoia is probably helpful to survival. I honestly can't see myself attacking Holy Rome ever (unless attacked first), but you'd have to take my word for it, I suppose. All I have to offer for proof is that I have plenty of space to expand in that is a direction that is not you.

Like you, I hope that the issues will get resolved soon and that we can move on. Perhaps we should encourage those who have not yet voted to do so (Jowy and Dantski at this point in time).

Until the fighting actually starts, we can only guess, but I wonder who the big winners and losers of this war are going to be. It's looking less and less likely that we can actually take out any Indian cities, except maybe the smallest of them. Sullla will almost surely fight a defensive war, but Jowy and Dantski offer logical targets if they decide to become more offensive. You, Athlete/Kalin, and myself should not face the risk of direct invasion from India. Daniel and Broker/plako aren't involved, yet.

My hunch is that those who are not directly adjacent to India will benefit the most, as there is still an opportunity to continue expansion and economic build-up, while Jowy and Dantski will probably have to build more units out of necessity. I imagine that Daniel is just going to do his own thing and expand. Korea will probably continue to expand to the islands, but I plan to keep my eye on them, anyway. In the event that we descend on India like a swarm of locusts and pillage the place clean, I wonder how far back that will really put them. The chances that we can capture any of their Workers is slim to none, and the biggest losses will be their time invested in growing Cottages, and the time required to rebuild their improvements, which may very well be significant, but may not be significant enough to "eliminate" them.

Otherwise, news of interest to you may be that I have confirmed the presence of Silver on Centralia. However, I am currently scouting "my" side of the island, but I imagine that where there is one deposit, there is more. Most of the other resources are Calendar resources, as I think I have mentioned before, and quite a bit of jungle to be chopped away, as well. Barbarians are present, but nothing an Axeman can't deal with, so far. No sign of Ivory, unfortunately, but I'm not expecting to find any in this world.

Let's stay in touch.

Best regards,

Whosit, Galactic Emperor

I wonder if I said too much, though I did cut out talk of my tech plans. Meditation will be finished next turn, with a big chunk of overflow into Aesthetics. However, since my costs are still so high (and will get higher when I have 12 units outside my territory next turn), I may have to run 10% or even 0% on the slider. Or I'll just burn through my remaining cash as best I can. Anyway, Aesthetics is up next, I want to get it as quickly as possible, because I can knock out the Parthenon pretty quickly, I think. That also puts me within spitting range of Literature and the Great Library (as well as the X Epics), which could be helpful, as well. My understanding of the value of the G. Library isn't so much the +6 beakers from the free Scientists, but the +8 GPP from the Scientists and Wonder itself. Not sure where I'd build it, but probably in Carida because it has the hammers and it should house my other Wonders.

Once the game starts up again, I can get a better estimate of how long I'll need to get Aesthetics. I have 2 Scientists running in Imperial Center, but I'm at a +1 food surplus, which isn't good, and I don't have an ideal way to handle that yet (well, I'd work a grassland mine instead of a lake, but that's a loss of commerce). I need a Work Boat out of Byss first, but I have to wait for the Library there to finish.

Carida will finish its Library in 3 more turns, and I should be able to run 2 Scientists there at minimal hammers. Libraries in my other cities will take a bit longer. But, 6 bpt there and in Imperial Center, each of which is really 7.5 bpt, or 15 bpt at 0% science (Library modifiers). Not very good, obviously, but it will keep research moving, at least. This should improve as more Libraries get up and I can run more Scientists.

In Nar Shaddaa, my plan is basically this: Get the Library done in, um, 9 turns? Maybe less, since I'll have a new mine to work soon. Can't remember the eta offhand. Anyway, then start Monastery. I should be doing 9 hpt, though I'll have to figure out how much overflow to expect from the Library. Anyway, invest <30 hammers into it and 3-pop whip it, hopefully as close to max overflow as possible. Then start a Missionary while regrowing into max hammers. Missionary goes to Carida, most likely, since I can then reconfigure for max hammers there to build a Monastery and more Missionaries.

Nar Shaddaa, with religion, Monument, Library, and Monastery (+6 cpt) should be able to pop 3rd ring long before Seoul gets 4th ring, so it should be able to claim its second ring from the Korea capital, which would be good. Same for Ryloth. Glad to know about the culture pop mechanics, now! I'll never steal tiles from Seoul's BFC, but so long as I can get control of more tiles around it, I'll be happier.

Once I get Confucianism to spread to more cities (is there any chance of an auto spread in the meantime?), I'll convert for the extra happiness. Hopefully I'll also have settled and grabbed the Silver for some more happiness. The extra Gold in Centralia is also a target so I can trade/gift it to Jowy. As I've mentioned before, I want to keep him on my good side because I believe that I will eventually have to face the Ottomans, and it would be nice to give them someone else to worry about, as well.

(By the way, in my letter to Nakor, I really meant that I never intend to attack them. That would completely squander a valuable friendship, and I'm not such a good player that I could take on the whole world!)

Um, what else . . . . anything else interesting? Oh. So, my Settlement team will include: 1 Settler, 2 Workers, 2 Praetorians. Nar Shaddaa can supply the Workers. After it's built the Missionary, I might as well do a couple Worker builds while the anger wears away (it's also suffering from Motherland sickness, but hopefully that will vanish as I get more culture there). I want a couple more Praets for garrison in Nar Shaddaa and Ryloth, plus the two for the "away team," for protection vs. Barbs. So at least 4 Praet builds in the near future. Should easily be doable. Settler build? I'll find a place. I could also have Kuat build a Work Boat for the new city. Hmm, what would I call it? Maybe I'll go with Dathomir, as someone suggested. Wayland could also be an interesting choice.

So, yup, that's about it. Can't really do much more until the turn timer starts moving again, and even then, it'll be slow as everyone does their war stuff and the turn timer will probably run long. Oh well.

On a side note, I'll be curious to learn if India really doesn't like me, really believes that I'm a threat, or was just trying to spin things in order to convert Nakor. I still trust Nakor. Hopefully he's not offended by my bringing it up, but I just can't ignore it when someone is trying to turn my neighbor against me.

[Whosit]

Can sullla sniff something from this post? What is the relation between Whosit and this killing?

Yeah, I thought about that. When I said "our" I was using that in the most general of terms, as in "we the players." I suppose my one mistake is thinking that Sullla would ask for clarification, which he probably won't. I suppose I could go back and make that clarification.

I was also using "our" to indicate that I was participating in these "debates," as well, and it didn't seem appropriate to then remove myself and say "your" differences. Maybe I underanalyzed that. Hmm.

[novice]

wouldn't the monastery be a 2 pop whip?

[Whosit]

wouldn't the monastery be a 2 pop whip?

Oh! You're right. I thought Monasteries were 90 hammers for some reason. OK, so then I'll invest hammers for a TWO-pop whip, etc. etc.

[T-hawk]

Oh! You're right. I thought Monasteries were 90 hammers for some reason. OK, so then I'll invest hammers for a TWO-pop whip, etc. etc.

They're 90 on Epic speed. Been playing Epic 26?

[Whosit]

They're 90 on Epic speed. Been playing Epic 26?

Yes. And other epic-speed games. You can all hear about my atrocious Epic 26 game if I ever finish it on time for the reports.