Veterans Pitboss Setup Thread

[Ceiliazul]

I want this game to happen, dang it I'll see about rolling a map. Will be at least the weekend for a finished product, and I'll need checkers... But I'll fire up the old RNG and see what develops

[ReallyEvilMuffin]

Great, we have a full set!

Q1: Unit Trades/Gifts
a.) allowed - 1(Mack)
b.) banned - 7(others)

Q2: Map Trading
a.) Allowed at Proper Tech - 4 (Commodore,TBS, Mack, REM)
b.) Banned/Off - 4 (OT4E, 2metra, Old Harry, pindicator)

Q3: Espionage
a.) fully on if RtR Mod 2.0.7.1, Active Missions banned if BTS - 2 (OT4E, 2metra, REM)
b.) Active Missions Banned always - 5(Commodore, Old Harry, pindicator,TBS, Mack)

Meta Game Settings:
Q4: Mod
a.) BTS w/ Standard Bans - 2 (2metra, REM)
b.) RtR 2.0.7.1 (PB22, pretty much exactly like PB18 but with a smaller KTB) - 2 (TBS, OT4E)
c.) RtR 2.0.7.4, (only significant changes from 2.0.7.1 are super Mercantalism, buffed Pro, and active spy missions disabled, but see the espionage setting below) - 5(Commodore, Old Harry, pindicator, OT4E, Mack)

Q5: Diplo Rules
a.) Strict AI Diplo (no "signaling" involving gold, resources, or cities) - 3 (Commodore, Old Harry, OT4E)
b.) AI Diplo ("signaling" allowed; still cannot communicate by renaming units or cities, spelling things out with city names in trades, etc) - 5 (2metra, pindicator, TBS, Mack, REM)

Picks:
See Starts Before Picks: Yes - 5 (Others) / NO - 2 (Commodore, REM)
Q6: Civ/Leader Pick Method

b.) Standard Snake Pick - 3 (pindicator, TBS, Mack)
c.) Random Draft Snake (Lurkers roll 30 random leaders and civs, each, cut 5 of each best/worst, then we Snake Pick from those choices) - 3 (2metra, TBS, OT4E)
d.) Single Draft - 5 (we each get 3 random combos to choose from) (2metra, Old Harry, pindicator, OT4E, REM)
e.) 3-try-random - 5 (like PB 18 and PB 27) (2metra, Commodore, Old Harry, pindicator, OT4E)

Q7: Map Balance Level
a.) Highly balanced - 2 (TBS, Mack)
b.) Fairly balanced or better - 2 (Old Harry, REM)
c.) Fairly balanced at most - 1 (Old Harry)
d.) Random script + eyeball check at most - 4 (2metra, OT4E, Commodore, pindicator)

REM, I generally interpreted your rankings as a vote for your first choice. I don't think it affected anything but let us know if you're unhappy about that.

Seems we have a tie regarding map trading. For reference RTR 2.0.7.4 has map trading at writing. That's a little early in the game, I'd be happy to move our vote over to Banned to tie that up. (Also Mack voted 'allowed at paper', so he might want to change too).

We also have a tie regarding question 6 but both options are similar enough. I'll move our vote to d) since it's faster to tie that up.

Finally, question 7 is clearly in favour of d) but we also have the offer of a map from Xenu, which I'm sure will be at least level b). If enough people are ok with using this map then we can go ahead and get started. (I agree with GJ and would use Xenu's map). Otherwise we need to recruit someone to roll us a map - plako said he could do it if that was the level we're looking for?

So in summary:

Q1: Unit Trades/Gifts
b.) banned - 7

Q2: Map Trading
b.) Banned/Off

Q3: Espionage
b.) Active Missions Banned always

Meta Game Settings:
Q4: Mod
c.) RtR 2.0.7.4, (only significant changes from 2.0.7.1 are super Mercantalism, buffed Pro, and active spy missions disabled, but see the espionage setting below)

Q5: Diplo Rules
b.) AI Diplo ("signaling" allowed; still cannot communicate by renaming units or cities, spelling things out with city names in trades, etc)

Picks:
See Starts Before Picks: Yes
Q6: Civ/Leader Pick Method
d.) Single Draft - (we each get 3 random combos to choose from)

To Do:

-Weigh in regarding Xenu's map offer.

-A kindly lurker could roll us our 3 combo options each (though no need to decide until we see our starts).

-Start threads so said lurker doesn't have to use PM.

All ok - also I would have said no to map trading if I realised it was at writing in the mod we are using so all good. I'm happy to wait for a map too, and since the consensus is for light balancing then I guess it shouldn't be too arduous for a mapmaker...

[GermanJoey]

More than happy to wait for a map, as long as we have an actual mapmaker. Thanks for volunteering, Dr C.

[Serdoa]

Just as a question (and as I don't want to read all pages of this thread): Does the above post about map-settings really indicate that you want a random map that is not balanced? Or is it meant as "we are fine with that as well, but prefer more balance if it doesn't lead to just mirroring the positions"?

[OT4E]

Just as a question (and as I don't want to read all pages of this thread): Does the above post about map-settings really indicate that you want a random map that is not balanced? Or is it meant as "we are fine with that as well, but prefer more balance if it doesn't lead to just mirroring the positions"?

Half of the players stated clearly that they do not want to have map significantly reworked after generating, but the other half tends to some kind of balance. Their problem is just that there were 3 different options for balanced map and just one option for not-balanced.

For me I would never blame the mapmaker if the map was unbalanced by default, but I would definitely notice if the map was balanced wrong. And what I expect from mapmaker is to generate map several times and find the most playable setup, what to consider "playable" is fully mapmaker's discretion.

[Ruff_Hi]

Just an FYI and I am sure you know this ... but using the 'balance resources' option will remove marble from the map.

[GermanJoey]

Our discussion about "Balanced" has nothing to do with the "balance resources" option from the default mapscript generator.

OT4E, I will note that if we reduce the map options to just two: "Fairly balanced or better" and "Random script + eyeball check at most" then we have a fifty-fifty split, as surely those of us who voted for "Highly balanced' would prefer "Fairly balanced or better" more than a complete random mess.

So, please try to find a middle ground between these two ideas if you can please, Dr. C.

[Ceiliazul]

You've got a day before I can work on this if you want to revote with just two options.

My goal is to facilitate the game you fine gentlemen (?) would like to play, so a clear direction is preferred.

If not, ill do my best with direction given, which seems to indicate natural rolled map with no crippled starts and balanced-ish resources

[The Black Sword]

Yeah, I guess roll a few maps, choose the best one and then fix any glaring issues in as few strokes as possible...

Make sure the script has the luxury issues fixed if necessary.

A particular point of OT4E was that everyone should not have automatic access to things like horse and copper. Perhaps simply ensure that everyone has 1 copy of each strategic resource closer to them than any other player?

[Ceiliazul]

ensure that everyone has 1 copy of each strategic resource closer to them than any other player?

Since TBS was one of the "highly balanced" votes, im taking this change in position as a tie breaker for the map balance question. Thanks for being flexible Sword.