WW #43 - The Asha'man

[Fenn]

Don't hide behind me, my friend, we discarded that role. And after all, aren;t two doctors twice as good as one? I didn't make my decision on the likelihood of someone else picking doctor, I don't think that logic makes much sense.

But I agree that there are plenty of roles better than backup doctor.

Didn't mean to hide behind you, exactly; just trying to say that Prometheus's logic for voting me and not you was a little inconsistent.

[Lewwyn]

I'm scumhunting in earnest. Are you not scumhunting in earnest?

This feels like Lewwyn trying to split hairs with Dp101. "Oh, you mean you're only REGULUR scumhunting and not scumhunting IN EARNEST??? Doesn't sound very towny to me, tsk, tsk." C'mon. I've already noted other ways in which Lewwyn seems oddly reactive and trying to reach to pin things on people this game.

lol wut?

Situational awareness: It's very very early. DP is a new player, I have no previous experience with him. He posts a "review" I give him a bit of pressure to see how he reacts. He reacts fine. I don't vote for him.

The charitable assumption is that everyone is trying to scumhunt on Day 1, with the understanding that it's difficult to go very far with it until things develop (which they are starting to quite nicely now, it seems). Lewwyn didn't seem to be applying this principle of charity to Dp101, and seemed to be reaching to read something questionable into his comments.

The charitable assumption? You realize that you can't just sit and wait for a wolf to make a mistake. You actually have to ask pointed questions and put a little pressure on people? If I wasn't applying charity to DP I would have voted for him. I think its fairly obvious I just wanted to see how he'd react.

Psilly

[Lewwyn]

Just as a heads up, neither I nor Prometheus will be active before deadline tomorrow. I got roped into taking my nephews to an amusement park, and I'm taking Prometheus with me. We will likely be leaving at t-4h or so, though he might post some from his phone during the drive. I should be able to handle the resolution, though an actual fancy writeup will have to wait until later in the evening when I get back. I'm going to contact some people in the Lurker channel as a possible backup. Either way, you guys will be covered.

Me too. Deadline is 3am for me so I won't be on at any of the deadllines or from 3-4 hours earlier.

[Psillycyber]

The charitable assumption is that everyone is trying to scumhunt on Day 1, with the understanding that it's difficult to go very far with it until things develop (which they are starting to quite nicely now, it seems). Lewwyn didn't seem to be applying this principle of charity to Dp101, and seemed to be reaching to read something questionable into his comments.

The charitable assumption? You realize that you can't just sit and wait for a wolf to make a mistake. You actually have to ask pointed questions and put a little pressure on people? If I wasn't applying charity to DP I would have voted for him. I think its fairly obvious I just wanted to see how he'd react.

Psilly

What do you think I'm doing to you? Exactly that. Putting pressure on you. My, how jumpy you are!

[Lewwyn]

What do you think I'm doing to you? Exactly that. Putting pressure on you. My, how jumpy you are!

You keep you using that word, but I'm not sure you understand what it means.

[Psillycyber]

AdrienIer still isn't looking too good to me either. I'm still not satisfied with how he responded to Dp101's and Rowain's criticisms of his inconsistent preferences ("panache"? ), and in my brief time playing with him I've noticed that, when he doesn't have much to add for scumhunting (as he hasn't this game so far), he tends to fall back on prodding quasi-lurkers like Prometheus. I would think that a scum AdrienIer would make sure to avoid repeating that same strategy after doing it last game with Ryan, but hey, it worked out alright in the last game, right?

[Psillycyber]

I can understand that thought process, but I think what really twigs me is that you aren't just voting for people who made mafia discards, you specifically asked me how long its been in a separate post and then later come at me for that. That's less of the ordered approach you are describing and more of a targeted approach on me. So if you see me attacking the process it's because you it appears you aren't using the process as you described it. Rather than objective it feels like I was the primary target and the process was reverse engineered to lead to me.

This is what I'm talking about. Seems like quite a reach to argue that Jkaen was targeting you, Lewwyn, just because you were the first one with a claimed mafia-discard that he happened to prod about it. Why read so much into it? Why take it so personally? Others have affirmed already that it makes sense to take people's personalities and histories into account to guess what choices would have made sense for them. Jkaen wondering if it had been a while since you'd played scum was an entirely reasonable question.

Overall, here are my town leans at the moment: Jkaen, Dp101. Rowain I'm 50-50 on. Others I still don't have much of a read on. I'm still waiting and seeing on Gazglum. AdrienIer and Lewwyn lean scum.

[Lewwyn]

I can understand that thought process, but I think what really twigs me is that you aren't just voting for people who made mafia discards, you specifically asked me how long its been in a separate post and then later come at me for that. That's less of the ordered approach you are describing and more of a targeted approach on me. So if you see me attacking the process it's because you it appears you aren't using the process as you described it. Rather than objective it feels like I was the primary target and the process was reverse engineered to lead to me.

This is what I'm talking about. Seems like quite a reach to argue that Jkaen was targeting you, Lewwyn, just because you were the first one with a claimed mafia-discard that he happened to prod about it. Why read so much into it? Why take it so personally? Others have affirmed already that it makes sense to take people's personalities and histories into account to guess what choices would have made sense for them. Jkaen wondering if it had been a while since you'd played scum was an entirely reasonable question.

Let's see why would I imagine he was targeting me? Maybe because this question:

My anonymous discard was a mafia goon. Same as Meiz apparently. Welcome back to Werewolf Meiz!

Lewwyn, how recently have you played a werewolf?

wasn't asked to anyone else and it legit feels like a leading question which was then springboarded off into a vote. Felt pretty targeted. Honestly, to me it felt like theater. It felt like he had already made up his mind to vote for me but he asked that question to make a leaping off point for his vote. That's what I mean by a set up.

You keep saying I'm just the first one he prodded, but he hasn't really gone after anyone else for the same reason. Still feels targeted based off of personality assumptions.

Also I'm not sure you picked up on this but I didn't intend to just vote for Jkaen throughout the day? I thought I signaled that here:

I can understand Jkaen's reasoning, and I am slightly swayed by his clarifying on the order of thought versus how it appeared to me. I'm going to bed, I'm betting I'll wake up to double the posts to read and have new opinions about.

I had already decided to move my vote off Jkaen after his final explanation of his thought process.

I don't think I read too much into it, and I accept the validity of taking people's personalities into account. I took issue with the theater aspect of his question and vote. You however seem to be reading very deeply into my posts and have a real hard on for getting me lynched.

[Lewwyn]

Actually that makes me curious:

Current discard claims:

1. Prometheus - Vanilla Townie; ??????
2. AdrienIer - Hider; 1 shot vig
3. Jkaen - Hider; Vanilla Townie
4. Lewwyn - Vanilla Townie; Mafia Goon
5. Meiz - One-shot Vigilante; Mafia Goon
6. Psillycyber - One-shot Vigilante; Vanilla Townie
7. Dp101 - Mafia Lover; Hider
8. Zakalwe - One-shot Governor; Mafia Doctor
9. Gazglum - Doctor; One-shot Vigilante
10. Rowain - Vanilla Townie; One-shot Governor
11. Fenn - Backup Doctor; Enabler
12. Novice - Mafia Godfather; Vanilla Townie

Jkaen, you keep saying 5 people claimed scum discards. I only see three. Me Meiz and Zak. Novice and DP have not claimed scum discards, those have literally been displayed as having actually been discarded. They can't be lying about them. So in fact there are only 3 claimed scum discards. Hardly the 5 you kept talking about. Do you still feel that its anomalous?

[Prometheus1998_]

Psilly reads as somewhat anti-town to my limited experience, and most of the other players appear to agree. So, Psillycyber .

We'll have to disagree on Doctor's importance Prometheus. And if somebody given Doctor could discard it in good conscience, thinking that somebody else would pick Doctor, why couldn't I do the same? I'm not convinced there's an advantage to Town in having a Doctor + Backup Doc as opposed to a Doctor and any moderately good role that is active from the start.

Yeah, I get what you're saying Fenn. I was probably basing my suspicions on personal preference.