WW37- For Whom the Bell Trolls

[novice]

Well I don't think it's you Gaz which is why I didn't consider voting you yesterday.

I never said we'd learn anything from a Gore lynch. What we did do was avoid a day 1 mislynch.

Are you saying Lewwyn's vote was better off left on Matt?

Agnes's posts gained credibility in light of her misreading the setup. And admitting the error of your ways is usually a town tells.

(Phone post)

[novice]

A few more comments, from a keyboard:

It's not that Novice voted Goreripper, it's that he didn't even TRY to find an alternative.

Gore becomes lynch by ‘default’, even though Jabbz, Mattimeo and me are all highly in the running at different moments.

I did look at Fenn. I had no scum lean on Jabbz, Mattimeo or you. Lynching any of them over Goreripper would have been a terrible decision, IMO. Someone would have had to incriminate themselves to the point where they seemed more likely scum than not for me to consider not lynching Goreripper, which frankly didn't seem likely.

Oh, and finally, this made me laugh:

I was actually trying to make a point. I don't like it when people give a reason for a vote but don't dare to call it scummy, opting instead to describe it as weird, bizarre, etc.

Words Novice used to describe Agnes’ posts, after voting for her: disingenuous, pointless, unconvincing, insincere, questionable, odd and feigned.

Word Novice did not use: scummy

Don't oversell your case. Disingenious, pointless, insincere, feigned and questionable all imply scumminess. Bizarre does not.

Oh, by the way, where did Zakalwe and Rowain try to find alternatives to lynching Goreripper?

[Gazglum]

Oh, by the way, where did Zakalwe and Rowain try to find alternatives to lynching Goreripper?

I'm not sure if they did, and I'll look at them too. But you stand out to me as the one who honed in on Gore the most.

DO you think that it gives them a town lean to lynch Goreripper? Does anybody get a scum lean out of Day 1 for you?

[novice]

DO you think that it gives them a town lean to lynch Goreripper? Does anybody get a scum lean out of Day 1 for you?

I don't have many strong leans. I have a town lean on Rowain, I thought he played it honestly and protown. Zakalwe was a bit passive so he's neutral atm. Fenn is a scum lean due to three poorly founded votes, as I mentioned earlier.

I haven't reread the game thread though. Hopefully that and night 1 results will clarify things.

[pindicator]

Novice, what's your take on Gaz?

[novice]

He reads like normal Gaz to me. I believe him on this:

I thought Commodore was what he said, a survivor who wanted to be loved. I mean, you have as much history with Commodore as any of us, Pind. He follows his emotions, he develops grudges. I think if town had flattered and cajoled him, we could have got him on side. And more importantly, we would have got information out of him about people's alignments. It might have been lies, but it easily might not have been. I think Commodore would scan the people who annoyed him the most, and then if he found them scum, he would out them in revenge for their attacks on him. Or maybe not, we won’t know now. Point is that he was potentially valuable. And I like having him around.

I think his opinion is honest but naive. And perhaps knowingly so, fueled by his romantic side.

[Mattimeo]

On the game in general/meta: I think talking early is not a FOSD as you increase information/misunderstandings (see: your questions of me) which is suboptimal for the end game. With this in mind: those who talk more early game (from a strategy perspective, not from a social perspective) are likely to believe they have other advantages in the end game to offset the information advantage they are giving away. The advantage they gain, I suppose, is to avoid early lynchings and try and get the village to form up around them.

The prisoner's dilemma is actually somewhat relevant here.

Not saying anything logically increases your lifespan. Thus, you should not say anything, just like the prisoners should both turn.
On the other hand, not saying anything means you might as well not play werewolf in the first place, and is just as much of a cunts move as taking the 'optomal' strategy in the prisoners dilemma.

[Mattimeo]

Well, can tell that auto-correct is Australian - all it did was add an 's' rather than pretend a profanity wasn't actually a word...

[Shadeun]

On the game in general/meta: I think talking early is not a FOSD as you increase information/misunderstandings (see: your questions of me) which is suboptimal for the end game. With this in mind: those who talk more early game (from a strategy perspective, not from a social perspective) are likely to believe they have other advantages in the end game to offset the information advantage they are giving away. The advantage they gain, I suppose, is to avoid early lynchings and try and get the village to form up around them.

The prisoner's dilemma is actually somewhat relevant here.

Not saying anything logically increases your lifespan. Thus, you should not say anything, just like the prisoners should both turn.
On the other hand, not saying anything means you might as well not play werewolf in the first place, and is just as much of a cunts move as taking the 'optomal' strategy in the prisoners dilemma.

We were just talking about the early game. Clearly I am saying things now, and clearly my previous posts have indicated that I'm open to being wrong about this.

Obviously, no point in playing the game if you don't talk at all. Just think scum/others will ultimately (perhaps d2) start pointing to my stuff to get me lynched. There seems to be a sizable & silent minority in this game.

Don't you think?

FWIW: Prisoners Dillemma ultimately teaches about the importance of mixed strategy equilbria (being random to some extent is optimal). The idea of FOSD is that you pick a strategy that is better than another one for all outcomes (all randomness). Which is to which I refer. However, this isn't really fun talking about economics stuff. Certainly, I get enough game theory stuff at work

[Jabbz]

Nights tend to be quiet Shadeun. We are waiting to see who dies, as that generally helps shape the discussion of the following day. It's nice to see you more involved though.